Dry wood versus not really

[gyrfalcon]

To make a long story short, I've been burning wood that checks out at about 20 MC this winter (rock maple, beech, ash, some red oak) and it's been bliss-- lights right up even on a fairly minimal coal bed, burns cleanly, gives me great heat.

But I ran low in late winter, and had to use some other wood that looked good-- nice end cracks, makes the right sound when you smack it together, splits not notiiceably heavier than the other stuff.

But uh-oh! It wasn't burning right unless it went onto an already hot fire. Got a new battery for my moisture meter, split a couple, three pieces and measured on the inside. Sure enough, 27, 28, 29 MC instead of 20.

You wouldn't think, or at least I wouldn't, that there'd be such a really huge difference between 20, 21 MC and 27, 28, but wow, there sure is. I would go mad and/or be sure there was something wrong with my stove setup if I had only this wood.

Burn. Dry. Wood.

And also, if you have to get c/s/d and somebody tells you their wood is "seasoned," don't even let them unload until you split a few pieces and measure them.

(both of these lots, I'm slightly embarrassed to admit, came from operations that do bulk kiln-dried firewood, the first a big lumberyard about 30 miles from me, the second the small firm closer to me that cleans my chimney every year and just got into the firewood business, selling it for enough less $$ to be worth trying. Both say they aim for 20 percent MC, and the lumberyard operation knows what it's doing. The new guys in the next town said they dried to 20, but come to find out when I called them up that they were measuring at the ends, not realizing you had to do it inside of a freshly cut split. I'm one of their first customers for this, and they were very unhappy to find out they needed to dry the wood a day or so longer in their kiln than they thought. Live and learn.)

 

[StihlHead]

Yep. I thought my 18 month seasoned birch was dry earlier in the year, but it was caking up the flue with creosote. Sure enough, I flipped to my 2 year old cured cherry, and the house was warmer and the fires burned a lot cleaner. Now I am burning 2 year old black locust that I got from a fellow clearing out his woodshed for new fir he felled this year, and that stuff burns great. I am letting all my wood that I cut last year season another summer before I burn it.

New me: burn 2 year old wood... one year old wood here is still too wet. I am getting wood now for the season after next...

 

[gyrfalcon]

New me: burn 2 year old wood... one year old wood here is still too wet. I am getting wood now for the season after next...

Yeah, one-year wood only works if it's split well down and stacked in full sun and wind in a non-humid climate in single rows. (And it's not one of the oaks!)

There's "OK, yeah, it burns," and then there's "Whoopeee!" I suspect a large percentage of wood burners, particularly ones who are new, have no idea what it's supposed to be like.

 

[Woody Stover]

had to use some other wood that looked good-- nice end cracks, makes the right sound when you smack it together, splits not notiiceably heavier than the other stuff.

But uh-oh! It wasn't burning right unless it went onto an already hot fire. Got a new battery for my moisture meter, split a couple, three pieces and measured on the inside. Sure enough, 27, 28, 29 MC instead of 20

I've read here that those end cracks will start to close up as the middle of the split dries out, so I'll be looking for that.
I've run across stuff that is down around 16% and you can really feel that it's lighter in weight, and when you knock the splits together, some of them ring like a bell (depending on the shape and size of the split.)
Everything I've got for next Winter will be at least a year and a half dry...

 

[My Oslo heats my home]

I have run into the same problems as a novice woodburner. It's fair to say that today I wouldn't think twice unless I absolutely knew the wood was safe to burn. Some folks here say the mm isn't necessary, I say it gives me piece of mind on questionable wood such as the situation you were in by running short before the season was over.

And to add what may be a small tip. I have found that in my drying stacks that the top foot of splits seems to dry 50% faster than the lower portion of the row just because of the special attention it gets being on top. In a situation like yours when I need wood I can go to this wood and do extremely well.

