External Masonry Chimney Draft Fixable with an Insert?

[tpapay]

Looks like trouble and it only works with a northerly wind. The front of the house, shown, faces south.

Yes, an external masonry as far away from the center of the house as possible, and the height is about 26ft which is 5ft less than the height of the house.
Any wind from the E, W or South and it will not draw. When it is working with a N wind and it shifts anywhere S, even with hot masonry, it will back-draft.

Asking for your experience; is there any chance that an insert with an insulated steel flue will work?

 

[WoodpileOCD]

I'm sure the experts will be chiming in here shortly but I'm going to say that it would work fine. Sounds like a prime application for an insulated liner which would, if not completely negate the worry about which way the wind is blowing, certainly not be affected by it like an open fireplace. This is an open fireplace you have now I take it?

 

[Iembalm4aLiving]

With a 6 inch liner and a good fire going in a good insert, you should not have any drafting issues. I have a 24 foot chimney and once my 2200 is going, there's no stopping that draft--high winds, kitchen range hoods, you name it.

AND you'll love the heat and efficiency of a wood burning insert-I tell people that going from an open fireplace to an insert is like trading a Model T for a new Corvette.

My wife tells me it's the best money we've ever spent on our house. (She loves being toasty in the winter without worry of high heating bills.)


Regards,
Greg

 

[cmonSTART]

Without knowing exactly WHY your chimney has draft issues it's hard to say whether it will "fix" the issue or not. It sounds like either some sort of wind induced issue or a house pressure issue, but who knows. A good insulated liner may greatly improve your situation but the underlying factors may still exist. Do make sure the liner is insulated and hook up whatever inset you get with outside air. A properly installed liner will often help, but it's hard to say without being there.

 

[rwhite]

I and others I 'm sure have the same configuration of chimney you have. Mine is about 20' and has no draft issues. Couple of things that I would experience when it was an open fireplace:
1. If the gas furnace was running the make up air vents would pull the draft back into the house. No enough to be smokey but you could smell it. As soon as the furnace went off the fireplace would draft again, mostly pulling all the warm air out of the house. What a miserable loop to be in. I would just shut off the furnace when burning the fireplace. I don't think having a basement with negative pressure helped any either.

2. What is your flue configuration? Mine was a large open masonry flue. An open fireplace and external chimney did not get hot enough to really heat the flue itself. It would heat the air in the flue to get a resonable draft but the masonry was never warm. This made for a very lazy draft that was easily overcome by any wind or the furnace coming on.

Since installing the insert and insulated liner I have not had a single draft issue.

 

[Martin Strand III]

Your chimney height is fine, per the 10-3-2 rule, being 5' shorter than your (distant) main roof.
The issue is the outside cold long 26' chimney for starting fires and, maybe, down drafting when your fire is petering out.
The class A chimney is most likely your best bet but it's a bank account buster with no guarantee.
Other (terrible) choices are to build another room on the other side of the chimney making it inside the building envelope
or sell the house.

Your set up makes me want to cry.

Aye,
Marty

 

[tpapay]

Thanks for the replies, it is encouraging!


Woodpile - It's an open fireplace and here's a pic.

cmonStart - About that external air - there's a floor ash-trap trap that is emptied at almost ground-level outside, is that the entry point for air that you would use?

RWhite - the flue is large full masonry. We haven't noticed the furnace affecting the fire and it uses outside air for combustion.


Thanks again for sharing your experience.

 

[Excavator]

I installed a double wall insulated ss liner and it greatly improved my Vermont Castings burn and control.
I delayed installing this for years because the damper was too small and I need 8 inch pipe for my stove.
After advice from many installers I took their advice and removed the damper and chopped out some of the fire brick to allow a straight drop of 8 inch double wall pipe and insulation and installed clean out T at stove. I fabbed up my own block off plate using fireproof board from lowes

 

[Jackfre]

I removed my insert and installed an Encore in front of the fireplace opening. Point is, you are not limited to an insert only. My liner is an 8" oval Dura-liner system and it operates perfectly...well, when I do my part, and I am still learning how to operate a catylitic stove. With the open fireplace you have no control of draft issues that you will get with an air tight/lined system. "System" being the operative word. I like the Dura-liner system. 6&8" round or oval, preinsulated smooth wall system. Flex liners are the norm, but I have always preferred a smooth walled pipe. What size is your flue tile?

 

[begreen]

Without knowing exactly WHY your chimney has draft issues it's hard to say whether it will "fix" the issue or not. It sounds like either some sort of wind induced issue or a house pressure issue, but who knows. A good insulated liner may greatly improve your situation but the underlying factors may still exist. Do make sure the liner is insulated and hook up whatever inset you get with outside air. A properly installed liner will often help, but it's hard to say without being there.

As usual, excellent advise. An insulated, 20-25' liner correctly installed and connected to a good insert should draft much better, especially with an outside air supply.

 

[clemsonfor]

I HAve a High Valley insert which uses an 8" liner pipe if you use one. I however have it going into my fireplace and up through the existing chimney. The masonry chimney is a double flue lined with 9x13 flue tiles i beleive. I had to block off one tile as it was sucking down one and blowing out the other. It drafts fine and is similar height as yours. I one day will put a liner but dont have the money now and after a few months last year of almost constant fire i saw no more soot than when i used a fireplace.

Im know that most say never run without a liner but i have seen no problems and my guy who sold it who owns the buck stove store said it will be fine as is. Also in the owners manual it says you can do it this way or put a short pipe in to get it into the flue.

 

[tpapay]

Thanks again, everyone.

Jackfre - the flue tile I geusstimate to be 10"x8". It's 6ft up & tough to tape measure, so I measured the width of a broom and stuck that up there.
Firestarter - nice pics.

This is what mine looks like. The damper is 6" wide.

 

[cmonSTART]

If your ash dump opens to the outside that would make a great entry point for your OAK. I would personally try to work with that if possible.

Chimneys meeting the 10-3-2 rule can still be effected by wind and pressure issues.