Englander 12/ Summer's Heat 50 Data Chart

[Danno77]

Decided to monitor the stove to see what it takes to get a nice long burn out of it. Really what prompted the whole thing was a super awesome loading job I totally maximized the space with the splits I had and wanted to see how long of a burn I'd get.

This entire burn was controlled only by the air control. There was never any opening to stir coals or drag logs from the back.

To understand my two temp points you need to know that my stove pipe only is visible above the stove before disappearing up the chimney for several inches, so the Flue temps you are seeing on the chart are really only about 3-4inches up the pipe. This, in my experience, has been handy because the thin layer of chimney pipe reacts to the changes in the firebox much quicker, so I can tell what direction the stove top will be going.

Generally I am not able to mess with the air control throughout the burn, so my SOP is to leave it on high for about 15 minutes, then shut it down to 25%. This gives me much higher burn temps for part of the burn, but the problem with turning it straight down to the lowest point is that it doesn't have the momentum to keep temps reasonable and I end up smoking for a long time, probably getting a little longer burn times, but initially having very low stove temps.

At any rate, here it is... About 300degrees to 300degrees.

 

[Big Al]

Very interesting. So the temps rose and fell throughout the cycle as the wood burned front to back and different pieces caufght up, I assume. At the end, the graph indicates an increase in air control opening...to maintain temps and get ready for a reload? Around 8 hours or so is pretty respectable for an overnight type burn with usable heat.

Not sure if you're doing this to maximize wood in the firebox, but I load all my 16" splits E/W to the left and then have some smaller splits cut down to 10" and jam as many as I can N/S on the right utilizing all the space. It's more work cutting down the small splits but it pays in extra heat and longer burns.

So what are your own conclusions based on the data Danno?

This model has a bad rep on this forum, but like anyhting else, if you take some time and play with it, you can find out what works best for it and get the most out of it.

 

[Backwoods Savage]

Interesting Danno. Maybe I should try that some time and make a graph but usually are not that close to the stove for that length of time.

 

[Danno77]

Very interesting. So the temps rose and fell throughout the cycle as the wood burned front to back and different pieces caufght up, I assume. At the end, the graph indicates an increase in air control opening...to maintain temps and get ready for a reload? Around 8 hours or so is pretty respectable for an overnight type burn with usable heat.

Not sure if you're doing this to maximize wood in the firebox, but I load all my 16" splits E/W to the left and then have some smaller splits cut down to 10" and jam as many as I can N/S on the right utilizing all the space. It's more work cutting down the small splits but it pays in extra heat and longer burns.

So what are your own conclusions based on the data Danno?

This model has a bad rep on this forum, but like anyhting else, if you take some time and play with it, you can find out what works best for it and get the most out of it.

Warm, it's like you watch me load. that is almost exactly how I do it. you can get those longer splits into the back just fine, because you can put them in diagonally, but the front does require slightly shorter splits and then right behind the latch I cram some smallish ones almost vertically in a N/S kinda way.

The change in temps is exactly what you thought. One weird thing that I've never seen before was somewhere midway in that long burn in the middle, there were these weird boom/poofs. The stove was plenty hot, wood was just glowing, gasses would build in the top of the stove and then *poof* they'd ignite. this went on for a while, then some wood further back would light up producing actual flames and eventually the poof would come back.

The wood used, BTW was a mix of WHITE oak, black walnut, and some unidentified smaller splits of what may have been maple (probably silver). I should have taken a MC reading before starting, but this was some of the best wood that I have and I would have been surprised if anything was over a very low 20s MC... I should have done more chimney observations, but the few times I was outside, the burn was very clean. I stopped checking after feeding snoopy around midnight, but we can probably assume it didn't start smoking.

I also didn't mention that this was probably about the 4th load of wood run through the stove since I cleaned the ashes out. That means that there were VERY FEW ashes in the bottom when I loaded.

The burn went through the wood front to back VERY evenly, although not at first. The middle of the front splits burnt out until the fire reached the center of the stove (front to back) then everything evened out and the rest just burnt from the top front to the back.

Seeing it burn this well really makes me want to try to add some secondary tubes to see if that middle period where it just cruises forever could really put out something more significant heat-wise for that extended of a time.

