Duravent PelletPro--Painted vs Unpainted for Exterior

[OnlyWhnChasd]

So we are going ahead with reconfiguring our pellet exhaust to be an out and up rather than a direct vent, and we are debating over the exterior piping. Our dealer seems to think that the black painted Duravent PelletVent Pro pipe will hold up better to rust corrosion than the unpainted pipe from the same manufacturer, but in looking at the specs for the pipe, it appears to me that the only difference in them is the paint. Can paint make that much difference? In Googling, I didn't see a single application where there was black vent pipe on the exterior, but maybe I'm missing something. The difference in price is over $300, so it's not a small thing. Obviously we want something that will last, and if it costs $300 more, that's fine; but if the only difference is in appearance, not quality, it doesn't make sense to pay that premium.

Can anyone weigh in? For example, looking at the difference in this pipe http://www.build.com/duravent-3pvp-60/s190312 vs this one http://www.build.com/duravent-3pvp-60b/s189675 for exterior application. Is the black any better than the unpainted?

 

[Lake Girl]

Took a quick wander through Duravent literature. It does not mention any improved corrosion resistance with painted exterior. Many of the galvanized exteriors on pellet venting will weather a white/grey but the black also dulls over time. If looks are important, I'd go with painted as it is difficult to paint the galvanized after the fact. I did come across a self-etching primer that I used on the aluminum portions of cast outdoor furniture but not sure of over-all performance/durability.

 

[OnlyWhnChasd]

Took a quick wander through Duravent literature. It does not mention any improved corrosion resistance with painted exterior. Many of the galvanized exteriors on pellet venting will weather a white/grey but the black also dulls over time. If looks are important, I'd go with painted as it is difficult to paint the galvanized after the fact. I did come across a self-etching primer that I used on the aluminum portions of cast outdoor furniture but not sure of over-all performance/durability.

Thank you. I would actually rather the venting dulls to white/grey because our siding is white and black will really stand out. If rust/corrosion isn't an issue, I think we'll opt for unpainted. It seems like this is what most people have on the exterior anyway. Someone correct me though if I'm off base!

 

[OnlyWhnChasd]

I thought I'd follow up, as if I'd been thinking this is what I should have done in the first place: I called DuraVent and asked them directly! I guess it speaks to how much I value the information I receive here on Hearth.com that it's naturally my go-to source of information. Anyway, I spoke with a tech at DuraVent that indicated both the painted and unpainted PelletVent Pro pipe have the same guarantee/warranty and that the only difference is cosmetic. So, now I can save $300+. Whew!

 

[Lake Girl]

Thanks for the info. Always best to go to the source!

How are you installing your OAK? integrated in thimble or separate?

Pics of the first burn inside please Many do a burn outside before install to avoid the curing smell of first fire.

 

[bogieb]

I use the black, but that is because it works with the house colors better (brown on cream w/hunter green roof). With a white house, the unpainted should be fine. I also prefer the black pipe for the inside as it looks more like an extension of the stove that way - just my own opinion and taste, so means nothing. Also, a lot of time I can find the black on-line for a lot less than retail. Have to be diligent in your google search, be willing to look odd places, and willing to order different pieces from different places, but deals are there. In my case, I have no life anyway, so have nothing better to do than google everything to death

 

[Lake Girl]

I have no life anyway,

That's not true! Your a hearth.com member and have a pellet burning addiction ... well, maybe you have a point

 

[OnlyWhnChasd]

Thanks for the info. Always best to go to the source!

How are you installing your OAK? integrated in thimble or separate?

Pics of the first burn inside please Many do a burn outside before install to avoid the curing smell of first fire.

This is actually our second year with the stove (Mt Vernon AE). It's currently direct vented, and I inquired here https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/does-this-look-safe.145153/ a few weeks ago about the need/desire to reconfigure. We decided better safe than sorry, so we're going ahead with changing the direct vent to an out/up. Funny you should ask about an OAK. We don't currently have one as the dealer didn't think it was necessary and we didn't know any better at the time. Now, when they come to reconfigure the pipe, I have also asked them to install an OAK (separate thimble).

 

[Lake Girl]

Requirement on the OAK now under NFPA 211...

 

[OnlyWhnChasd]

Requirement on the OAK now under NFPA 211...

Uh, can you be more specific? I have no idea what that means. Thank you!

 

[Lake Girl]

National Fire Prevention Association has standard # 211 Standard for Chimneys, Fireplaces, Vents, and Solid Fuel-Burning Appliances. An Outside Air Kit is now required for all pellet stove installations ... no longer optional or just for mobile homes as it was before.
http://www.nfpa.org/codes-and-standards/document-information-pages?mode=code&code=211

 

[rona]

So we are going ahead with reconfiguring our pellet exhaust to be an out and up rather than a direct vent, and we are debating over the exterior piping. Our dealer seems to think that the black painted Duravent PelletVent Pro pipe will hold up better to rust corrosion than the unpainted pipe from the same manufacturer, but in looking at the specs for the pipe, it appears to me that the only difference in them is the paint. Can paint make that much difference? In Googling, I didn't see a single application where there was black vent pipe on the exterior, but maybe I'm missing something. The difference in price is over $300, so it's not a small thing. Obviously we want something that will last, and if it costs $300 more, that's fine; but if the only difference is in appearance, not quality, it doesn't make sense to pay that premium.

Can anyone weigh in? For example, looking at the difference in this pipe http://www.build.com/duravent-3pvp-60/s190312 vs this one http://www.build.com/duravent-3pvp-60b/s189675 for exterior application. Is the black any better than the unpainted?

