Outside air yes, living envelope air no. With my old OAK-less stove my wife would have to open a window to prevent the kitchen exhaust from sucking smoke out of the stove. When she forgot to open the window I got into trouble. Thus the OAK.
2016-17 Blaze King Performance Thread (Everything BK)
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Ashful
Minister of Fire
OAK is always better than no OAK, but you must live in a very small and/or tight house to have an issue like that. We can run multiple dryers, kitchen exhaust, and four bathroom exhaust fans, without any noticeable difference in stove draft.
I know, I used to spend hours bragging my BK up by documenting burns. That seems like way too much work now.
Heck I'm the original creator of the BK performance thread. 
Poindexter
Minister of Fire
@bigaar , i can only think of three reasons to install an oak.
1. competing draft. my next house will have a kitchen exhaust fan rather than a circulating fan in the range hood. clothes dryers can move enough air to compete, kitchen exhaust fans are the more common culprit.
2. tight enough construction to use an hrv. if you are building that tight an oak will save drawing all your combustion air through the filtration system, and make the house side of the system easier to balance.
3. prevailing wind and local topography.
For the first two i would put the oak in with the stove. if you are concerned about the third i would figure out where the oak will fit through the framing, run some burns and onmy install the oak if you need it.
4 actually, some local codes now require oak with new installs.
I have nevwr worked with foam insulation. from reading about it i would install the through floor pipe and spray around it for better final seal rather than soray, cure and cut.
I burn about 8 cords annually in my ashford 30.0. i am burning all spruce this year, 12 hour burns are easily achievable with a tightly stuffed firebix and moderate tstat setting.
I persoanlly would burn the hardwoods in shoulder season where the long coaling phase might get me 24 hour burns in mild weather.
In colder weather i prefer softwoods because they dont have a lengthy coal stage allowing me to refill the box with fresh wood and more dried up sap; keeps the btu output higher.
When i am running the stove hard and see a bed of coals getting bigger and bigger i know its time for softwoods.
1. competing draft. my next house will have a kitchen exhaust fan rather than a circulating fan in the range hood. clothes dryers can move enough air to compete, kitchen exhaust fans are the more common culprit.
2. tight enough construction to use an hrv. if you are building that tight an oak will save drawing all your combustion air through the filtration system, and make the house side of the system easier to balance.
3. prevailing wind and local topography.
For the first two i would put the oak in with the stove. if you are concerned about the third i would figure out where the oak will fit through the framing, run some burns and onmy install the oak if you need it.
4 actually, some local codes now require oak with new installs.
I have nevwr worked with foam insulation. from reading about it i would install the through floor pipe and spray around it for better final seal rather than soray, cure and cut.
I burn about 8 cords annually in my ashford 30.0. i am burning all spruce this year, 12 hour burns are easily achievable with a tightly stuffed firebix and moderate tstat setting.
I persoanlly would burn the hardwoods in shoulder season where the long coaling phase might get me 24 hour burns in mild weather.
In colder weather i prefer softwoods because they dont have a lengthy coal stage allowing me to refill the box with fresh wood and more dried up sap; keeps the btu output higher.
When i am running the stove hard and see a bed of coals getting bigger and bigger i know its time for softwoods.
HI, I am new to this page as well as burning. I am trying to figure out how to ask/post questions. Could you advise?
. He is now a believer. As is his wife..... Whew.
5. Without an OAK, you consume warm air from the house to feed the fire. The replacement air has to come from outside, leaks in through your doors, windows, etc. You end up with a net air current TOWARD the stove. It's much easier to end up with uneven room temperatures this way.
Also, you might end up bumping up the thermostat to compensate for the cool air drawn into the house. Thus, some people experience longer burn times with an OAK.
Poindexter
Minister of Fire
All true, but in older homes where mold is more likely to be an issue some air turnover is good and cord wood is much cheaper than mold abatement.
The guy that asked is at 37 degrees North latitude, and building new construction. I haven't lived that far south in a while but I bet his summer time AC needs match or possibly exceed his winter time heating requirements.
Ashful
Minister of Fire
Exactly. As an old house nut (I have lived in houses going back to the 1690's), you would not believe the troubles I have seen others have, when sealing up old construction with modern insulation. The builders around here have started to get wise to this, after some atrocious renovations over the last few decades.
If energy efficiency and heating costs are high on your list of concerns, please don't buy an old house.
mellow
Resident Stove Connoisseur
Have any of you guys played with your tstats much? Trying to figure out the difference in the one that is in my siracco 25 vs the princess and others.
When you guys set yours to low does the butterfly fully close? Even when the stove is cold?
When you guys set yours to low does the butterfly fully close? Even when the stove is cold?
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jetsam
Minister of Fire
It doesn't have an "off" setting on the Princess, but I am not sure that a load of kerosene soaked newspaper could overfire the thing. (Slight exaggeration maybe, but "Low" is very low.)
At the risk of going ignominiously down in history as the instigator of The Great Sticker War Of 2017- my thermostat sticker has 9 dots, so I call the lowest one 10% and the highest one 100%. I can't even maintain an active cat on the 10% setting with dry pine on a hot bed of coals. That's very little air!
