Bringing an old installation up to code

[FanMan]

I have an old stove installation in our cabin that I want to bring up to code.



Right now the single wall stovepipe is about 15" from the wall, a bit less than the required 18". My initial thought was to add a heat shield to the back of the pipe, but the other option is to go with double wall pipe instead. However, the chimney pipe only protrudes about 8" from the ceiling, and as I understand it (please correct me if I'm wrong), that needs to be 18" as well? So another option is to use a short length of double wall pipe at the top, and keep the single wall (with added heat shield) down to the stove.

I know double wall would improve draft and reduce creosote buildup, bout OTOH the single wall would mean more heat into the room, and the old stove isn't terribly efficient to begin with (I want to replace it, but not this year). The wall behind the stove itself is OK, with brick face over cement board spaced out from the wall.

I'm not sure what brand the chimney pipe is (I'll check this weekend). I presume I need the same brand adapter to connect the double wall pipe to the chimney?

Do I need an adapter to connect double wall to the existing single wall pipe?

 

[begreen]

NIce cabin! Chimney pipe usually only requires 2" clearance. It looks like it was extended into the room to clear the ceiling beams. That's ok. You may find that the chimney pipe is now obsolete and adapting it could be a challenge. In that case, pipe shields would work.

These old Franklin fireplaces are very inefficient. If the goal is to produce good heat with less wood then planning on a replacement is a good idea.

 

[Ctwoodtick]

One thing to think about as well might be the hearth. Can’t tell from the picture, but it could be simply a piece of cement board with bricks mortared to it, which may not meet the radiant heat clearance needs of that stove.
When we moved into our camp, I saw that they had a wood stove in the garage with that for a “hearth”. I would have fixed that, but the home ins company was clear that they would not cover a stove in a garage. No big loss as I was not going to use it. That and the stove was one of those crappy cheap stoves you see for sale everywhere for like 300 bucks. I disconnected it.

 

[Tech Guru]

That and the stove was one of those crappy cheap stoves you see for sale everywhere for like 300 bucks. I disconnected it.

Ahh, the Vogelzang! What a POS

 

[bigealta]

Keep your eye open on craigslist and the like for a good used stove. That one, as you know, is just making you work so much harder suppling it with endless amount of wood for little heat.

with that said i'm betting your chimney is not very tall so you would need an "easy breather."

 

[begreen]

Keep your eye open on craigslist and the like for a good used stove. That one, as you know, is just making you work so much harder suppling it with endless amount of wood for little heat.

with that said i'm betting your chimney is not very tall so you would need an "easy breather."

Also, consider replacing it with a new stove like the Drolet Spark II.

 

[FanMan]

My main concern at the moment is the clearance at the top. I'm not worried about the chimney pipe clearance, but the distance from the single wall pipe angling up to the ceiling and beams... is the required 18" straight horizontally or in any direction? If the latter, it would seem that the chimney pipe would have to extend 18" through the ceiling, or be shielded or double wall. So the question is, is a shield wrapping 180° around the pipe (back and sides) adequate, or do I need to shield any part of the pipe that's within 18" of a combustible surface in any direction?



As I said earlier, the bricks behind the stove are on cement board which is spaced out from the wall, so that's kosher. On the floor, it's 2" thick cinderblocks over cement board, so that's also OK.

Replacing the stove will happen, just not this year. Like this one, it will have to have a large glass door... I want the heat, but don't want to forego the pleasure of watching the flames while sipping a Scotch on a cold snowy evening.

 

[begreen]

It looks like the chimney pipe (2" clearance) projects down into the room to avoid clearance issues though that is an odd and not proper support system.

 

[Wiserat4]

I have an old stove installation in our cabin that I want to bring up to code.

View attachment 314704

Right now the single wall stovepipe is about 15" from the wall, a bit less than the required 18". My initial thought was to add a heat shield to the back of the pipe, but the other option is to go with double wall pipe instead. However, the chimney pipe only protrudes about 8" from the ceiling, and as I understand it (please correct me if I'm wrong), that needs to be 18" as well? So another option is to use a short length of double wall pipe at the top, and keep the single wall (with added heat shield) down to the stove.

I know double wall would improve draft and reduce creosote buildup, bout OTOH the single wall would mean more heat into the room, and the old stove isn't terribly efficient to begin with (I want to replace it, but not this year). The wall behind the stove itself is OK, with brick face over cement board spaced out from the wall.

I'm not sure what brand the chimney pipe is (I'll check this weekend). I presume I need the same brand adapter to connect the double wall pipe to the chimney?

Do I need an adapter to connect double wall to the existing single wall pipe?

How do you keep your roof insulated from drafts since there is no attic? I would love a setup like yours, but it's so drafty in the attic of our farm house. Same style of roof though, but covered by sheet rock.

 

[FanMan]

How do you keep your roof insulated from drafts since there is no attic? I would love a setup like yours, but it's so drafty in the attic of our farm house. Same style of roof though, but covered by sheet rock.

By having a stove big enough that it's overkill.

But seriously, drafts come from airflow through cracks. Conductive heat loss through an uninsulated ceiling or wall is something completely different. Of course we have both of those things; the cabin was originally built for summer use only.

 

[xman23]

The ceiling with no insulation is where most of the heat is going. If you can, the R value of the ceiling should be 2 times the wall R value. You have a clean slate there to do anything you want. The issue with cathedral ceilings is ventilation between the insulation and the roof. They make foam channels for this issue. But you need a air in and out of each rafter bay.

 

[cahaak]

I'll be honest, based on your pictures and dimensions, I would not change anything on your piping set up. The ceiling support bracket is nonstandard, not modern, and I suspect that if you get into changing things, it will be an entirely new full chimney. In an open setting like that, I think 15" pipe clearance should work. You should physically feel the wall and ceiling behind and above the pipe during a normal and high burn.

 

[begreen]

The main question is whether this is older HT1700 chimney pipe vs newer HT2100 class A chimney. If this is air-cooled chimney pipe it definitely is not up to current standards.

 

[FanMan]

The ceiling with no insulation is where most of the heat is going. If you can, the R value of the ceiling should be 2 times the wall R value. You have a clean slate there to do anything you want. The issue with cathedral ceilings is ventilation between the insulation and the roof. They make foam channels for this issue. But you need a air in and out of each rafter bay.

@Wiserat4 may have a clean slate, but I don't, I'm not going to change anything on the ceiling. It's the original ceiling / roof from 1928, made of native American Chestnut harvested and sawn on site, too beautiful to hide.

I'll be honest, based on your pictures and dimensions, I would not change anything on your piping set up. The ceiling support bracket is nonstandard, not modern, and I suspect that if you get into changing things, it will be an entirely new full chimney. In an open setting like that, I think 15" pipe clearance should work. You should physically feel the wall and ceiling behind and above the pipe during a normal and high burn.

Other than a wraparound heat shield I've since added to the back of the pipe (to reduce the otherwise required 18" clearance), I don't want to change anything... unless the inspector who's going to look at all the cabin fireplaces in the community next year (long story) doesn't like what he sees. I have checked the temperatures and don't see any issues, nothing gets too hot. I personally don't have any concerns about its safety, but I don't know how much of a stickler he's going to be about precise code conformance.

The main question is whether this is older HT1700 chimney pipe vs newer HT2100 class A chimney. If this is air-cooled chimney pipe it definitely is not up to current standards.

It's not aircooled pipe, it's the proper insulated chimney pipe (albeit with a funky homemade support and stovepipe adapter).