 

[NH_Wood]

Same experience here. Last year was my first full year burning, and I was using ~ 9 month c/s/s white ash. The ash was actually fairly dry and did burn 'ok', but this year I've been burning 3 year wood and I can't count how many times I've told my wife how much easier it is to start and maintain fires. I've worked very hard over the past 3 years to get 20 cord (4 years) of wood c/s/s, and starting next year, I should be burning 4 year seasoned wood every year - just need to replace what I burn now to stay there. It's too bad that not all newbies to wood burning have access to real dry wood to see how it burns in their stove - if they did, hopefully they'd be willing to do what is necessary to get ahead on their wood supply. Cheers!

 

[JP11]

I tried as hard as I could to get ahead BEFORE I bought the boiler. My first wood was CSS in January of this year. Boiler should be installed next week. I've got 10 cord for this coming winter. I've got another 2 cord of red oak for future.

I don't think I'm "ahead" enough, as I will be burning 8 to 10 cord a year. I plan to purchase 4 cord from my grandparents who are moving to a nursing home. It's been inside their basement since fall, and I'm confident in the supplier that he provided them pretty good wood at that time. SO, I think I'll be able to be over the 1 year point before I get touching "my" wood. It was a lot of dead standing, blown down hemlock, and ash. Figuring it won't be too bad. I'm still cutting, so next year should be better.

I might not be ideal yet.. but I'm not too bad I don't think. I'll get at it with a MM soon to confirm my progress.

JP

 

[BobUrban]

x-whatever on the "get Ahead" comments. If I have learned anythnig here this past year(and I have learned a LOT) the most important thing is to burn dry wood and if at all possible "Get Ahead!"

I am sitting on 10 cord CSS'd that has been stacked for over a month in a wide open and wind swept area. 90% or more was cut from dead standing ash that had the bark pealing off and will be ready for next fall. My next year wood is stacked with open exposure on all sides with my two and three year out wood stacked a little tighter and I will just be replacing and adding to the stacks as I go. My minimal goal is to replace what I burn to stay 2-3 years ahead but I need a bench mark with the new stove to do that so next winter will be the big test.

I am fortunate to have a lot of open space and access to a lot of wood so it is just a matter of getting it done. Like mentioned above, the work of gathering fuel is, for the most part, fun for me and as long as I am enjoying it I keep going. Once I get bored or tired I just take a break until the mood strikes.

Because I was not as organized this winter I do not have a very good grasp on what I burned but my best guess is between 2-3 cord. This is somewhat of a scewed benchmark because I am changing stoves and we did not really have a winter to speak of here so I am planning for 4+ cord per year and time will tell what is really needed. As with almost anything - better to have it and not need it than the alternative.

 

[Realstone]

After reading this thread, I think I will break down & buy a moisture meter. Seems like a worthy investment. Question: does minimum moisture content vary between species? Do some varieties require less moisture content than others?

 

[gyrfalcon]

After reading this thread, I think I will break down & buy a moisture meter. Seems like a worthy investment. Question: does minimum moisture content vary between species? Do some varieties require less moisture content than others?

Some species, most famously white ash, are burnable with less drying time, but it's all better when it's really dry, including white ash.
I haven't used my moisture meter much, but it's been extremely helpful at various crucial points. The folks who have the resources and the space to stack 3 or 4 years ahead out in the open have no worries. But many of us don't, and it takes some time to learn how long what kind of wood needs to get dry enough in our particular climate/geography, and the moisture meter can be a big help in figuring that out-- even if it's only to confirm what you think you know.
Or not-- as in my case this spring. The wood gave every indication of being dry enough, until I tried to burn it.

I should say that it does burn decently as long as I've gotten a nice hot fire burning well with some of the good stuff first, so you can get by with wood that isn't quite perfect as long as you've got some supply of really dry wood to get things started. But that is a pain in the neck, especially in shoulder season when you don't want to keep the stove roaring 24/7.

 

[Woody Stover]

does minimum moisture content vary between species? Do some varieties require less moisture content than others?

