Lopi Flue questions.

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bullittman281

New Member
Feb 7, 2010
5
Colorado
Hello,
I need some help. I've got an Answer set up as a fire place insert. The fire place is all masonry. I'm running an appropriate SS liner through the masonry tile liner. The SS liner is 6" and the tile liner is rectangular 6"X10" so i had to ovalise the SS liner to get it to fit. I don't remember off hand but I know I have at least 15' of chimney. I've had the stove for 5 years or so. At the time I didn't know any better but I think it performance is sub standard.

I always burn seasoned wood. The current stuff has bean curing for 3 years. It wont get any dryer. I get ~10% on a Harbor Freight moisture meter so I know my problems aren't the wood. I also run the stove very hot at like 700* to 800* trying to keep it burning clean and heat the house. It is a bit undersized but is should still burn clean. It doesn't burn clean though. I have to clean the chimney once a month and even at that rate there are huge barnacles the grow from top to bottom. The whole length of the liner builds up. I have a suspicion but whats my problem? These stoves should not be finicky to run and mine is a monster. Unless everything is perfect the secondary combustion dies out an the thing just smokes and smolders. Or if I'm really lucky the thing gets hot enough to run away and the top will get 900* or more with the air control all the way off. This generally happens after a bout with trying to get it hot enough to keep the secondary combustion lit. The only time is is smoke free is when it runs away, any other time is smokes like a freight train. There is nothing I can do to change it. If I leave the air open so it smokes less it will rapidly over heat. Something is not rite.

I have a suspicion that my problem is the tile liner is mashed against my SS liner and it acts as a big heat sink keeping my flue cold and causing a poor draft. I forget to mention above that my chimney exits the house at the peak of the roof so there is no way the house is acting like a better chimney.
Am I on the rite track thinking that I have poor draft?

I talked to the stove place today to see what they though and they weren't terribly helpful. I got more of the "YAhhH!!!!" salesman pitch but I did ask them about removing my tile liner and insulating my SS liner. Their response was no can do. Per them my insert has to be installed in a code correct fire place. If I remove the tile liner the fire place is no linger to code and therefor the install is no longer to code. All this despite the fact that the tile liner lives inside of another brick structure that probably has a foot of clearance between it an the tile liner. Is there anything I can do to help situation with out completely tearing out the fire place or relocating the insert to a free standing stove? Let me know what you guys thing or would do. I'm kinda at a loss. Sorry for the long post. Thanks guys.

Bullittman
 
I just wanted to bump this up as I am sure somebody will have a suggestion!!

Does your liner go up in a straight shot? Is it squeezed through a damper?
Would some height help? (chimney extension at top?)

I have an insulated liner in a similar height chimney, have no draft problems but haven't cleaned it yet so can't say how that will go.
 
My first thought is this: could your liner have a crack/tear/hole/compromise somewhere in it? This will allow it to pull in cold air, cool the flue gases, and then create a lot of buildup what you would not otherwise see. I would consider hiring a sweep to run a camera down the length of the liner looking for any holes.
 
Hello,
My liner consists of a short piece of flex to make it through the damper but the angle is gentle and it is not pinched. After the damper I have 3 sections of strait seamless SS pipe. All of it is single wall. I had it apart a while back inspecting everything and it all looked good. Nothing was torn or looses or anything that I could see would be a problem. I don't know. I'm fairly convinced if I could insulate the SS liner my problems would vanish but per the stove place that is a no go because of my odd shaped tile liner. Keep the ideas coming. Thanks guys.

Bullittman
 
Busting out the old clay tiles is not against code as long as you insulate the new liner. Another option is poured insulation.
 
Hello,
time for an update. I've been talking with the stove dealers here in town trying to get an idea of what they think my problem is and what the options are. I still haven't got a strait answer to the question of weather or not I can remove the tile liner and wrap insulation around the stove pipe but I did get a couple of suggestions. I also tested out the next larger stove with my fire wood and thermometer.

One of the recommendations was to run will a large bed of coals. I've always tried to minimize my bed of coals to make room for more wood. It looks like more coals do help a bit but its not a miracle. Another one of the suggestions was to insulate the top of my tile liner. I originally had just a piece of sheet metal keeping my SS liner centered but there was no insulation. Today I pulled it apart and wrapped/crammed insulation down and around the SS liner as far as I could an put it back together. Its still to early to tell for sure but is seems to have made a huge difference. The stove seems to get hotter faster and the secondary burn seems to burn better. The inside of the stove also looks like its burning hotter/cleaner as some of the deposits are pealing off or burning to a Grey color.

Something else I learned to day test driving my wood and thermometer on a different stove was how far off my thermometer is. The stove place had both a digital inferred temp gun and their own surface temp thermometer. Mine was off by about 100-150* at normal temps. The 700* I thought I was seeing was closer to 550-600*. Armed with a new thermometer I'll have to see how the stove behaves but so far its looking better. I'm gonna clean the pipe tomorrow so I can monitor how quick it gets dirty. I'm hoping I can make it thought the rest of the winter with out any more cleanings but I will have to wait and see. I'm still open to any ideas so let me know.

Bullittman
 
you should thank your brother-in-law for helping you stuff that insulation down a hot chimney!!! DON't LET THE INSULATION COME IN CONTACT WITH BARE SKIN!!!
 
Does it have a ceramic blanket on top of your baffle. That will help keep the heat in the firebox.
 
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