My new Boiler Guide & Database

[WoodNotOil]

I have been learning relational databasing by using PHP and MySQL and I thought what better application for these new skills than to start the ultimate wood boiler database featuring data on each boiler with the ability for users to enter reviews and comments. Since I hand coded the boiler database it has the ultimate flexibility for me to add fields to include more data and eventually add more features for comparing individual boilers. I have forms for users to enter new brands and boilers, so the content will be driven by you.

My hope is that this will be of use to both existing boiler owners and to those trying to decide what one to get. For the fanatics I have used PHPfusion to add other features to the site like a place to submit articles and directories for retailers and installers that I hope will be taken advantage of. I believe in the gasification technology and I am trying to fill in some of the missing links between the prospective boiler owner and the end result of having a fully functional multiple heat source system with heat storage.

Let me know what works or doesn't work and your suggestions to make this a useful tool for all. Link to my new site is in my sig. Thanks - WNO

 

[Frozen Canuck]

Excellent idea WNO. I look forward to pouring through those pages, should be very helpful real world info.

 

[WoodNotOil]

Thanks Frozen Canuck! I just got it off the ground, so I (and hopefully others) will be adding content continually... I hope you find it of use.

 

[pybyr]

Welcome back, Andrew (haven't seen you around the Boiler Rm. as much lately)-- excellent new site.

 

[jebatty]

On stats provided, it might be a good idea to indicate the source, such as "mfr specs" and what the stat is referring to. For example, one wood boiler is shown as 97% efficient, and it would be very useful to know what this is referring to. I would rather doubt that it means if I put in a log with 8500 gross btu's (about 1 pound) I get delivered hot water to my system of 8245 btu's.

 

[Nofossil]

Looks good. To be fair to the OWB issue, Vermont does not ban OWBs - it has requirements that make some OWB models illegal for sale in Vermont. Having a 'Ban' column and a 'Restrictions' column would present a more complete picture.

 

[WoodNotOil]

Looks good. To be fair to the OWB issue, Vermont does not ban OWBs - it has requirements that make some OWB models illegal for sale in Vermont. Having a 'Ban' column and a 'Restrictions' column would present a more complete picture.

Thanks Nofo, good idea. I have yet to start inputing any details in there and will create two sections based on you rec.

Jebatty - I will add the field you suggested as well. I agree that the efficiency numbers are hard to compare. Likely these all perform at 80% or above, varying based on what is actually being burned. I will add a note about it on the page the list of boilers comes up on. Any suggestions on how that note should read are welcome...

 

[jebatty]

Maybe a non-biased way to handle any specifications would be a lead-in note something like this:

CAUTION: All specifications from supplier-provided information, and specifications among suppliers may not be directly comparable. Please refer to supplier for explanation and detail.

 

[WoodNotOil]

Maybe a non-biased way to handle any specifications would be a lead-in note something like this:

CAUTION: All specifications from supplier-provided information, and specifications among suppliers may not be directly comparable. Please refer to supplier for explanation and detail.

Thanks, I added it to the page. Great suggestions!

 

[Chris Hoskin]

great stuff WNO! Thanks for putting this together. A couple of suggestions:

firebox volumes are shown in 'sq ft' - should be cubic feet

I suggest the addition of a line for safety testing/listing (UL/ULC, etc.)

Also the addition of a line to be able to list any emissions testing (EPA, etc.)

We have good write up discussing the differences between US and European efficiency numbers and test methodologies that you are welcome to re-post in your articles or link to in your links page. Helps explain why a Froling shows 81% here and 90+% in Europe.

thanks again for the great work, I think this is a great addition to the information that is out there and will become a valuable resource for consumers.

Chris

 

[Chris Hoskin]

the efficiency write up is posted on our blog.

 

[WoodNotOil]

I have added the new fields you all suggested. Please send me an email containing the boilers wno# and new info for those fields of existing boilers listed so I can update them. Chris - please send me the title of that blog post and I will put it into an article.

Things are starting to roll now...!

 

[WoodNotOil]

What category do you guys think Greenwood boilers fit in?

 

[stee6043]

Perhaps nit picking - but isn't an EKO boiler technically of the brand "Orlan"? I think EKO is the model.....just thinking....

One thought - when you click on the brand tab and you see all of the types available it might be helpful to list a number of reviews for each model. Kind of like Amazon.com does. It'll help direct people looking for user reviews that may not care about actual model.

 

[WoodNotOil]

Perhaps nit picking - but isn't an EKO boiler technically of the brand "Orlan"? I think EKO is the model.....just thinking....

One thought - when you click on the brand tab and you see all of the types available it might be helpful to list a number of reviews for each model. Kind of like Amazon.com does. It'll help direct people looking for user reviews that may not care about actual model.

I am actually working on the PHP code to come up with a number of reviews and will impliment it as soon as I can. I will also tweak the Orlan brand stuff. There are also PAXO boilers by Orlan listed as well.

 

[Chris Hoskin]

Hi, all listed Scandtec, Froling and Tarm boilers at UL and ULC listed. None are tested to EPA emissions test, I'll get you the relevant European emissions test listings on Monday. It might be helpful to be able to list not just the test standard used, but also the results (ppm or gm/hr). Have a good weekend!