 

[Danno77]

Interesting Danno. Maybe I should try that some time and make a graph but usually are not that close to the stove for that length of time.

I was gonna take readings every half an hour or so, but it got addictive. I certainly didn't expect to be up 'til three in the morning. I figured I'd have a nice 6 or 7 hour burn and be done with it. Next time I'll try my experiments during the day.

 

[Big Al]

I had seen those spontaneous combustions in my stove before the mods...a big wave of blue flames fills the fire box. Very infrequent but very cool.

Adding seconday tubes would be a good experiment especially if you could turn them on when you needed them, with some sort of control, for that middle burn section you mentioned. Secondaries only last as long as the wood is giving off gasses though. I'm psyched if I see secondaries for anything over 3 hours.

Makes me want to log some data myself. I would definately need a moisture meter, and recording outside temps is a must too because it all comes into play.

How is your built in pipe/ flue collar damper situated while in the open position? Some at Home depot are straight up 12 o'clock while others are like mine, are partially closed, between 10 and 11 o'clock. I was always curious why this was, how it was "supposed" to be and what real world effct it had on burn times. I guess in theory the wide open ones would burn out somewhat quicker.

 

[Danno77]

How is your built in pipe/ flue collar damper situated while in the open position? Some at Home depot are straight up 12 o'clock while others are like mine, are partially closed, between 10 and 11 o'clock. I was always curious why this was, how it was "supposed" to be and what real world effect it had on burn times. I guess in theory the wide open ones would burn out somewhat quicker.

Mine must be like yours. I have only shut it once or twice, and because it has that weight on it, its either open (well, kinda, like you describe) or closed. I can't fiddle with it unless I maybe put some vice grips on the handle to keep it where I put it. I think it could be useful to be able to damper it down to keep the box temps up.

 

[Big Al]

How is your built in pipe/ flue collar damper situated while in the open position? Some at Home depot are straight up 12 o'clock while others are like mine, are partially closed, between 10 and 11 o'clock. I was always curious why this was, how it was "supposed" to be and what real world effect it had on burn times. I guess in theory the wide open ones would burn out somewhat quicker.

Mine must be like yours. I have only shut it once or twice, and because it has that weight on it, its either open (well, kinda, like you describe) or closed. I can't fiddle with it unless I maybe put some vice grips on the handle to keep it where I put it. I think it could be useful to be able to damper it down to keep the box temps up.

I've had to use mine a couple of times when my draft ran away on me. There's some front to back play on the damper assembly, Maybe 3/8", and if I pull the handle forward and flip the lever to the right it'll catch on one of the sheetmetal screws in my flue collar leaving it about 90% closed. Comes in handy on those rare occasions when I'm not ready to start cutting air (stove top less than 400*) and the damn smoke alarm is going off cuz the single wall pipe is pushing close to 850*. Usually happens on a relaod over a nice bed of coals when the temps are in the teens/low 20's.

Anyway, the srcew is about an inch away from the damper handle in about the 2 o'clock position. i didn't plan it that way but it works. Try yours maybe you'll luck out or take a moment and a 3cent screw and do it up.

 

[begreen]

Ignoring the particulate emissions, I'd say that is very respectable for a small stove. White oak is awesome firewood. You must have done a super job of packing it. Next time take a picture!

 

[Danno77]

Ignoring the particulate emissions, I'd say that is very respectable for a small stove. White oak is awesome firewood. You must have done a super job of packing it. Next time take a picture!

In terms of particulates, it really only had visible (smoke) until it hit around 500 for the first time. When I look back at my chart that seems to be around 40-45 minutes or so. I find that once I get rid of that initial moisture in the wood, then crank it back it doesn't smoke a lot as long as the stove top is above 350. When it's at the end of the cycle and just coals there isn't much smoke either.

I did put a cat in there, but it smoked more AND the neighbors were pissed (cause they claimed it was their favorite pet.) I don't see what all the hype is about.

at any rate, this deal is about a million times better than the open fireplace I was using prior

 

[Jimbob]

Nice chart, Danno. Can you do one up for me?