Question Regarding Fires and Overburn

[sheepdog000]

I got a really nice fire going last night. It was so hot that when I went to pour a little extra water into the little steam pot I have on the top, that some spilled and boiled & evaporated in a couple seconds. All it left behind was the calcium from the well water, which cleans up easily. ALSO, the drywall behind my stove was VERY hot to the touch. I believe I am in specs here as I had a stove company put everything in for me. My Shelburn states with rear heat shield and double wall pipe, I can be 6" from drywall. I'm actually about 8.5" away. I don't have a base to know what is "normal." I'm going to call around tomorrow to find a magnetic thermostat for double wall pipe and a humidity thingamabober for measuring moisture content in wood.

I piled the wood in my stove and let er rip wide open. Then after the fire was going real good, I closed the flue half way and went to bed. I had some decent coals in the morning. I had to leave the door open an inch to get the fire going real good (O2 flow) but only do that when I'm right there to watch it. The wood is DRY. I bought some cord wood for bonfires last summer, and it's been in my shed ever since. When I split it down smaller, you heard the "CRACK" when it split, so I know it's dry. Plus, it's hollow sounding.

I want to avoid cherrying out my stove, or over-burn as I believe it's called in here. I just would like to know what not to do so I can avoid it. Thanks in advance.

 

[begreen]

As noted in another thread, double-wall pipe does radiate heat, just not as much as single-wall. A stovetop thermometer would be the first thing I'd get. For the flue pipe you would need a probe type thermometer. Surface thermometers are inaccurate on double-wall pipe.

FWIW, your drywall is safe up to about 170F. If you can hold your hand on the wall briefly, say for a second or two, it is not close to this temperature.

 

[Beardog]

Get a stove thermometer,lots of people use Rutland, and put it on your stove where your owners manual says to put it. Also in your manual will likely be the temperature that could overfire your stove; don't let the stove get hotter than that.

 

[firefighterjake]

Random thoughts . . .

The first time your stove really gets cranking and you see the Bowels of Hell and start feeling around and discovering that your wall is warm or even hot to the touch can be a little disconcerting . . . even if you did what I did by installing your stove more than the minimum distance to combustibles . . . as BeGreen said . . . generally if you can put your handson the wall and hold it there for a second or two you're golden . . . but if you are still concerned you can pick up a cheap Infrared Temperature Gun at a place like Harbor Freight for $20 or $30 or so . . . which you can then use to measure the temp of the wall, stove, hearth, dog, wife, etc.

I'm a big fan of thermometers . . . I have two Condar thermometers for my stove and double wall stove pipe . . . which I actually use for two purposes -- 1) to insure I am burning in the Goldilocks Zone of not burning too hot or too cool (too cool = creosote production and too hot = creosote can ignite . . . not to mention that having one on the stove also allows me to keep the stove away from the overfire (cherry) temps and 2) I use my thermometers to help control my stove by knowing at what temp it is at and where it needs to go (i.e. when to close the side door, when to start adjusting the air control, etc.)

As mentioned a magnetic thermometer on double wall pipe isn't all that useful . . . you will need a probe style thermometer . . . which involves some drilling . . . which may sound scarier than it is . . . if you're safe to cut paper with scissors and have an electric or cordless drill and the proper sized drill bits you can do this in 5-10 minutes.

You mentioned leaving the door open to get the fire going . . . I would wager that this is pretty common with a lot of us . . . at least on the initial start up . . . just be sure that it is the door to the firebox and not the ash pan door if your model has an ash pan . . . using an ash pan door in this manner can lead to the stove being damaged.

Half shut air control . . . while each set up is different I would guess that you may even be able to shut the air control even more . . . perhaps down to the quarter mark or so . . . and if the wood is good and temps are right you may see what your stove can really do for heat production . . . and will probably see the not-so-fabled secondary burn in action (aka the Bowels of Hell, Northern Lights, etc.)

I should mention that honestly the sound of the wood is not always a be-all, tell-all sign that your wood is seasoned . . . but that said . . . it's a good sign . . . along with the fact that your wood is over a year old from being bucked up, split and stacked . . . it sounds as though it should be decent wood.

