Lack of secondaries in castine

It is hard to get the secondaries burning on it. I have a Castine 400 as well, but you have to get that thing hot, scrape away the ashes from the front air vent, and get the new wood pile high--close to the secondary tubes. Also, I am convinced that it needs uber-dry wood. 10% as I am still seeing the sooting/clouding of the door glass. Starting the fire requires plenty of kindling, and being willing to open the door about 30 minutes in to the burn to add more meaty wood. I have found that a full super cedar helps a great deal, and three or maybe four pieces of oak is when you will get the edges of the stove up to about 570-600. The center on mine always runs hotter than the edges--by about 50-75*.

That said, I am still figuring mine out as well. Some days, I do as I have just written and it works like a champ, others, it seems like I have water logged stuff that will not burn well. It is not water logged oak, but it does have a moisture reading of about 15-18%.

Maybe other old pros with the Castine will join the conversation.

Could it be the weather? Yesterday I had a hard time getting my stove to burn as it good as it usually does then I noticed the hazy foggy weather so I just burned hotter to help the draft.

I'd hazard to guess it is the outside temps that are hampering your draw Backwoods. You sound like you are doing everything else you can and should do.

As to optimum MC for the Castine....I got jumped by some non-Castine burners not too long ago when I made the observation that this stove really likes fuel in the 10% range. (There was also some misunderstanding of terms too....my 10% is an outside reading, and I'm sure G6's are too. Helps to be specific about that, I found.) I've got a straight-shot Class A set-up, and draw has never been an issue, BUT...in the warmer temps we've had (For Chrissakes, we had thunderstorms and tornadoes last night!) this season, the performance can be sluggish. Are you abnormally warm up there as well Backwoods?

I agree sometimes my stove is sluggish under certain weather conditions. I have noticed when it is mild outside the stove has a tough time getting going and the secondary's are sluggish. But when it is is colder out it runs better which i have not seen all that bad cold weather this winter seen some and when that happened things improved.

ploughboy said:

As to optimum MC for the Castine....I got jumped by some non-Castine burners not too long ago when I made the observation that this stove really likes fuel in the 10% range. (There was also some misunderstanding of terms too....my 10% is an outside reading

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Lol.. no one jumped you, ploughboy. You're moisture comment was just way off. You will never get an accurate reading of moisture from the outside of a split... its got to be resplit or else you're wasting your time. Although I dont have a Castine, I burn my brother's all the time. His wood is no where near 10% and Ive never had a problem getting the secondaries going. If you keep telling the new folk their wood needs to be 10%, you will just keep giving them innacurate information (measuring the outside is just gonna confuse them too). All the EPA stoves like dry wood, but if I wanted my oak to get to 10%, Id prob have to season it for over a decade. Id be interested in knowing the measure from the middle of your splits, then you can tell people the true reading. Also, what type of wood are you burning?

Logger...it is six of one, half-dozen of the other to me. If you know what the outside reading needs to be to burn well in your stove, err, why would you split it to find out what it is inside? Sounds like a lot of extra work to me! The outside moisture reading is going to lower than the inside, sure, but the spread between the numbers is always going to be fairly consistent if the size of your split is, and the species of tree is too. (Mine correlates to about a 15% inside MC, + or -, BTW) I think it is just important, as i realized too, to define your terms when discussing this, so I'm now quick to say I'm referring to an ouside MC, not inside.

And let's not even go to the subject of what an ouside MC of 10% and a 15% inside MC REALLY is, in terms of through-and-through moisture, shall we? That would be on the only "true" MC reading, in my opinion

Right now I'm burning red oak. It was green last April. It ain't no more!

