1. Welcome Hearth.com Guests and Visitors - Please enjoy our forums!
    Hearth.com GOLD Sponsors who help bring the site content to you:
    Hearthstone Soapstone and Cast-Iron stoves( Wood, Gas or Pellet Stoves and Inserts)
    Caluwe - Passion for Fire and Water ( Pellet and Wood Hydronic and Space Heating)

Anyone else remove/modify stove with reburn tubes?

Post in 'The Hearth Room - Wood Stoves and Fireplaces' started by yardatwork, Sep 28, 2010.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. yardatwork

    yardatwork New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2009
    Messages:
    26
    Loc:
    Western PA
    Well after two seasons of using my woodburner with the reburn tubes...I'm fed up and modifying the stove to the old school style. I've removed the fiber board, tried taking the tubes out, but they are recessed in the stove and won't come out. I'm adding a damper in the stove pipe and working this wood burner like the old days. The stove I have now was purchased at Lowe's and claims to cover 1800-2000 square feet. Well, I can't get this thing to heat my 700 sq. feet worth of basement (basement is only under a portion of my entire house). My old stove (non EPA) was rated at 1000 sq. feet and heated my entire house (basement and upstairs). I sold that stove for the fancy reburn stove and have regretted that decision ever since. Anyone else have as much trouble as I have had with building heat in these new EPA certified stoves? Anyone else decide to remove the reburn tubes and go with the old school woodburner style? I know I'm going to get comments about two year minimum seasoned wood...I'm using two year min seasoned hard wood. I honestly think my stove has some sort of defect, but at this point I can't return the stove. At times I see the reburn tubes working and blowing flames from them...however...the top of the stove NEVER gets hot enough to matter. I can honest place my hand 1/4 inch from the top of the stove and leave it there without burning myself. The stove just isn't producing heat. The only major heat being produced comes through the glass on the front door, but even so, nothing that's gonna make you write home about.

    Helpful Sponsor Ads!





  2. firefighterjake

    firefighterjake Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2008
    Messages:
    14,917
    Loc:
    Unity/Bangor, Maine
    Generally we don't seem to hear of too many people who don't like the extra heat from the EPA stove unless a) they're not burning seasoned wood (although most all of them believe they're burning seasoned wood -- to be fair, two years sounds pretty good . . . providing it is in a good location), b) they don't understand how to run their stove (i.e. they run the stove with the air open all the way not realizing the secret is to get the stove hot and then start closing the air to achieve the secondary burn and retain more of the heat in the stove and not let it go up the chimney or c) the stove has an honest to gawd defect.

    Truthfully, I would guess 99% of the time the issue boils down to Reason A or B . . . well I take that back . . . sometimes folks get a stove too small.
  3. ControlFreak

    ControlFreak Feeling the Heat

    Joined:
    Jan 15, 2008
    Messages:
    490
    Loc:
    Holden, MA
    Woah, don't do that!

    There's no doubt that the new technology is so much better than the "campfire-in-a-box" old pre-EPA stoves. Figure out what's wrong, rather than trashing a good stove. The new stove technology will take you some time to learn, so work the learning rather than curse the technology. It is true the that the new stoves are less tolerant of moisture in wood, but once you're working together with it, you'll be very happy!

    Seriously, I hated my Napoleon 1401 for the first couple years until I figured out how to get my wood seasoned properly. With the proper fuel, it's a dream. It has heated my home wonderfully for 14 years now.

    Go to Home Depot and pick up some crappy 2x4's and cut them up. These should burn very nicely in your stove, so you can get the feel for what should happen. If 2x4's don't burn well, then maybe you do have a problem with the stove, or your chimney has a problem with draft, or your house is so tight that its limiting your air supply.
  4. northernontario

    northernontario Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2010
    Messages:
    120
    Loc:
    Ontario
    Have you looked into other possible problems? (I won't mention the wood seasoning thing ;) )...

