Please advise on stove choice

[bemmett]

We are currently heating our house with a natural gas boiler and wood heat from an old Atlantic 224. The Atlantic is ineffecient, dirty and not kicking out enough heat to really warm the house. We are thinking of upgrading and deciding betweeen a moderate size Jotul CB 118 or a larger Hearthstone Phoenix. The stove will be placed in an old, not well insulated 1500sqft farmhouse in a central room, near the staircase. The floor plan is somewhat open, but not ideal. We would greatly appreciate any advice on if the smaller stove will be large enough to throw heat to other rooms, or if the larger phoenix will sweat us out of the living area. Although we don't mind being toasty warm either
Thanks!

 

[Rhone]

Where do you live, in the Berkshires? Seriously if you haven't upgraded the house you can go monstrous and still find it difficult to keep up. When I purchased my 1,400 sq ft ranch everyone was laughing at me for purchasing the Hearthstone Clydesdale saying it is way too much stove for that small space. Well, it wasn't. To keep the house at 68 I had to fill it up 4x a day, glad I didn't go smaller! I had 3" insulation in the attic, old windows some single-pane, and a few windows that were broken open (they wouldn't shut completely). I've since replaced most of the broken windows with high efficiency ones, purchased insulated curtains, air sealed like you wouldn't imagine, insulated the walkout wall of my basement, and increased the insulation in my attic to R55. Now, when I light a fire and it's a 30F night my house will increase in temperature 8-14F and that's minimum load most efficient air setting. When it's 0-20F I light 3 fires a day to keep the house 68-75F now, and if it's windy and 20F or less I need to have 4 fires/day, tells me my house is leaky (I can feel the wind blowing in through some outlets). My house, was built in 1962, imagine if yours is older when they didn't even use top plates for the walls.

So, if you want my opinion you need to go as big as you can afford... I'd look for a Century stove like Brother Bart has, bang for buck it's hard to beat the BTU's you get out of it. I think with the two you mentioned, either one is going to be woefully underpowered and think of it more like, keeping your house warm in spring & fall, and to supplement your heat in winter if your old farmhouse is what I'm thinking and you do live in the Berkshires.

 

[bemmett]

Yes, we are in the berkshires and you aren't far off the mark on the type of house. There are some replacement windows and some old ones that don't close. We have blown in cellulose in the walls and attic. I've been replacing rotting sills, jacking the house up and down, so things are more drafty this year than usual. We intend to work away at improving the efficeincy, so are we still looking at too small a stove?

 

[MountainStoveGuy]

I think i would go with the phoenix in that situation, the soapstone will help moderate the heat and not roast you in the lower living space, but have enough capacity to heat the overall 1500 squares if you need it to. The phonex size stove is about the smallest stoves that you can get overnight burns in with hardwood.

 

[Rhone]

I also recommend the Phoenix then. Something around a 2.2 - 3.0 cu ft firebox. Good job with the blown in the walls and attic, it can turn even old farmhouses surprisingly efficient (as long as it wasn't the old blown stuff that settled to the bottom of the walls). Don't pay attention to the "MAX BTU's" of a stove, which is like giving the top speed of a car... if you run the stove at the max btu's your stove will be shot in short order. Some people did the math on the MAX Btu's a manufature rated and determined you'd need to have the stove glowing red. You can't really use the square footage either. A stove that says it can heat 1500 square feet will be woefully underpowered heating an 1800's 1,500 sq ft non-upgraded farm house in Northern Maine vs. a 1500 sq ft super efficient house made this year in Tenn. The cu ft of the firebox is your best guide. With the upgrades you mention, and as MSG pointed out a 2.2 cu ft firebox is about the smallest you can go and reliably still have an overnight burn. The Phoenix is probably going to be just fine for overnight burns etc. if you use hard woods like hickory, oak, black locust, apple, beech, sugar maple. If you're burning the quick stuff like maple (besides sugar), birch, pine, cedar, you should go larger if you want an overnight burn. Many forum members usually save the hot and long burning stuff like the oak and locust for winter, and burn the quick stuff like birch, and elm for spring & fall.

 

[begreen]

hey berkshires, welcome. where are you at? I used to live in Cornwall, CT. Still love those hills. Good to hear that you are tightening up the old house.

Another soapstone stove to consider might be a Woodstock stove. There is an installation in Millbrook, NY - NYSoapstone is his handle here on the forum. You might want to consider that stove if you are not opposed to owning a cat stove. They are offering some good pricing until the end of next week.

 

[bemmett]

I'm not very familiar with catalytic stoves. A few questions are 1) how does the effeciency compare? 2) during the moderate season can I burn smaller fires to moderate heat output? and 3) if forced to burn not fully seasoned wood, e.g. somewhat green ash, will I kill the stove?

 

[bemmett]

Also thanks everyone for the welcome and great info, I'm in Lee, MA and the hills are great. Plenty of wood too!

 

[begreen]

Good questions. Most cat stoves burn cleaner and are very efficient due to more complete combustion. Yes, you can run smaller fires. Yes, the stove will require good, dry wood. Though this is a good idea with any stove if you want to keep the chimney clean.

I'm not pushing the idea of a cat stove, just trying to present the options. There are lots. One question. Is the chimney interior or exterior?

 

[Harley]

I don't think the Phoenix is going to be too big for your situation at all. The Hearthstone dealer in Pittsfield was very helpful when I bought my Heritage last year. I'm sure you will really love the stove.

 

[bemmett]

The chimney is interior with a 6" ovalized steel liner. I think the hearthstones fit my space a litte better. I'm getting more and more psyched for a soapstone.

 

[mikeathens]

I just got a heritage last week, and I love it. It is simple to operate and has good heat output. You might want to consider the heritage - I have found already that you can get a good, clean, efficient burn with less than a full load. It is easy to get back up to temperature and get burning nice and efficient even after your coal bed has dwindled.

However...I am partial to catalytics. I like the efficiency, and your chimney temperatures will be about half that of a non-cat (sometimes even less than half), even when you have a blazing fire inside with the catalyst engaged. But, I think you'd love the heritage. Like I said, you can run it cooler most of the time and then have the extra capacity to really fire it up when the temperature plummets.

I have a moderately/poorly insulated 1800 SF house, built in the 1870's. You can feel cold coming through the walls sometimes, and I have trouble keeping the root cellar (directly under our main room) above 35 when it's -10 F out. That makes for chilly floors Had an insulating contractor show up yesterday, though, so hopefully that will be a thing of the past in a month or so.

Good luck with the stove