BeGreen, yup, true in WA (I was born there....because I wanted to be close to my mother, budda-bump...). Here in the Heart of Dixie, it is not a stretch. The burn season typically starts in late Oct. Green oak cut in early Spring is easily seasoned by then, if cut, split and stacked properly with plenty of air circulation. I don't split them down to toothpicks either, just medium splits will do. Nah....don't need a second opinion. This wood is kicking tail right now, burning plenty hot, plenty long, and good and clean. Like it always does. Proof is in the puddin', as they say. What is goes to show is the "2 years, cut, split and stacked " mantra is the gospel in most lattitudes and climates, but not for all. As a rule of thumb, it is good advice. In the South and South West, it ain't necessarily so.

I do not use my ash pan and scoop ash from the firebox every 4-5 loads. I reke the coals to the front and sometimes create a channel at the intake which seems to work for me. I also use smaller splits and that seems to aid in keeping the stove rolling.

ploughboy said:

Logger...it is six of one, half-dozen of the other to me. If you know what the outside reading needs to be to burn well in your stove, err, why would you split it to find out what it is inside? Sounds like a lot of extra work to me! The outside moisture reading is going to lower than the inside, sure, but the spread between the numbers is always going to be fairly consistent if the size of your split is, and the species of tree is too. (Mine correlates to about a 15% inside MC, + or -, BTW) I think it is just important, as i realized too, to define your terms when discussing this, so I'm now quick to say I'm referring to an ouside MC, not inside.

And let's not even go to the subject of what an ouside MC of 10% and a 15% inside MC REALLY is, in terms of through-and-through moisture, shall we? That would be on the only "true" MC reading, in my opinion

Right now I'm burning red oak. It was green last April. It ain't no more!

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i agree 100 % with your moisture rationale,around here ,people can be a little one dimensional in their thinking(this is how it is and thats all there is to it kind of mentality) god forbid you mention face cord(what is that,that doesn,t count ,its not real bla bla bla)but the use of a wheel barrow load is common (now thats gotta be accurate) and nobody gets riled up over it...go figure

Backwoods said:

Will be firing up the stove momentarily, we will see. I did a thorough cleaning, except the chimney. Everything looked okay. In this castine, where exactly does the air come in at? While inspecting it.... I only can see openings at both sides. I thought it would have been in the front below the ceramic window.


Update: all seems to be well. I actually started a top down fire, and the stove is showing signs of secondaries, with a few here and there, but again I just started the stove. I think I may have answered my own question. There was so much ash and stuff possibly blocking the majority of air. Heres a pix:

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Backwoods, I have the same stove, older though (10 yrs) with a split front door. Anyhow, my experience is the same as what BeGreen mentioned above... keeping the wood arranged in a way that allows air to get in underneath the bottom. From your pic, it looks like there's not much of a path for the primary air to come down the front and circulate down under the pile?

When I do that, I have no problem running the stove 400-500F with the air lever almost shut, even in the mild damp weather that we're having here in eastern PA.

+1 pmac.....When I make a cold start, or have warmer temps outside, I usually put a couple of short scrap 2 X 4's, loaded N/S to hold up the ends of my longer E/W splits. That really will get 'er going quickly. Sometimes when things are getting off to a sluggish start when I haven't loaded that way, I'll lift up one end of my E/W splits with my poker and slip the 2x4 block under just one end....same result.

Ploughboy, those 2x4s are helping any marginal oak. Sure you can see faster drying times in various latitues. But im betting if you stuck a few loads of it away for a year or more you wouldnt be saying the same.
Burned it wet burned it dry, no subsitute for the later but time. The time can also be affected by species, water oak, pin oak, white oak, black oak red oak, all dry differently.
Im not deep south, but we do have an advantage over the boys far up north for sure.

Stump...not marginal at all, and of course I've burned plenty over the years that has been off the stump, much, much longer.....doesn't make an appreciable difference that I can see, once you reach a certain point. Wood reaches a stasis with average humidity that you rarely can improve on, unless you get an exceptionally dry and hot year or you want to stick it in a kiln. Right now my oak is several points below what Jotul recommends, whether you are measuiring inside, outside, or an average of the two readings. Hickory takes a little longer, but the volatility of the sap seems to make up the difference. Longleaf Pine? Fuggedaboudit. After four months it will melt your top plate without much effort!

