Another Magnum BabyCountrySide AC Hopper Fire! A bad one! Question?

[Don2222]

Hello

Another friend with a hopper fire. This was a bad one. Deltron auger bushing completely gone!

Auger collar all marked up from an attempted fix. Auger set screw brittle from fire and broke apart!

So the motor and auger had to be removed in one piece. In order to do that, both side doors and back had to be removed!

My concern is the Hopper Sheet metal on the bottom of the back wall in the hopper.
Sheet Metal is protruding in a round convex manner.
See pic 1 yellow arrows

Looking at the underside of the hopper from inside back you can see it is concave!
See pic 2 yellow arrows

Should we get a block of wood and try to straighten this out with a hammer?
Are some units supposed to be that way? ? ?

Also some separation in right back side of hopper. See pic 3 below.

 

[stoveguy2esw]

i dunno the design so i couldnt tell you if its supposed to be rounded or flat. picture kinda dark so its hard to tell.

importantly though, the hopper and feed system should be sealed up so that air will not "transit" through the feed system. in a burnback situation the fire is able to continue back more readily if there is air replacement at the point of the fire. if this is not present the fire should die out before getting too far out of hand.

make sure that before this unit is put back into service that its hopper is as sealed up as possible , check gaskets seams in the metal where the bin is fabricated together. maybe even "smoke bomb" the hopper with it sealed up to check for leakage.

 

[Don2222]

i dunno the design so i couldnt tell you if its supposed to be rounded or flat. picture kinda dark so its hard to tell.

importantly though, the hopper and feed system should be sealed up so that air will not "transit" through the feed system. in a burnback situation the fire is able to continue back more readily if there is air replacement at the point of the fire. if this is not present the fire should die out before getting too far out of hand.

make sure that before this unit is put back into service that its hopper is as sealed up as possible , check gaskets seams in the metal where the bin is fabricated together. maybe even "smoke bomb" the hopper with it sealed up to check for leakage.

Thanks Mike
I also have a ticket opened with AES support so I will see what they say. I know the pic is dark. I had to used a LED light just to get that pic!
I also have the recommended higher speed exhaust blower (105 CFM) to install so it will not happen again. Just want to make sure I get the new auger in right.

BTW. Did u ever check into why the 10-CPM has such a high 250 CFM room blower in it's design?

 

[Don2222]

AES response

The aluminum auger housing will need to be checked to see if the aluminum melted or gave away. The metal on the hopper can be tapped back into shape without any problem and then resealed with silicone. If the aluminum auger housing is bad, then I would recommend that they replace the housing and hopper. Let me know what you see on the aluminum housing (check with a light up the tube to see if the bronze bushing is melted or the housing warped).

All of the auger housings had a bronze bushing installed in them. I would use a soft hammer and once you have the auger plate attached tap the metal onto the plate and silicone in place. If it does not stay put then drill a few holes through the plate and the metal and secure with some pop rivets.

The auger housing is good and there was no bronze bushing. I have a new one.
So I will tap the sheet metal back into shape and put in a new auger and bushing set.

 

[stoveguy2esw]

input CFM doesnt always translate to output CFM. i didnt have anything to do with the design of the stove , but i have to imagine that the reason for that strong a blower was to ensure that the blower could move enough air through the unit to push the heat out efficiently.

 

[Don2222]

input CFM doesnt always translate to output CFM. i didnt have anything to do with the design of the stove , but i have to imagine that the reason for that strong a blower was to ensure that the blower could move enough air through the unit to push the heat out efficiently.

Hi Mike
I am not saying the design is wrong considering the whole picture about using multi-fuels. However a better design maybe the higher 250 CFM for the hotter burning fuels like cherry pits and then a lower 200 CFM for wood pellets to make the stove perform a little better.

I am currently refurbishing a US Stove American Harvest 6041 that has a 200 CFM room blower. The heat blowing out is great for wood pellets! Have not tried other fuels yet. Do u have any cherry pits on ya? LOL

 

[stoveguy2esw]

Hi Mike
I am not saying the design is wrong considering the whole picture about using multi-fuels. However a better design maybe the higher 250 CFM for the hotter burning fuels like cherry pits and then a lower 200 CFM for wood pellets to make the stove perform a little better.

I am currently refurbishing a US Stove American Harvest 6041 that has a 200 CFM room blower. The heat blowing out is great for wood pellets! Have not tried other fuels yet. Do u have any cherry pits on ya? LOL

nope, no pits here, since corn has been redesignated from food to fuel and gotten expensive as it has we havent really looked at "multifuel" units

i imagine the heat exchange system in the 6041 was set up to be optimized with a 200CFM i dunno. i cant OTOH see why we would put a 200 and a 250 in the same stove just for different fuels.

 

[Don2222]

Hello

The Issue is getting the auger back in now!
Magnum sent me to backing plates because they said it could be either one. However the original has 3 holes not 2 like the new ones!
So I cut the auger shaft to remove the original backing plate. Either way, I will get this back in!

See pics below
Click to enlarge!

 

[Don2222]

nope, no pits here, since corn has been redesignated from food to fuel and gotten expensive as it has we havent really looked at "multifuel" units

i imagine the heat exchange system in the 6041 was set up to be optimized with a 200CFM i dunno. i cant OTOH see why we would put a 200 and a 250 in the same stove just for different fuels.

Thanks Mike that would be interesting to check into. Not sure what OTOH means?
Can one blower do 250 CFM or 200 CFM and then be tied into the Wood pellet or Corn Mode on the control Panel?