The pipe is double walled and the outside won't get hot enough to burn the paint off. You can rub the galvanized pipe with vinegar and it will etch the galvanized pipe enough to allow the paint to stick.

 

[OnlyWhnChasd]

National Fire Prevention Association has standard # 211 Standard for Chimneys, Fireplaces, Vents, and Solid Fuel-Burning Appliances. An Outside Air Kit is now required for all pellet stove installations ... no longer optional or just for mobile homes as it was before.
http://www.nfpa.org/codes-and-standards/document-information-pages?mode=code&code=211

Interesting. I wasn't able to read the book (appears you need a membership), but it looks like the last update was in 2013. I wonder why, since my stove was installed in 2014, outside air wasn't required? The dealer actively discouraged us and the inspector never mentioned it. Anyway, I guess it's a good thing we are going ahead and adding it now!

 

[OnlyWhnChasd]

The pipe is double walled and the outside won't get hot enough to burn the paint off. You can rub the galvanized pipe with vinegar and it will etch the galvanized pipe enough to allow the paint to stick.

Thanks for that info. I will tuck it in my hat just in case we decide to paint it. It's in a prominent spot, so we may try to paint it to match the house if the pipe stands out too much the way it is.

 

[rona]

Thanks for that info. I will tuck it in my hat just in case we decide to paint it. It's in a prominent spot, so we may try to paint it to match the house if the pipe stands out too much the way it is.

After etching it with vinegar you can paint it with latex paint to match the house. I have painted homes and out buildings for 20 years and it is a proven simple method to blend the pipe in with the wall

 

[Lake Girl]

(appears you need a membership)

I think you can just sign up for a free account but you can only read the material not print it off.

May depend on the jurisdiction on whether they have adopted the standard. I know USSC will not honor warranty unless/until installed correctly with an OAK. Not sure where it leaves you with insurance companies if dealer and inspector ignore this ....

 

[OnlyWhnChasd]

After etching it with vinegar you can paint it with latex paint to match the house. I have painted homes and out buildings for 20 years and it is a proven simple method to blend the pipe in with the wall

Great info, thanks again! Even if we don't paint the pipe, It's good to know galvanized can be painted successfully. I have a horse trough planter that would really benefit from a coat of paint.

I think you can just sign up for a free account but you can only read the material not print it off.

May depend on the jurisdiction on whether they have adopted the standard. I know USSC will not honor warranty unless/until installed correctly with an OAK. Not sure where it leaves you with insurance companies if dealer and inspector ignore this ....

Oh, okay. Thanks! I saw the sign in but thought you had to be a "pro/contractor" or something.

I guess it's not a big deal now since we're having the OAK installed anyway; but it is concerning to me that we hired a licensed dealer/installer, paid for permit/inspection, and it still wasn't right. Maybe you're right, maybe it varies by jurisdiction. We are in rural WV and some things around here are shocking. Permits are relatively new for our county, so if you look at houses from a few years back you can really have some fun. Visited a place that had a wood stove installed directly on top of the wood floor. No hearth pad, nothing. Heck, even our house had a homeowner installed woodstove in the garage that was out of clearance specs by over TWO FEET! Needless to say, we removed it.

 

[bogieb]

If it makes you feel any better, my P61a was installed professionally January of 2014 and they didn't put in an OAK. Didn't even discuss it as an option. Then I read the manual (yes, I actually read the dang thing - several times ), and found that Harman STRONGLY SUGGESTED installing an OAK. I did install an OAK a couple of months later to reduce drafts

However, from the NFPA 211, Section 13.3 (Air for Combustion and Ventilation - solid Fuel Burning appliances):

13.3.1 Solid fuel burning appliances shall be installed in a location and manner so as to provide ventilation and combustion air supply to allow proper combustion on fuel, chimney draft and maintenance of safe temperatures.
13.3.2 Where buildings are so tight that normal infiltration does not provide the necessary air, outside air shall be introduced.​

No where do I see that an OAK is required of all installs. My place was/is certainly not tight, so 13.3.2 doesn't apply. Granted, I didn't read the whole dang thing, but I believe I read the pertinent parts.

Hey, thanks for the link to the NFPA Lake Girl!

 

[Lake Girl]

bogieb, NFPA 211 2010 version ... pellet stove would actually be considered a direct vent appliance. See OWEN1508 post on this thread:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/help-installed-new-stove-wont-run.140373/

The way I read that is that it requires an OAK. Far better for performance of stove when using dedicated air source so I installed an OAK about two weeks after we got ours...

 

[bogieb]

mAccording to the 2013 standard definitions (3.3.3.3), pellet stoves are Fuel burning appliances. They can also qualify as direct vent, if set up that way (by adding an OAK), but being a pellet stove does not make it so classified (that is my interpretation anyway). We could probably debate this forever. but with at least many professionally installed room heaters (pellet stoves) installed without an OAK, which clear inspections, I'm thinking either it is as clear as mud, or the standard is just poorly written and open to mis-interpretation (either yours or mine)

Not arguing that an OAK isn't a good idea (I installed it on both stoves), just saying that I believe that there is mis-interpretation, or the standard has been changed to directly address pellet stoves.

 

[Lake Girl]

I guess the difference comes in with USSC and Englander stoves (and any others) that come with the OAK from the manufacturer. They are deemed a direct vent appliance

 

[bogieb]

Ahh, that makes sense. If it comes with an OAK, it must be installed, if it isn't standard equipment, then it is optional. Phew, glad we got that cleared up (now we need to tackle world problems - LOL).