Too, an increase in draft (that the 2x4 blocking is helping) will help ANY wood burn better, naturally, and it is no reflection on the wood I'm burning, I just get impatient sometimes and want to goose it a tad.

Just curious....have you ever lived through an Alabama Summer. ;-) If you had, you wouldn't wonder at the results I'm confirming. I've lived in central MD, Carroll County, and know the seasons pretty well in that area. Consider what 900 miles of lattitude difference will make in your ability to season. It is pretty substantial. When you are still wet and cold, or turning wet and cold, we are still cookin'! Takes the starch out of a body, for sure. Wish I could combine Northern average temps with Southern curing speeds....I'd really have something then.

roddy said:

ploughboy said:

Logger...it is six of one, half-dozen of the other to me. If you know what the outside reading needs to be to burn well in your stove, err, why would you split it to find out what it is inside? Sounds like a lot of extra work to me! The outside moisture reading is going to lower than the inside, sure, but the spread between the numbers is always going to be fairly consistent if the size of your split is, and the species of tree is too. (Mine correlates to about a 15% inside MC, + or -, BTW) I think it is just important, as i realized too, to define your terms when discussing this, so I'm now quick to say I'm referring to an ouside MC, not inside.

And let's not even go to the subject of what an ouside MC of 10% and a 15% inside MC REALLY is, in terms of through-and-through moisture, shall we? That would be on the only "true" MC reading, in my opinion

Right now I'm burning red oak. It was green last April. It ain't no more!

Click to expand...

i agree 100 % with your moisture rationale,around here ,people can be a little one dimensional in their thinking(this is how it is and thats all there is to it kind of mentality) god forbid you mention face cord(what is that,that doesn,t count ,its not real bla bla bla)but the use of a wheel barrow load is common (now thats gotta be accurate) and nobody gets riled up over it...go figure

Click to expand...

Whats one dimensional about advising splitting wood before taking a moisture reading? Thats what most on these boards do and I was always under the impression that thats how its done accurately. Not trying to open a can of worms with you, but thats the way to get a more precise reading than measuring the outside of the wood, especially if you're asking others on the board about moisture and comparing. If you know your wood, you probably dont measure it much anyway. You can do this anyway you want, but when trying to help others on this board, I thought splitting it was the norm.
Anyway, 'nuff said about the moisture topic for now.

barnuba said:

I reke the coals to the front and sometimes create a channel at the intake which seems to work for me.

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Ahh.. this is what many around here refer to as "the tunnel of love." Works good in the Oslo and Castine, especially after a few days of ash build-up. Clear the doghouse area of ash, then clear a thin channel from the doghouse to the back of stove. Air then gets to roll under the splits and get a good fire going. I find myself using this method most often and the channel even lasts for a few loads.

Gonna have to try that Logger....

Oh, and I'm going to start a thread, the title of which will be, "My wood is so dry....(HOW DRY IS IT?) and yours sucks!"

My wood is so dry, that when I touch it barehanded, I have to moisturize for two days....

My wood is so dry, that when I want to drain my pool, I just throw in a couple of splits and wait an hour.....

My wood is so dry, I get subsidence around my foundation if I stack it too close to the house......

My wood is so dry, I use off-cuts to dehumidify my entire basement....

My wood is so dry.....

Having the same issue, when I got home tonight I took all inside pipe down, cleaned it and class A chimney. It wasn't that bad, gotta be the outside temps; I'm at the min. chimney height, just short of 16'.

Jim

I don't have the manual in fron of me rijim, but my recall is that the minimum on the Castine is 14' AND (something I believe to be true) that measurement is taken from the bottom of the firebox, not at the connector outlet. I've got about 15', by that measurement, and it could suck the chrome off a bumper hitch. Yeah, outside temps definitely might be messing with you.