    How is the draft on your chimney? If you have a pre-fab chimney (stainless double/triple wall insulated), have you tried adding another section to it? It's a relatively quick job if you're working with pre-fab. If you have a masonry chimney, then you are looking at a lot more work. You might even want to look into having someone test the draft on the chimney to make sure it's drafting properly?(pulling enough vacuum)

    Perhaps there are some other mods that could be done to increase the amount of air able to enter the stove?

    Maybe you can put this one back together... sell it... and buy an old non-EPA stove for a deal (since who wants one of those old clunkers!)
  5. vvvv

    vvvv New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,449
    Loc:
    MAINE
    just plug the 2ndary air intake hole with al foil & it'll stop the airflow if u want. & post back if u get better results, eh? EPA stove aint burned with same procedure as non-EPA stove
  6. DanCorcoran

    DanCorcoran Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Jan 5, 2010
    Messages:
    2,052
    Loc:
    Richmond, VA
    Live close to Canada, eh?
  7. vvvv

    vvvv New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,449
    Loc:
    MAINE
  8. oldspark

    oldspark Guest

    Don't throw the baby out with the bath water just yet, what brand of stove is this so owners of that paticular stove can chime in.
  9. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2005
    Messages:
    46,548
    Loc:
    South Puget Sound, WA
    Agreed, don't do this. Have you been in touch with Englander tech support on the issue? One thing to check is to be sure the baffle board is tight to the back of the stove. If not, flames can go right up the flue. That would dramatically affect performance.
  10. DAKSY

    DAKSY Patriot Guard Rider Staff Member

    Joined:
    Dec 2, 2008
    Messages:
    4,929
    Loc:
    Averill Park, NY, on Burden Lake II...
    How about you give us something more specific?
    What kind of Stove?
    What model?
    What size chimney? (inside)
    How TALL is the chimney?
    Is it straight up or do you have offsets?
    What are the offsets? (15, 30, 45 or 90 deg)
    Have you checked the moisture content of your wood?
    Seasoned two years unsplit & under a a tarp will not dry as
    well as split with a a simple top over it to allow air flow to dry it....
  11. yardatwork

    yardatwork New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2009
    Messages:
    26
    Loc:
    Western PA
    I do fully opened until the box gets hot then I pull the draft back to about half. The flames are beautiful, orange/blue, minimal to no smoke coming out of the chimney. I've sat in front of that thing for an hour straight and about 90% of the time...the tubes aren't doing anything. The only time I've noticed them working was right after I open the door, put a new piece of wood in, and reclosed the door. If memory serves me right there have even been times that the fiber board was glowing orange...but still no heat on top of the stove. I clean the chimney before each season...the access pan is only about half full of creosote flakes from the cleaning. So the wood is burning properly and is creating little to no creosote for the whole season. My chimney is on the east side of my house, rarely any down draft, sticking about the roof 2 1/2 feet, two 90s (one to go out the wall and one to go up the side of the house).

    Right now my fiber board is broke in half and I'm ready to drill holes to place the damper. Since the tubes wouldn't come out as described in the owner's manual, the fiber board was fragile and it broke while trying to remove it.

    My stove is a SUMMERS HEAT 50-SNC13LC
  12. yardatwork

    yardatwork New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2009
    Messages:
    26
    Loc:
    Western PA
    I did contact them and all they said was to make sure the fiber board was all the way back. I knew that and it was. They were of NO help.
  13. vvvv

    vvvv New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,449
    Loc:
    MAINE
    gotta fill the stove be4 u light it
    air from tubes dives down to hot area even if tubes aint burning. maybe the 2ndary air inlet is plugged?
  14. northernontario

    northernontario Member

    Joined:
    Sep 28, 2010
    Messages:
    120
    Loc:
    Ontario
    Only 2-1/2 feet above the roof? Most chimney manufacturers are specifying min. 3ft of chimney above roof, and minimum of 2ft of chimney beyond any part of the roof (or structure) within 10 feet. So, if you've got a high-slope roof, you could be 3ft above the point where the chimney passes through, but less than 2ft above something within 10 feet. This can have a huge impact on the draft of your stove. And if you sit near a hill, or other features that may cause wind turbulance/pressure changes... your chimney should be higher.

