Am i expecting to much from a 49-TRCPM

[nhredbird]

70-bags of Green Supremes. Started Oct 8th. This is our 1st pellet stove Englander 49-trcpm.
I,ve been changing the lower 3-buttons alot trying to get the most out of it.
Last night was 11 degrees stove was 7-7 and lower buttons at 4-3-1.
Had trouble keeping house stat above 65 degrees, which its set at.
The stove is in the middle of the house, 1st floor in a room with 16’-0" ceiling.
All the rooms are off that room.
61’ x 32’ Total 3100 sq. ft.
3" exhaust, 45 degree off stove, 12" thru house to a tee outside & straight up 12'-0" to exhaust cap.
OAK is hooked up.
Room air Temp at 135-145 degrees, probe 1/2" away from stove.
Listening to others here i am thinking of changing brands of pellets?

 

[Eatonpcat]

Don't know anything about your stove, But for me, I don't like the way Green Supremes burn in my stove. I would try to find some different pellet choices.

 

[mithesaint]

My 10 cpm (same stove, different name) is usually set at 3-5-1, depending on the pellet I'm burning. Sometimes I have to drop back to 2-5-1 if the pellet burns slower.

I've never burned Green Supremes, but it's always worth trying another pellet. 3100 sq ft is a lot for this stove. It's only rated for 2200 IIRC.

 

[smoke show]

70-bags of Green Supremes. Started Oct 8th. This is our 1st pellet stove Englander 49-trcpm.
I,ve been changing the lower 3-buttons alot trying to get the most out of it.
Last night was 11 degrees stove was 7-7 and lower buttons at 4-3-1.
Had trouble keeping house stat above 65 degrees, which its set at.
The stove is in the middle of the house, 1st floor in a room with 16’-0" ceiling.
All the rooms are off that room.
61’ x 32’ Total 3100 sq. ft.
3" exhaust, 45 degree off stove, 12" thru house to a tee outside & straight up 12'-0" to exhaust cap.
OAK is hooked up.
Room air Temp at 135-145 degrees, probe 1/2" away from stove.
Listening to others here i am thinking of changing brands of pellets?

EVL may be at marginal length.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

The house you have has a two story high room in it from the description you are giving.

You are trying to heat some 31,232 cubic feet of air and distribute it with a blower that might do 250 CFM max, likely less (I haven't checked for your stove). At 250 CFM it would take about 124 minutes to move that amount of air through the heat exchanger.

You also might want to consider running your convection blower higher than the firing rate that should extract a bit more heat from the stove.

How tight is your house? Air leaks make it very difficult to heat large places (any place for that matter).

 

[nhredbird]

Thanks for some quick replies.
The house is only 7-years young.
I,ve had an isulation company come in and check.
They could of sold me something, but liked what they saw.
I have closed off some rooms when not in use to help.
Seems the air temp coming out could be hotter?
I was trying to turn the feed up and air down, so heat didn't leave up the stack?(stock from factory was 1-4-1)
I,m at 4-3-1, tonight i,ll try 3-5-1. Try to over come the EVL?

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Thanks for some quick replies.
The house is only 7-years young.
I,ve had an isulation company come in and check.
They could of sold me something, but liked what they saw.
I have closed off some rooms when not in use to help.
Seems the air temp coming out could be hotter?
I was trying to turn the feed up and air down, so heat didn't leave up the stack?(stock from factory was 1-4-1)
I,m at 4-3-1, tonight i,ll try 3-5-1. Try to over come the EVL?

So they pressurized the house to do a leakage test?

 

[jdempsey]

You are not gonna be able to heat that big of an area, and with the addition of ceilings being that high. Are you trying to heat the whole 3000 sq ft? What does the temps get to in the room with the stove.

My house is about 1900 sq ft . 900 in the basement and 1000 up stairs. My stove same as yours heats well. I do have it ducted. but if i could get the heat to circulate to the upstairs i think it would have no issues without the duct just very hard to do from my basement.

I have to agree the temps of the blower on my 10 cpm seems as though it should blow air that is a bit hotter. Comparable to what some other people with diff stoves are getting. I like my unit and im happy i have it. You may need to tightening up the house as suggested and maybe checkout some pellet furnaces to effectively heat that much area.

 

[nhredbird]

Yes pressure test and therm. imaging. (3-yrs ago)
I found out there are only 3-bath fans, 2-recessed lights and the 2nd floor heatcooling duct registers for ceiling penatrations.
No plumbing in outside walls. (except 2-sill-cocks)
6" walls R-19 Ceilings and attic R-30.
Windows low-e thermo-pane Rivco town and country all vinyl.
90+ propane furnace, has OAK.
We enter mostly thru the attached garage.
I think your estimate for volume vs sq. ft is what might be right.
We have a cathedral ceiling in the 1st floor master br as well.
Would ceiling fan on low help?
Thought of having another stove, but unfinished basement is the only spot?
Mostly looking what others, with same stove have thiers set at?