Ashful
Minister of Fire
I hear mine click shut around the middle of the normal range, when I turn it down after my 20 minutes of high burn, after each reload. When it's cold, it clicks shut a little lower. I haven't measured the clock locations where I hear it click shut, but I'd guess around 4 o'clock when hot, 2 o'clock when cold.
mellow
Resident Stove Connoisseur
Do you guys have pictures of what your butterfly looks like at the lowest setting with the stove cold?
kennyp2339
Minister of Fire
Gforcefd
Member
Right now the stove pipe goes 45 off the stove adapter up 5 feet then 45 into the triple wall stainless Class A pipe. Class A Pipe is 17 feet I think. I can't deal with the smoke smell even if it isn't that much. I come from a family of super sniffers and it is giving me anxiety. I am either thinking of installing a OAK or changing the stove pipe so it goes stove pipe adapter up about 3 feet, 45, then 1 foot, then 45 into the chimney. Which do you think would net better draft results? Modifying the stove pipe also means the stove would have to move over to the left and out on the heart pad a bit more to clear that little beam in the picture behind the stove.
Highbeam
Minister of Fire
Lowest setting at any stove temp results in the stat completely slammed shut. Looks like any stat fully closed but remember mellow, all of our throttle blades have a decent sized hole punched into them.
When My stove is ice cold, the blade fully closes at 1 o'clock position. Any warmer and that close point moves to a higher setting.
The old daughter and I were watching the stat cycle last night. Black stove to orange coals and back to black stove over the course of an hour or so. Maybe 1.5. It's really very effective when working properly.
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mellow
Resident Stove Connoisseur
Interesting you say that after looking at this picture of a BK king tstat with no holes: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/stuck-thermostat-on-blaze-king-king.135566/#post-1819185
Ashful
Minister of Fire
I have a question along these lines; well...possibly along these lines. We have been running our new Princess insert for about a month now. It seems to be working great, I can run it all the way on low without it stalling, and it puts out good heat. The problem is how hot is too hot on the cat probe? I know most say to ignore it as long as it is in the active zone, ours goes way beyond the active zone.
In the picture, the needle made it to the "c" on .com before I turned it all the way to low. It had been running medium/low for over an hour when it started getting up this high. When cold, the needle is below the inactive zone.
Normal? What would happen if I left this on high? Using an IR thermometer a few inches to the right of the cat probe, I am hitting almost 800^F. This is under the louver/trim piece that sits on top.
The thermostat knob is secure, door and glass gaskets are tight. I am using mixed hardwood that is 16%-18%, fully loaded stove with 4"-6" splits. The bypass gasket is tight on 3 sides and only snug on the 3rd (dollar bill won't fall out on its own, but I can pull it out).
I am also seeing low burn times on a full load. ~14 hours overnight last night. 22ft insulated liner, 35^F outside, slight breeze. This is on low with the fan running on low.
What should I be looking for?
In the picture, the needle made it to the "c" on .com before I turned it all the way to low. It had been running medium/low for over an hour when it started getting up this high. When cold, the needle is below the inactive zone.
Normal? What would happen if I left this on high? Using an IR thermometer a few inches to the right of the cat probe, I am hitting almost 800^F. This is under the louver/trim piece that sits on top.
The thermostat knob is secure, door and glass gaskets are tight. I am using mixed hardwood that is 16%-18%, fully loaded stove with 4"-6" splits. The bypass gasket is tight on 3 sides and only snug on the 3rd (dollar bill won't fall out on its own, but I can pull it out).
I am also seeing low burn times on a full load. ~14 hours overnight last night. 22ft insulated liner, 35^F outside, slight breeze. This is on low with the fan running on low.
What should I be looking for?
jetsam
Minister of Fire
I've run my Princess insert hotter by accident without harming it, but that photo is hotter than I would run it in purpose.
If it gets too hot, and you need a lot of heat in the house fast, just turn up the fan. If you don't want the additional heat, turn down the thermostat.
In theory, if you left it on high, it would throttle down and not be damaged, but this assumes your thermostat is correctly calibrated and undamaged, and that your gaskets are good and tight.
If it gets too hot, and you need a lot of heat in the house fast, just turn up the fan. If you don't want the additional heat, turn down the thermostat.
In theory, if you left it on high, it would throttle down and not be damaged, but this assumes your thermostat is correctly calibrated and undamaged, and that your gaskets are good and tight.
This is the highest we have set the thermostat (other than the 20 minutes on high when lighting or reloading, then down to medium for a bit). My concern is the thermostat calibration. Gaskets are good. It just seems to be running really hot compared to where it is set. Even on low the needle will be a good 70% into the active zone.
Ashful
Minister of Fire
If I saw mine headed above the active region, I'd probably do my 20 minute "high burn" at less than maximum setting. Remember the intended goals of the high burn:
1. Burn off the creo crap that accumulates in the firebox during any prior long slow burn.
2. Bake any remaining moisture out of the wood, so the cat can easily stay active during the long slow burn.
You can do this at any setting that maintains strong flame show, without completely cooking your cat at 2000F. I'd find the setting that keeps the cat in the middle of the active region, and if that setting has strong flame show, I'd just do the 20 minute "high burn" there, at least until your cat reaches sufficient maturity to not go nuclear.
1. Burn off the creo crap that accumulates in the firebox during any prior long slow burn.
2. Bake any remaining moisture out of the wood, so the cat can easily stay active during the long slow burn.
You can do this at any setting that maintains strong flame show, without completely cooking your cat at 2000F. I'd find the setting that keeps the cat in the middle of the active region, and if that setting has strong flame show, I'd just do the 20 minute "high burn" there, at least until your cat reaches sufficient maturity to not go nuclear.
The cat probe picture above is well after the initial high burn and there are no flames in the fire box. It was at that thermostat setting for about an hour when I noticed how high the cat probe was.
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