Question on outdoor fireplace, landscape block, and fire brick

[mbcijim]

We are in the process of building an outdoor patio. Purely for social enjoyment not for heating at all.

We are building into the patio a firepit. I'd love any suggestions. The patio consists of pavers and landscape block.

Diameter of the fire pit?
What to put on the bottom of the fire pit? Just leave it sand?
How much do I lower the pit as compared to the pavers? Right now, I am thinking one block deep. I was going to come above pavers by one block. Essentially that would leave me about a 16" deep fire pit. I thought any deeper and I would have to have a huge fire to see it.
Construction Detail - the plan is landsape block on the outside and I was going to buy fire brick to put inside. I thought that would keep the landscape block from cracking. Somebody wants me to use a tire rim, but the home is what many would call a small McMansion and a tire rim isn't really appropriate. Comments?

 

[Bone1099]

Hey I'm no plumber but i would build a nice fireplace on one end with a stone or brick/block chimney to draw the smoke away from the guests you are entertaining it will block a bit of wind and the draft will stir the fire so that the fire will burn hotter than any pit. You can also incorporate into the same flue a nice smoker/cooker using coals from the fireplace to cook your food if you google wilber bbq smoker you can find some nice ideas on how to build an awesome smoker and fireplace and why not join it to the house with some sort of counter top between the house and the fireplace assuming it is 90 degrees to the house with a bit of covered storage may be enough to store some semi dry fire wood for outings. anyways thats my two cents worth. Sorry sometimes talking to me is like sipping from a fire hose.

 

[gpcollen1]

I would be concerned about the proximity to the house and the prevailing winds. The lower you keep the pit, the less wind it actually gets to the fire - smoke will catch the wind regardless. I would definitely do the firebrick - NO rim.

I have been waffling between a pit of sorts, an outdoor fireplace where I could have a nice fire and cook [smoke up a short chimney to get it away] or an outdoor wood oven. Have not decided yet...

 

[mbcijim]

My house has almost NO wind. If it is 50 MPH 500 yards away, it is 10 MPH at my house. I can't really explain it, quite frankly, it doesn't make sense.

It is only going to be about 8" below grade, I hear the point about making sure it has enough air.

Does anyone have any suggestions on how to attach the fire brick? I've read not to use the adhesive caulk because it will melt.

Still very open for suggestions anyone.

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Jim, You'll have to post some pic's after you are done with your firepit/install.
I am looking to build one myself, but don't really have any idea's about where to start...just know what I want it to look like when its all done

 

[daveswoodhauler]

Have access to about 220 brick pavers....do you think I could mortar and make a small firepit?
Wondering how it would hold up to the temps?

 

[Gooserider]

First off, I would suggest checking w/ your local code officials and / or fire dept. Lots of places will have rules about open burning, and can give you better ideas about what is and isn't going to be allowed in terms of size, distances from houses and other combustibles, construction, and so forth.... Not saying I approve of such rules, but it's far easier to find out what's acceptable first than it is to have to rebuild something later... (note, in many cases the rules may be different for "cooking fires" than they are for just plain fires - tell them it's a cookfire pit, and make sure there are some packages of hot dogs and / or marshmallows and sticks in evidence while burning)

That said, I would suggest the following as a first guess..

1. I'd like to see a rim at least 6-8" tall - discourage people from accidentally stepping in it when not burning, keep things from falling in, etc...

2. Make sure you dig it down deep enough to get to non-organic subsoil, fill back up with sand and or gravel as needed, possibly put a layer of bricks on the bottom - Make sure it can drain - it's really hard to build a fire in a puddle :red:

3. As long as the fire size stays reasonable, you probably won't have much trouble with just using cement pavers or blocks - the sides of a fire pit don't get that hot... The idea of using an old truck tire rim as a liner for the pit and then prettying it up by putting blocks around it doesn't seem like a bad one.

4. Dry stacking will do for making the ring, but if you want to use some sort of adhesive, my understanding is that you can get away with standard mortar, though refractory mortar is perhaps preferable...

5. I would second some of the other comments in favor of a fireplace or equivalent over a pit - a fire place will get most of the smoke over the heads of your guests, while a pit will tend to leave someone standing in the smoke - though it can be amusing to watch the manuvering to avoid it...

Gooserider

 

[SolarAndWood]

The concrete companies here make 6' x 2' x 2' blocks out of the extra concrete left in the trucks when they return. They are a lot cheaper than pouring concrete. My landscaper uses them for all of the bases of his material sheds and stand up to the abuse of both the materials and equipment. They would box out a nice pit that you could then face on the outside. The inside will get coated with fire/ash. etc no matter what you use. Even without wind, you want this a long way from any windows that might ever get opened unless you buy one of the units with a chimney. Outdoor fires seem to be attracting a lot of attention lately.

 

[mbcijim]

Gooserider, thanks for the tips. I think I am doing all of your tips actually.

I called a mason friend (with 40 years experience) about this, here's what he told me:

1. Use fire bricks, he is going to get me some that he uses when making a fire place.
2. I can use regular mortar.

I wish I would have thought of the fireplace idea before you guys suggested it. Too far down the path to change it now. It would be easy to get rid of the firepit later. Maybe I'll incorporate the fireplace into the future hot tub idea.

 

[mbcijim]

Have access to about 220 brick pavers....do you think I could mortar and make a small firepit?
Wondering how it would hold up to the temps?

If you keep the fire far enough away from the pavers it probably won't matter.
If you google (or flickr) 'outdoor fireplace picture' you'll get hundreds of ideas.