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Yes pressure test and therm. imaging. (3-yrs ago)
I found out there are only 3-bath fans, 2-recessed lights and the 2nd floor heatcooling duct registers for ceiling penatrations.
No plumbing in outside walls. (except 2-sill-cocks)
6" walls R-19 Ceilings and attic R-30.
Windows low-e thermo-pane Rivco town and country all vinyl.
90+ propane furnace, has OAK.
We enter mostly thru the attached garage.
I think your estimate for volume vs sq. ft is what might be right.
We have a cathedral ceiling in the 1st floor master br as well.
Would ceiling fan on low help?
Thought of having another stove, but unfinished basement is the only spot?
Mostly looking what others, with same stove have thiers set at?

Was that 90+ propane furnace just for heat or both heat and hot water?

I'm hesitant to suggest using the fans unless they are slow moving ones and they are not in position to interfere with rather than help the stove.

 

[mascoma]

save the hassle, it's not your pellets.

You have it right in your title, your expecting too much.
Manufacturer says it will heat 2200sqft, you have 30% more sqft, add in the 16' ceilings and it's never gonna keep up.

 

[DexterDay]

70-bags of Green Supremes. Started Oct 8th. This is our 1st pellet stove Englander 49-trcpm.
I,ve been changing the lower 3-buttons alot trying to get the most out of it.
Last night was 11 degrees stove was 7-7 and lower buttons at 4-3-1.
Had trouble keeping house stat above 65 degrees, which its set at.
The stove is in the middle of the house, 1st floor in a room with 16’-0" ceiling.
All the rooms are off that room.
61’ x 32’ Total 3100 sq. ft.
3" exhaust, 45 degree off stove, 12" thru house to a tee outside & straight up 12'-0" to exhaust cap.
OAK is hooked up.
Room air Temp at 135-145 degrees, probe 1/2" away from stove.
Listening to others here i am thinking of changing brands of pellets?

EVL may be at marginal length.

I got 14.5 EVL. Thats right on the verge of 3" vent. I would try another Pellet. As Eatonpcat said, Green Surpremes are not tue Best. They burn clean in my Quad and Furnace. Just lower heat output, than say Somersets.

Try running the ceiling fan on Low and in Reverse (draw air up).. This will help a little in the stove room.

 

[smoke show]

I got 14.5 EVL. Thats right on the verge of 3" vent.

I did too. But I was wondering if theres another 90 at the top of the vertical before the cap.

Probly insignificant. Just sayin.

 

[nhredbird]

Furnace is forced hot air 90+, Water heater is only 80+
The ceiling fan is only a 3-speed 54" in the stove rm. and master br on 1st fl.
There is no elbow on top of stack. (vertical termination top)
Set the stove to 3-5-1 and 6-8 tonight. Its 37 degrees outside and stove is 140 air temp into rm.
We'll see how it does tonight, its not going to get to 11 like last night.
Have the ceiling fan on low blowing down. Might get a ladder and set on reverse this weekend.
The flame is half to 3 to the top plate? How high should it get?

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Ok would you kindly post the firing rate information on your propane furnace, since it is for heat only I won't have to use a wonky factor to carve out the water heating part from the normal heat loss handling and temperature recovery time considerations when they sized the furnace.

Also something to consider is the recommended R values for your area. While R19 and R30 may be required by the building code it may be on the minimum side.

Mascoma,

What a stove can actually heat depends upon the actual house it is in. It is all heat loss related. That only has a loose relation to square footage and thus one should never use any of the square footage figures to determine if a stove will heat their place.

Likely that is what we are going to discover when we back into the heat loss the house's heating system was designed for.

To anyone who happens to drop on by this thread the figures that count are the BTU output of the stove and the heat loss of the building. If the heat loss of the building is more than the BTU output of the stove the stove will not be able to maintain the temperature of the building it will in fact drop in the building until the heat loss is exactly equal to the stoves BTU output. Heat loss is proportional to the difference in the temperature inside the building and the temperature outside the building, if the temperature difference doubles so does the heat loss.

 

[nhredbird]

Well last night was warmer outside, so heat never bumped on.
But stove temp on new setting didn't do as well. Burned less fuel, but not as hot.
I,ll try 3-4-1 & 6-6 tonight.
The house is large and lots of glass.
Thats why i went to the stove, it is helping alot.
More experimenting with settings may help & differant pellets?

 

[mascoma]

Ok would you kindly post the firing rate information on your propane furnace, since it is for heat only I won't have to use a wonky factor to carve out the water heating part from the normal heat loss handling and temperature recovery time considerations when they sized the furnace.

Also something to consider is the recommended R values for your area. While R19 and R30 may be required by the building code it may be on the minimum side.

Mascoma,

What a stove can actually heat depends upon the actual house it is in. It is all heat loss related. That only has a loose relation to square footage and thus one should never use any of the square footage figures to determine if a stove will heat their place.

