Hard to say, I had one load this weekend that would not build cat temps like all of the other loads. Had to play opening the air to get it to finally take off. Every other load cat would rise nicely, I'd close the air down the cat would drop then rise again and cruise nicely. Same wood well seasoned mixed with a bunch of locust in it. I've kept the stove hot the last few days as temps dropped into the 20's at night, high 30's low 40's during the day.
2023/24 VC Temperature discussion thread
- Thread starter Woodsplitter67
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For people with digital meters, what’s the ideal cruising temp for the cat meter? I have the encore 2040 cat for reference
AsylumResident
Feeling the Heat
I believe they say it lights off around 600 degrees and usually a temp of 900 to 1200 is acceptable or ideal. However, the best thing to do is see what the smoke looks like coming out of your chimney at different temps. You don't really want to see smoke. I know some people that are burning pretty clean 800-900 cat temp. I will see smoke until my cat hits about 1100. For me, I like to see cat temps 1000-1200.
Under 1600! Seriously if you look at the graphs that have been posted you'll see the temperature will fluctuate. I can see my meter from where I'm sitting right now and it's 1315 and I'm happy. It was rising with 1/2 box of wood and about 1/2 open air and when it hit 1400 I shut the air control and it's been in the 1300's happily cruising.
Thanks for the feedback. 1000-1200 is my goal for the cat. It’s smoke free in that range for me. Alarm is set for 1400 so I have time to react. 550 for the STT. The Auber meters, especially for the cat are 100% worth it in my opinion. You get instant feedback when adjusting the primary air for the cat temps.
I have an external bimetal gauge about 18 inches up my flue which is a single wall. Those temps are completely reasonable when burning damper down.
I have an external bimetal gauge about 18 inches up my flue which is a single wall. Those temps are completely reasonable when burning damper down.
I have what feels like a dumb question but here goes. If I ran a fan across the top of the stove top would I get false readings from gauges?
I have the magnetic Auber one (two separate meters) along with a traditional bimetal one in the middle of griddle next to each other.
I tested and it brings the surface temps down noticeably and it moves heat away from the stove to the colder area of my house. It sounds silly when I write it but no point in worrying about looking dumb. I also don’t want to so something detrimental to the stove or process.
I have the magnetic Auber one (two separate meters) along with a traditional bimetal one in the middle of griddle next to each other.
I tested and it brings the surface temps down noticeably and it moves heat away from the stove to the colder area of my house. It sounds silly when I write it but no point in worrying about looking dumb. I also don’t want to so something detrimental to the stove or process.
Funny how we have similar issues at the same time..... weird.
I had a couple loads this weekend that really struggled to get cat above 750, even with full air. At first I though teat was the smaller loads but I did some 3/4 loads and had the same issue (mostly oak, little ash). I was getting really hot STT (600+) for the 20- 40% air setting and cat would not rise above 750. I tried opening the air up and all I got was an increase in STT. Very weird. The last few days it has been fine, cat climbs to 1000, reduce air slowly and it eventually climbs to 1400 - 1600.
Fan on the stove top:
- I run a Peltier fan blowing across the stove top, probably explains why I have slightly lower STT.
- Certainly running air across the stove top will reduce surface temps you are measuring.
- I do not think it matters all that much. You should be adjusting your operating temps to whatever works well for your setup anyway.
- It will not affect you cat or flue temps so no concern there.
- I do not see any way a fan could damage your stove. I have been running one for many years....
Thanks so much for the feedback.
I’ve definitely noticed the size and type of fuel really matters too. Have to plan each load of fuel and time it correctly too. My anxiety is going down as my curiosity increases. I’d used my old stove for over a decade so you settle into your ways. This stove is much more efficient and that’s really starting to show.
I’ve definitely noticed the size and type of fuel really matters too. Have to plan each load of fuel and time it correctly too. My anxiety is going down as my curiosity increases. I’d used my old stove for over a decade so you settle into your ways. This stove is much more efficient and that’s really starting to show.
Lost my damn cat thermocouple last night. Just quit working. It was in there for 3-5 years so I guess I won't complain.
New one on order from Amazon, 1/16" dia Inconel sheath, $40
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08746YM53?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1
New one on order from Amazon, 1/16" dia Inconel sheath, $40
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B08746YM53?ref=ppx_yo2ov_dt_b_product_details&th=1
AsylumResident
Feeling the Heat
AsylumResident
Feeling the Heat
I see that it's flexible. Is the new plan to wrap the thermocouple around the cat to keep it together and hopefully get more life out of the cat? Let me know how it goes😆
No, not long enough.... but you made me laugh.
I just realized the Auber probes are 4mm (5/32") I am using 1/16" dia. The smaller dia probe gives faster response time but at the cost of life.
The Auber probe might just last forever....
AsylumResident
Feeling the Heat
I don't have much of a delay in response from my Auber probes. If that is in fact the case, to me the longer life would be well worth any slight delay there may be.
A thicker walled probe will give you slower response, it is a function of thermal mass of the probe and conduction through the thicker wall.