Some species, most famously white ash, are burnable with less drying time...it takes some time to learn how long what kind of wood needs to get dry enough in our particular climate/geography

All species of wood will dry to the same equilibrium moisture content in a given climate. Woods with similar moisture content will burn about the same, but drying slows the closer the wood gets to equilibrium. White Ash has a lower initial MC than Oak if both are cut green, so the Ash will get to a burnable level sooner. It may be that with marginally dry wood, say 22%, that the Ash will blow off the moisture quicker than Oak in the stove, and take off faster...

 

[Backwoods Savage]

To make a long story short, I've been burning wood that checks out at about 20 MC this winter (rock maple, beech, ash, some red oak) and it's been bliss-- lights right up even on a fairly minimal coal bed, burns cleanly, gives me great heat.

But I ran low in late winter, and had to use some other wood that looked good-- nice end cracks, makes the right sound when you smack it together, splits not notiiceably heavier than the other stuff.

But uh-oh! It wasn't burning right unless it went onto an already hot fire. Got a new battery for my moisture meter, split a couple, three pieces and measured on the inside. Sure enough, 27, 28, 29 MC instead of 20.

You wouldn't think, or at least I wouldn't, that there'd be such a really huge difference between 20, 21 MC and 27, 28, but wow, there sure is. I would go mad and/or be sure there was something wrong with my stove setup if I had only this wood.

Burn. Dry. Wood.

And also, if you have to get c/s/d and somebody tells you their wood is "seasoned," don't even let them unload until you split a few pieces and measure them.

(both of these lots, I'm slightly embarrassed to admit, came from operations that do bulk kiln-dried firewood, the first a big lumberyard about 30 miles from me, the second the small firm closer to me that cleans my chimney every year and just got into the firewood business, selling it for enough less $$ to be worth trying. Both say they aim for 20 percent MC, and the lumberyard operation knows what it's doing. The new guys in the next town said they dried to 20, but come to find out when I called them up that they were measuring at the ends, not realizing you had to do it inside of a freshly cut split. I'm one of their first customers for this, and they were very unhappy to find out they needed to dry the wood a day or so longer in their kiln than they thought. Live and learn.)

Great post gyrfalcon. For sure you have convinced me and I think I'll maybe cut another cord or two yet this spring if possible. Got to have dry wood for sure. We haven't done too bad so far.

 

[gyrfalcon]

Great post gyrfalcon. For sure you have convinced me and I think I'll maybe cut another cord or two yet this spring if possible. Got to have dry wood for sure. We haven't done too bad so far.

Heh. Oh, how I envy you guys who have a couple centuries worth of firewood split and stacked in your back yard.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Wish you could come to see it too. We'd even let you take some home with you!

 

[firefighterjake]

Talking to my brother this weekend: So, I see you got a woodstove last Fall.

Brother: Yeah, it's been great. I didn't cut any firewood though so every month or so I would go into the woods and cut a load of ash.

Me: Oh, and you didn't have any problems?

Brother: Well I did have to clean the chimney every week.

 

[gyrfalcon]

Talking to my brother this weekend: So, I see you got a woodstove last Fall.

Brother: Yeah, it's been great. I didn't cut any firewood though so every month or so I would go into the woods and cut a load of ash.

Me: Oh, and you didn't have any problems?

Brother: Well I did have to clean the chimney every week.

That's what most folks around here do. It's no wonder stuff cut and lying on the forest floor for six months is considered "seasoned." Of course, none of them are burning EPA stoves.

 

[firefighterjake]

That's what most folks around here do. It's no wonder stuff cut and lying on the forest floor for six months is considered "seasoned." Of course, none of them are burning EPA stoves.

Truth be told . . . I half expected to have our fire department paged out this past winter for a mutual aid call to his house as I couldn't picture him keeping up on the chimney sweeping.