 

[Gooserider]

Also for those of us that have to worry about such things, whether or not the boilers are ASME listed, or have that as an available option...

Gooserider

 

[WoodNotOil]

Also for those of us that have to worry about such things, whether or not the boilers are ASME listed, or have that as an available option...

Gooserider

I changed one of the fields to read "testing/listings" so it can be listed there and I added a field for more details. I am also working on a form for users to edit boiler listings, so users will be able to add these extra pieces of info soon.

 

[sgschwend]

The real gritty for a boimass boiler is based on three things:
1) percent solid fuel conversion to CO2,
2) peak fire temperature,
3) practical delta T of the heat exchanger (a delta T that will work without any bad side effects)

Fuel conversion method does not matter in that regards, it does have an effect on btu generation speed.

Do you have an estimate for when the DB will be ready for user inputs?

 

[WoodNotOil]

The real gritty for a boimass boiler is based on three things:
1) percent solid fuel conversion to CO2,
2) peak fire temperature,
3) practical delta T of the heat exchanger (a delta T that will work without any bad side effects)

Fuel conversion method does not matter in that regards, it does have an effect on btu generation speed.

Do you have an estimate for when the DB will be ready for user inputs?

The add boiler and brand pages are up and running, but you have to register to use it. This has been confusing for some because the message you get when not logged in is unclear. I plan to correct the message today or tomorrow. I am just finishing up the form to edit boiler information. That should be up and running shortly.

 

[Gooserider]

Just took a quick look, not bad for a starting project...

A few minor comments / suggestions...

1. Would be a nice to include a link back to here on the web-links page

2. In addition to the "dealers" page - either as part of it, or a separate page, I'd have a "distributors list" for the people that supply the dealers or that sell to multiple states - like Cozy Heat or AHONA - they don't really fit in the "dealer by state" list model... Certainly you should have a link for each boiler brand to a site appropriate to the "find your local dealer" question.

3. It might be nice if you had some kind of "spreadsheet" list of the boilers so as to make comparison easier... If you wanted to get really fancy allow some sort of selection system, i.e. give me all boilers between X and Y output...

4. Proofreading is needed - I saw a few spelling / grammar problems - such as on the boiler listing header "please contact us via the cantact option" - easy to miss, sometimes getting a second pair of eyeballs on it can help...

Gooserider

 

[WoodNotOil]

Just took a quick look, not bad for a starting project...

A few minor comments / suggestions...

1. Would be a nice to include a link back to here on the web-links page

2. In addition to the "dealers" page - either as part of it, or a separate page, I'd have a "distributors list" for the people that supply the dealers or that sell to multiple states - like Cozy Heat or AHONA - they don't really fit in the "dealer by state" list model... Certainly you should have a link for each boiler brand to a site appropriate to the "find your local dealer" question.

3. It might be nice if you had some kind of "spreadsheet" list of the boilers so as to make comparison easier... If you wanted to get really fancy allow some sort of selection system, i.e. give me all boilers between X and Y output...

4. Proofreading is needed - I saw a few spelling / grammar problems - such as on the boiler listing header "please contact us via the cantact option" - easy to miss, sometimes getting a second pair of eyeballs on it can help...

Gooserider

Thanks Gooserider. All great suggestions. I am on it...

 

[WoodNotOil]

Updates:
1. There is now an edit boiler form that users can use to add/change data listed for boilers. This will help with filling in some of the new fields that have been added.
2. A kinder and more helpful message will appear to users that try to add boilers/brands when they are not logged in.
3. Comments and Reviews buttons now show the number of comments and reviews for each boiler.
4. Web link added for Hearth.com to give credit where it is due...

In the works:
1. I have decided to change the format of the installer and retailer directories, but not exactly sure what form it should take. I have decided to not charge to be in the directory and will likely utilize the articles format which will allow each company/installer to be in a list with a short description and then users can click for a detailed listing. Thoughts are welcome though...
2. I will start work on an option to display boiler information in a table format which will allow users to compare boilers all in one spread sheet. At first this will be displayed by type, but eventually I will come up with a way for users to select specific ones to compare.
3. I am looking for information on OWB bans/restrictions to start putting data on that list. Thoughts on formatting are welcome.
4. I would like to include a description of each type of boiler (ie indoor gasification, indoor non-gasification, etc.). If anyone would like to write one or more of these, it would free my time up to work on these other features.

Thanks for the great help and feedback! - WNO

 

[sgschwend]

EPA has defined an run performance tests, might be a good place to log those values. It would be values you would need to find and enter but would be useful to compare units too, all be it test results. The tests measure the efficiency of a boiler that has been brought up to working temperature then loaded fully, heat output, performance and emissions are measured.

 

[WoodNotOil]

EPA has defined an run performance tests, might be a good place to log those values. It would be values you would need to find and enter but would be useful to compare units too, all be it test results. The tests measure the efficiency of a boiler that has been brought up to working temperature then loaded fully, heat output, performance and emissions are measured.

I wonder where one would get such results? Perhaps the manf./dist. would have it. Hopefully as more of them become aware of the site, they will update the boiler listings and fill in these details. Bioheat has already listed all the boilers they retail... It would be to everyones advantage if other retailers/dist./manf. would do the same. If you have any of this information or come across it, forward it to me or go ahead and enter it yourself using the new edit boiler form. Thanks for the input!