 

[stoveguy2esw]

"OTOH" is abbreviation for "on the other hand"

as for the blower question, any 250 CFM blower can move air at 200 CFM, just by turning down the power going to it so it runs slower

 

[DexterDay]

I dont understand how they still can sell the Baby...... With all the problems? Its amazing that anyone would buy one.

 

[smwilliamson]

how far away from the exhaust was the oak? Right next to it i presume.... i think you ahve a 50% greater chance burning your house down with an aes product than any other...whats up with these things?

 

[stoveguy2esw]

how far away from the exhaust was the oak? Right next to it i presume.... i think you ahve a 50% greater chance burning your house down with an aes product than any other...whats up with these things?

im not gonna slam em, (aint my style) but i bet i could help them fix this tendancy.

 

[Don2222]

Ok, Guys

Today, I banged the crap out of the badly humped and bent hopper sheet metal in the back above the auger! I used the heavy Tailer ball and slide from my car to ram the sheet metal strait! Then I had to installed a Brand New Auger, Auger Collar, 2 RPM AES Auger Motor and the original backplate because of the extra hole. Must have been modified. RTVed the back plated to make air tight. Then I removed the original 85 CFM Exhaust Blower and housing with Low Limit Switch, and Installed the Upgraded 2 Speed Exhaust Blower with new housing and new Low Limit switch. It has 2 wires, one for the low speed and one for the high speed. Magnum recommends taping off the low speed and connecting the Hi speed only. So the new blower is in and the exhaust blower is now 105 CFM ! ! ! Fixed a few air leaks in the exhaust plenum and there is no stove adapter! Have to get a stove adapter and a new T-Stat with the swing setting, she just has an old manual T-Stat! Almost done!

She asked if buying that stove from Home Depot cheap was why it was not very good. My answer was that stove and many other stoves had bugs in them and by now most of the bugs are worked out. The good news is you can get upgrades for the older stoves like hers! I sell the Brand New Magnum BabyCountrySide stoves and while they look the same because they use the same shell, they are a better stove now. Also they do burn 100% corn very well too!

I do admit that some stoves like the 1997 Lopi Pioneer had only one bug and with the new digital control panel that was backwardly compatible came out, that stove could be made like new!

 

[Wildo]

pellets are sounding more dangerous everytime I turn around. I think I'll stick with 24" pellets augered in 1 at a time by me...

 

[Don2222]

pellets are sounding more dangerous everytime I turn around. I think I'll stick with 24" pellets augered in 1 at a time by me...

Hello

Well I do want to make this clear.

This is an older design stove, the new pellet stoves have most of the bugs out. So getting the latest updates on an older stove or a newer stove, and you will not have this problem!

 

[Don2222]

Hello

Well, here is a pic of the upgraded blower and new Auger and Auger Motor.Then upgraded the T-Stat from a manual bi-metal strip type to a Lux TS1500U. Then installed a stove adapter since there was none. I also put the test cord on the room blower and that works fine.

However after plugging in the stove and pressing the on button the stove is still dead as a door nail!

The fuse tested ok and there is 120v at the AC jack inside the stove going to the control panel.

Has anyone seen a bad control panel like this?
Click to enlarge

 

[stoveguy2esw]

Hello

Well, here is a pic of the upgraded blower and new Auger and Auger Motor.Then upgraded the T-Stat from a manual bi-metal strip type to a Lux TS1500U. Then installed a stove adapter since there was none. I also put the test cord on the room blower and that works fine.

However after plugging in the stove and pressing the on button the stove is still dead as a door nail!

The fuse tested ok and there is 120v at the AC jack inside the stove going to the control panel.

Has anyone seen a bad control panel like this?

yep, blown transformer on the board. is the stat caling for heat though (dunno the system) but if its not calling does the board do anything normally? on light?

 

[Don2222]

yep, blown transformer on the board. is the stat caling for heat though (dunno the system) but if its not calling does the board do anything normally? on light?

Hi Mike

Thanks so much for answering my post. Yes, the New Lux LTS1500u T-Stat I put in was calling for heat. I even tried the panel in manual mode and no power and no ON light! So I will check with my friend about a new panel.

 

[IHATEPROPANE]

Hi Mike

Thanks so much for answering my post. Yes, the New Lux LTS1500u T-Stat I put in was calling for heat. I even tried the panel in manual mode and no power and no ON light! So I will check with my friend about a new panel.

Is that the same board as the hudson river?....from the pic it looks the same.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Is that the same board as the hudson river?....from the pic it looks the same.

That would be because there are only a few places that actually make the boards and everybody needs their stove's name added. There may be and likely are minor timing and voltage differences but then they have to do something to be able to charge you extra for a part that costs way less than you get charged.

 

[pell it]

Looks like a variant of this one: http://www.tunkienterprise.com/tunki/index/html/left/pelletstovecontrol.htm

 

[Don2222]

Is that the same board as the hudson river?....from the pic it looks the same.

No, not the same board.
This board has a jumper setting for corn. I believe it speeds up the auger because the corn is smaller than wood pellets.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

No, not the same board.
This board has a jumper setting for corn. I believe it speeds up the auger because the corn is smaller than wood pellets.

More than likely it slows down the auger.

 

[DexterDay]

More than likely it slows down the auger.

Yep. Smokey is correct. Corn is smaller. Sending more volume per turn. Pellets are larger, creating more aor gaps and less volume. Needs a faster turn.