And now the rest of the story . . . he also told me that the stove he is using is my grandmother's old pre-EPA Ashley . . . and that unlike her he likes to damper it right down as it can "hold a fire all night long" . . . I'm thinking with the green wood and dampering it down that his chimney must smoke worse than the Marlboro man after hooking up with Virginia Slim. Of course, there's no educating him so I didn't bother . . . I mean he installed it so that the chimney pipe is actually blocking his view out of his front window.

 

[gyrfalcon]

Truth be told . . . I half expected to have our fire department paged out this past winter for a mutual aid call to his house as I couldn't picture him keeping up on the chimney sweeping.

And now the rest of the story . . . he also told me that the stove he is using is my grandmother's old pre-EPA Ashley . . . and that unlike her he likes to damper it right down as it can "hold a fire all night long" . . . I'm thinking with the green wood and dampering it down that his chimney must smoke worse than the Marlboro man after hooking up with Virginia Slim. Of course, there's no educating him so I didn't bother . . . I mean he installed it so that the chimney pipe is actually blocking his view out of his front window.

Oh, groan.

D'you suppose his happy flaunting of all the rules on this has anything to do with the fact that his brother is a firefighter?

We don't get a lot of chimney fires around here despite the horrendous burning habits, so I guess folks long ago adopted frequent chimney cleaning as part of the routine of wood heating.

 

[firefighterjake]

Oh, groan.

D'you suppose his happy flaunting of all the rules on this has anything to do with the fact that his brother is a firefighter?

We don't get a lot of chimney fires around here despite the horrendous burning habits, so I guess folks long ago adopted frequent chimney cleaning as part of the routine of wood heating.

No . . . not so much that I'm a firefighter . . . more likely because he is a blow hard, a procrastinator and someone who thinks the worse will never happen to him. He's my brother . . . but other than that we probably couldn't be less alike.

 

[StihlHead]

Well, around here there is such a thing as too old a wood stack. It seems to be species specific, but wood gets punky, rots and bug eaten over time. I have one brother than has 10 cords stacked all the time, it is mostly 3-5 years old, and half of it is rotted. Oak and willow do not store well here. I got a load black locust a few months ago that was 3 years old and starting to get rotten, which is why the guy was giving it away (it is great frewood). He has great dry storage too. I guess his wood stove was not that great though, as he asked me if I had a good wood stove to burn it in. I do... the old Earth Stove likes that kind of dense wood for a long burn. I burned a cord of semi-rotted cherry in the fall last year as well. It was buggy between the bark and wood. Not a great amount of heat value, but it was free.

You have to consider dry storage area for long term and high amounts of firewood. If tarped covered and tightly stacked on the ground here it will rot before it dries out. I put plastic down, then cut up sections of pallets, then stack the wood on that. I use t-posts at the ends to keep the stanks in place. I am using tarps as covers now, but that traps too much moisture in these long rain and snow spells that we have had this winter. I will be building wood sheds with raised roofs on them this summer on one side of the house here. That worked well for me at the ex's, where we burned 8-10 cords a year in her OWB. I used 2x4's to build 4x8x6 mini sheds with used pallet floors and 4x8 OSB or plywood roofs. Then I ran tarps over the top and three sides, tie them down with rope, and left the front open for access and air flow. They held one cord each.

 

[My Oslo heats my home]

Jake, at least your brother was smart enough to know to clean it even though the green wood was far from efficient. Any other average new burner with no clue may have had the FD there for sure.

 

[Realstone]

...Of course, there's no educating him so I didn't bother . . .

I belong to an aquarium forum as well. It amazes me the similarities between these two completely unrelated pursuits; what passes for common knowledge out there just isn't the best way to do things. But I learned a while ago that a) if the right way to do it is counter-intuitive, most people will give me a funny look when I try to correct them and label me as extreme, and b) I come off looking like a know-it-all. So unless they bring it up and ask for my advice, I don't bother. But in your case, health and life may be at risk. At least being in the fire prevention biz, you have more credence.