Likely that is what we are going to discover when we back into the heat loss the house's heating system was designed for.

To anyone who happens to drop on by this thread the figures that count are the BTU output of the stove and the heat loss of the building. If the heat loss of the building is more than the BTU output of the stove the stove will not be able to maintain the temperature of the building it will in fact drop in the building until the heat loss is exactly equal to the stoves BTU output. Heat loss is proportional to the difference in the temperature inside the building and the temperature outside the building, if the temperature difference doubles so does the heat loss.

calculate all you want... I've always found whenever a manufacturer or sales person says a product can do X, that X is under ideal conditions.
Now add the house full of windows he just mentioned to the 16' ceilings and he ain't going to heat the house just with that stove... but keep calculating.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Ok would you kindly post the firing rate information on your propane furnace, since it is for heat only I won't have to use a wonky factor to carve out the water heating part from the normal heat loss handling and temperature recovery time considerations when they sized the furnace.

Also something to consider is the recommended R values for your area. While R19 and R30 may be required by the building code it may be on the minimum side.

Mascoma,

What a stove can actually heat depends upon the actual house it is in. It is all heat loss related. That only has a loose relation to square footage and thus one should never use any of the square footage figures to determine if a stove will heat their place.

Likely that is what we are going to discover when we back into the heat loss the house's heating system was designed for.

To anyone who happens to drop on by this thread the figures that count are the BTU output of the stove and the heat loss of the building. If the heat loss of the building is more than the BTU output of the stove the stove will not be able to maintain the temperature of the building it will in fact drop in the building until the heat loss is exactly equal to the stoves BTU output. Heat loss is proportional to the difference in the temperature inside the building and the temperature outside the building, if the temperature difference doubles so does the heat loss.

calculate all you want... I've always found whenever a manufacturer or sales person says a product can do X, that X is under ideal conditions.
Now add the house full of windows he just mentioned to the 16' ceilings and he ain't going to heat the house just with that stove... but keep calculating.

Well the OP hasn't told us the firing rate of the furnace.

I also do not trust any sales person, however I know what I am looking for.

 

[nhredbird]

OK while i was down in the basement grabbing another bag of pellets.
Furnace Model#RGRA-10EZAJS
105,000 BTU with 3/4 HP 4-speed blower
Blower cfm @ .1 ESP
Low - 1155
M-low - 1490
M-Hi - 1710
Hi - 2010
2-zones of duct 1-for 1st fl. other for 2nd fl.
Honeywell-ZD zone dampers with an April-aire command center
Robertshaw t-stats-progamable
April-aire 400 Humidifier
4-ton AC -coil & condenser

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

OK while i was down in the basement grabbing another bag of pellets.
Furnace Model#RGRA-10EZAJS
105,000 BTU with 3/4 HP 4-speed blower
Blower cfm @ .1 ESP
Low - 1155
M-low - 1490
M-Hi - 1710
Hi - 2010
2-zones of duct 1-for 1st fl. other for 2nd fl.
Honeywell-ZD zone dampers with an April-aire command center
Robertshaw t-stats-progamable
April-aire 400 Humidifier
4-ton AC -coil & condenser

A heat only system at 90% and capable of 105,000 gross or 94,500 net BTUs an hour being replaced by a 50,000 BTU input at maximum firing rate with an excellent pellet and say you are lucky and getting 83% for efficiency which makes it 41,500 net BTus an hour.

Your stove is way under powered for your house, to be used as a sole heat source.

Just curious since you already had the duct work did you consider a pellet furnace?

 

[nhredbird]

I did and still am, for next season.
Most where 3 to 5 thousand, was'nt in the buget this year.
I am still unsure if they will produce enough heat with the long duct runs?

 

[DexterDay]

I did and still am, for next season.
Most where 3 to 5 thousand, was'nt in the buget this year.
I am still unsure if they will produce enough heat with the long duct runs?

Harman PF-100 is 100,000 BTU's and if I am not mistaken, they have an optional blower that is 2,000 CFM (Pretty sure, may be slightly less).

My Fahrenheit is rated at 50,000 and heats our home with less pellets than our Quadrafire did. After talking with my local dealer and 1 other person, the Fahrenheit eats more pellets than 50,000. Both say its prob closer to 70,000. According to the rate in which they eat pellets (on Highest setting). My local dealer is heating about 3,300 sq ft with his. Keeps on Level 4 on a Stat set to 73. That's all he uses to heat with. Only cleans it once a season. Empties ash pan every other week.

Im heating 2,200 sq and it does a great job. Although the blower is only 800 CFM on it. But my Ducts are pretty simple and straight, along with being insulated.

Picked mine up on Craiglist for a Steal. Guy thought something was broke or breaking because it had a hard time lighting and burned for $#it. Just plugged up. Never cleaned it. Vacuumed the firebox and that was it. He had it for 1 season and ran about 6 ton through it. With 1 or 2 ton of that being Corn.