Do we need faster response times in this application? Probably not, so I do not disagree with your conclusion.
I think my failed TC was SS (it was one I had laying around) and that likely contributed to shorten life. 1600F is pushing it for SS.....
An Inconel sheath should last even longer, maybe long enough even with the smaller diameter. I'll let you know in 5 years..... hahaha
In any case, a 5/32 Inconel probe should last a lot longer than a 1/16" SS probe, no debate there.
We are really getting into the finer points here, what we need to do is figure out how to burn ash......
I got 1.5 years out of mine. I think it was just a chitty one. Actually kind of a pain in the ass when it happens. Felt like I was flying blind
This is an example of things you could miss with a thicker probe.... I did not get any smoke in the house but it was surging, I could hear it and see the flames repeatedly igniting in the firebox.
Started stepping air down at 1000 and was full closed at 6:15 (1200) and it continued to climb. Mix of ash and oak, 3/4 load.
Soooo tired of this.....
Started stepping air down at 1000 and was full closed at 6:15 (1200) and it continued to climb. Mix of ash and oak, 3/4 load.
Soooo tired of this.....
Was it the Auber one?
For sure burning without it is unnerving. I actually did not burn overnight till I got the replacement in.... next day from Amazon. Hard to believe I ran for a couple years with only a magnetic STT reading.... ignorance is bliss.
Megunticook
Member
I just replaced my Condar probe and got my digital thermometer working again. I got about 6 years or so. After replacing I noticed the wires both detached from inside the probe after a gentle tug. Must be the Achilles heel after so many cold-hot-cold cycles.
Like knowing the cat temp. but am perfectly comfortable burning with just STT.
Like knowing the cat temp. but am perfectly comfortable burning with just STT.
Orange is stove top I assume? That’s hot for sure. Looks like an hour plus where it feels scary.
I don’t like when I’m air closed 100% and I’ve got no options left. I hit 1525 on the cat yesterday with at best 3/4 load and air cut 100%. I started dialing the air back at 1000.
My stove has been calm and controllable. Loaded last night at 10PM on a large load of coals, cat was high 800's. loaded the box and cut the air back pretty quickly and it just behaved itself. Woke this morning, cat was in the high 500's, and flipped the air wide open while I got coffee. Pretty surprised at the amount of wood left after 10 hrs, 25 outside house in the mid 60's. I let it go with wide open air and the cat went to 1320 and then slowly dropped into the 900's. I cut the air back a little and let it go for another 2+ hrs. Reloaded a few splits and let it go wide open and it rose nicely and just cruised, I cut the air back a little to keep STT under 600. I'll let it burn out as today should be warmer and low of 40's tonight, might relight for overnight and I have plenty of wood.
Orange is flue gas temp. Grey is STT, but it is reading a bit low.
I agree air full closed and cat at 1650.... not many options left....
- Open the damper
- Block the secondary inlet
- Get a Blaze King
Ok good to know it wasn’t the STT. I made a secondary intake plate with 6 neodymium magnets that I have ready to go if I run out of options. And I understand your sentiment about a different stove. My wife will not use this new one at all and uses an electric blanket or the gas stove instead if I’m not home.
She’d like to take a loss on the stove and sell it used before next winter. She asked about running it without the catalyst but the owners manual explicitly says not to. At that point I’m on her side and would get a different unit and run it as designed. I’m in a few hundred between probes, meters, and a camera to look at the probes and meters. Ha!
Neo's will not last too long, they can't handle the heat, they will demag eventually (I know first hand).
However the old alnicos will take the heat, I use them all the time, all over the stove. Even on the stove top.
I hear you about trying to get to payback.... I have enough years in now where the stove has paid for itself.
You manual says you have to run with the cat in? I guess you do not have one of the 2n1's? Not that it matters, running without the catalyst is kind of silly.... but in a pinch.
Good information about the magnets. I’ll get better ones. The manual says not to run the stove “in a manner inconsistent with the operating instructions in this manual.” It’s designed to be used with the catalyst per the instructions so that’s what I do.
I imagine when the cat eventually fails most people run it without or poorly functioning for a time? How else do you know to replace it outside of inspecting it and checking for smoke exiting the chimney?
Which meter are you using @arnermd? I love seeing the data over time. Does it sync to your mobile and if so can you set warnings to notify you of temps?
I imagine when the cat eventually fails most people run it without or poorly functioning for a time? How else do you know to replace it outside of inspecting it and checking for smoke exiting the chimney?
Which meter are you using @arnermd? I love seeing the data over time. Does it sync to your mobile and if so can you set warnings to notify you of temps?
@skb31 Which stove do you have? I've never gotten a clear answer on secondary air but it appears to me the secondary air control on my stove opens to help prevent overheating. My stove is older but I burn and don't engage the cat at times and my wife does it that way whenever she reloads or starts a fire. It's just an old fashioned stove with no baffle if I don't engage the cat. I'm sure I could remove the cat and flip the damper, might heat the stove better forcing the flame through the chamber.
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