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newbie/ heat storage

Post in 'The Boiler Room - Wood Boilers and Furnaces' started by poppledungeon1, Jun 27, 2013.

  1. poppledungeon1

    poppledungeon1 New Member

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    first post but like many others have been lurking in the shadows, switching from woodstove(fireview) to gasser boiler with pressurized storage=500gal propane tanks x 2 stacked horizontal. Installer suggests 1.5" fittings which makes sense, but any opinions out there about how to plumb otherwise?Currently have oil burner with 4 zones and it also provides DHW via SuperStore, boiler and SuperStore installed ~1990 which I will probably stick with with new wood boiler tied into current manifold. Many thanks to all here who freely share their experience and knowledge, it's been enormously helpful in making many other decisions.

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  2. maple1

    maple1 Minister of Fire

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    I can't think of a reason to go bigger than 1-1/4" on the piping & fittings. That is big enough to handle all the flows & valves etc. cost a lot more at 1-1/2". Not sure what you have for circs, but I'd also suggest using either a Bumble Bee or Alpha for your load circ, and maybe moving your existing load circ to pump from the gasser to storage. Have you picked a boiler yet?
  3. Tennman

    Tennman Minister of Fire

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    Maple's probably right. I have a 60 class and used all 1 1/2" black iron in the manifolds between the boiler and the 1 1/4" underground pex. I will be installing the biggest Laddomat loading unit which has 1 1/4" NPT fittings. I bought all 1 1/2" ball valves and fittings for the black iron manifolds connecting my two 500 gal tanks. 1 1/4" probably would have been fine for all the tank manifolds. But in the overall scheme stepping up to 1 1/2" where I will have lots of elbows, fittings etc it wasn't much of a cost hit relative to the overall cost of adding storage. The schematic with the Laddomat suggests 1 1/4" black iron for all the storage tank manifolds. So, I'm probably overkill, but stepping up a size is in the noise as far as my total system install cost. Flip a coin.... If your boiler is less than a 60 class then it's a no-brainer. Go 1 1/4". Best wishes.
  4. henfruit

    henfruit Minister of Fire

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    What size boiler are you installing? 40 kw= 1.25 pipe 60 kw= 1.50 pipe
  5. JP11

    JP11 Minister of Fire

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    I'll repeat what my contractor buddy always says.. You never know for sure overkill. You ALWAYS discover underkill.

    For the price difference.. 1.5

    I used 1.5 from boiler to tanks. 1.25 from tanks to house loads. Very similar setup to original poster.

    JP
  6. BoilerMan

    BoilerMan Minister of Fire

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    WELCOME!

    Do the math, there are flow charts all over the internet with min and max velocities which are suitable for hydronic heating. 2-4 feet/second flow velocities are what is considered the butter zone. As Maple suggested a Taco BumbleBee would make a nice circ for the boiler, depending on what the flow requirements are. It helps to know what you have for existing equipment too. Also keep in mind the internal diameter of PEX is considerably smaller than that of copper pipe. For example: you have a long underground run of PEX, 1.25" is really like 1.125" copper as far as flow is concerned.

    Black Iron vs. Copper is a personal preference if you ask me. They both have advantages and disadvantages which may be beyond our scope here.

    Let us know what you get for a boiler, and how you have your storage setup/piped.

    TS
    mikefrommaine and Floydian like this.
  7. Floydian

    Floydian Feeling the Heat

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    The first step in any properly designed system, IMO.

    Noah
    BoilerMan and mikefrommaine like this.
  8. poppledungeon1

    poppledungeon1 New Member

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    As far as the boiler, I'm pretty set on the Frohling 50.
  9. BoilerMan

    BoilerMan Minister of Fire

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    Great boiler! What piping setup do you plan on having? Piping the boiler directly to storage with return protection and then piping out of storae to loads, is generally what most on here do and works well. Basically the storage is a huge hydraulic seperator.

    TS
  10. hiker88

    hiker88 Burning Hunk

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  11. tmudd

    tmudd Member

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    Coning on my second season with a Frohling 50.It is world class machine . I wrestled about with all those decisions about size, storage and manifold size. Do your homework from the archives here and size it. For me the Frohling had the capacity to transfer 1000 ( 2Stacked 500 gallons) of storage.
    With 1 1/2 " ports. I have a loading unit that loads storage. I used a 3 port manifold of 1 1/2" form the boiler to storage. I tend to be of the school that larger volumes and a slower rate is a good way to move water. I f your boiler has the horsepower that you might as well use it. Still can't say enough good about what a great bunch of boiler folks that are so helpful here. Keep us posted on your decisions and progress..

    T-boy

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