    My chimney meets the 3ft/2ft@10ft rule... but still drafts poorly. I think I'll be extending it before the winter hits.
  15. oldspark

    oldspark Guest

    I think 2 1/2 ft is fine, I think he has other problems, many many reasons for poor draft and he did say it workd well with the old stove.
  16. vvvv

    vvvv New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,449
    Loc:
    MAINE
    said his pre EPA stove worked better
  17. stoveguy2esw

    stoveguy2esw Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Nov 14, 2006
    Messages:
    5,824
    Loc:
    madison hgts. va
    i just gotta know what stove this is. sounds like our 13-nc series but im not sure because taking the tubes out is simply removing a screw at the base of the tube and sliding it over and out, shouldnt be difficult at all.
  18. yardatwork

    yardatwork New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2009
    Messages:
    26
    Loc:
    Western PA
    It's a SUMMERS HEAT 50-SNC13LC

    I did take the screw out. The one side that takes the screw is welded to the tube meaning you can only push it from left to right to remove it. Well the left side tube sticks into the stove area with more pipe than the right side hole can take...follow what I mean? So when the tube is pushed as far to the right as it can go, there is still tube left in the left side hole meaning the tube won't come out. Seems to me that the tubes were placed in first the the mounting bracket was welded to the inside of the box.
  19. BrotherBart

    BrotherBart Hearth.com LLC Mid-Atlantic Division Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2005
    Messages:
    27,630
    Loc:
    Northern Virginia
    Isn't that outside pipe only about nine and a half feet high?
  20. yardatwork

    yardatwork New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2009
    Messages:
    26
    Loc:
    Western PA
    The tee sits two feet above the ground, four sections of three feet pipe, and a cap...single story house w/ wood burner is the basement...floor vents and stairs for heat to rise up through. The 6" prefab chimney goes up along side of my house about three to four feet after my gutter (looking at it from the side). My "real" chimney runs up the middle of my house, but that is hooked to my furnace with forced air. I've honestly never had draft issues...however...I'm no draft expert!

    If the reburn tubes aren't working properly, then most of the heat will go straight up the chimney...correct? Without a damper in the stove pipe what prevents all of the heat from just rising up and out? I think this is what's happening. The fiber board prevents the flames from hitting the top of the stove in return preventing the top of the stove from ever getting hot?
  21. BrotherBart

    BrotherBart Hearth.com LLC Mid-Atlantic Division Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 18, 2005
    Messages:
    27,630
    Loc:
    Northern Virginia
    Sounds like you added another pipe section after your post in February:

    "The inside black pipe from the unit is about 4’ before going into the wall kit and outside connecting to the insulated pipe. My outside insulated pipe/chimney is about 10’ tall (3, 3’ sections of pipe and 1 foot tee section)...roughly sits 2’ above the roof."

    Three sections and going into the middle of a tee would only render about 9 1/2 feet of vertical. Then considering that you have two ninety degree turns that chimney will never be able to establish a strong enough draft for the reburn to work. There has to be a strong enough draft to pull air through the tubes as well as the primary air channels.
  22. vvvv

    vvvv New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Messages:
    1,449
    Loc:
    MAINE
    wrong, any air that enters the stove will go to the hottest spot which is where the wood is flaming or the hot coals are----due to air buoyoancy factors
  23. oldspark

    oldspark Guest

    Even with out the secondaries working the top of the stove should get hot, just a small fire in my stove with out the secondaries kicking in the top gets hot.
  24. yardatwork

    yardatwork New Member

    Joined:
    Feb 6, 2009
    Messages:
    26
    Loc:
    Western PA
    I didn't add another section...I wrote the wrong info. It's 12' tall with 4, 3' sections. Maybe I just need another section for a better draft.
  25. oldspark

    oldspark Guest

    If the chimney is too short and not enough draft shouldn't he be seeing other problems besides a poor burn?
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page