Avoiding damaging your stove . . . watch your temps . . . getting some thermometers is a big help . . . without them you really have no baseline as to what is too hot for the stove and stove pipe and what is running too cool . . . running too cool can be just as bad as running too hot. Learning how to run the stove is also useful . . . this is a good time to experiment with the stove and learn how it works and what happens when you adjust the air. I would also recommend you find (when the stove is cool) where your primary air comes into the stove -- if you ever do find your stove is running away from you knowing where this is and having a small piece of tinfoil on hand can really shut down your stove fast. Finally, be aware that a large part in controlling the heat from your stove is what you load in your stove -- if you load it to the gills with small splits or toss a bunch of wood on to very large coals or before the fire has reached the late coaling stage (for me this is when the coals are the size of baseballs or softballs) you can overfire your stove . . .

 

[My Oslo heats my home]

Good read Jake, almost like you wrote page 2 for a stove manual

 

[Stump_Branch]

Id love to be able to see my stack temps. But no way i could get a thermo 18 in. Away. Right now its rear vent into a T connected to liner. Could i probe the T like off the side? Would this be close to accurate?

 

[sheepdog000]

firefighterjake, wow, great read! I don't know much about fires. Thats why one of our firefighters teases me and states that if I'd of scored a couple of points higher on my civil service exam, I'd be putting out fires and not pushing a patrol car. :lol: I told him I was happy where I was at as only Hookers & Firefighters make their living on their backs........ ;-P

I am learning to make small fires. This isn't my bonfire pit where I throw some used motor oil and a little gas on it, throw a match and walk away. I have firesticks I think their called. I cut it in half, make a tee-pee around it with kindling, and then when that it going pretty good, I put in some wood and pray like crazy. I have it wide open at this time and the door cracked just a hair. I find myself really having a hard time getting those coals going. I have to blow on them and wait. After about an hour or an hour and a half, I finally have a nice fire going and I close the door, damper it down half way, then go to bed. I wake up cold and check the stove and it's cold. Only a couple small embers. Not enough to get a fire going. I feel like a complete idiot.

I'll look into the thermometers today. Nobody sells the plunge style for double walls around there that I know of. I'll order one if I have to. I'll get one that magnets to the stove today though. Menards has em.

You guys are great, thanks so much for your your good advice. If I can ever absorb all the wealth of information in these forums, I'll be warm and safe.

 

[firefighterjake]

firefighterjake, wow, great read! I don't know much about fires. Thats why one of our firefighters teases me and states that if I'd of scored a couple of points higher on my civil service exam, I'd be putting out fires and not pushing a patrol car. :lol: I told him I was happy where I was at as only Hookers & Firefighters make their living on their backs........ ;-P Oh, we're often on our hands and knees as well . . .

I am learning to make small fires. This isn't my bonfire pit where I throw some used motor oil and a little gas on it, throw a match and walk away. I have firesticks I think their called. I cut it in half, make a tee-pee around it with kindling, and then when that it going pretty good, I put in some wood and pray like crazy. I have it wide open at this time and the door cracked just a hair. I find myself really having a hard time getting those coals going. I have to blow on them and wait. After about an hour or an hour and a half, I finally have a nice fire going and I close the door, damper it down half way, then go to bed. I wake up cold and check the stove and it's cold. Only a couple small embers. Not enough to get a fire going. I feel like a complete idiot. A few items . . . first . . . do a search here for top down fires -- it is a different way of starting a fire . . . it has the advantage of building the fire all at once and not having to spend lots of time adding more wood or adjusting things . . . it also tends to warm the flue faster and establish a draft quickly. It took me a few times to get the knack of it, but now that's all I use to light my fires -- it works much better than the teepee or Lincoln Log Cabin fire starting method. Second . . . two words . . . Super Cedars. These miracle hockey pucks are made by one of our members and last I knew he was selling them to us at a 15% discount . . . I always was all about free and cheap and thought there was no need to abandon my beloved balls of newspaper . . . until I learned how easy it was to start a fire with just a quarter of these Super Cedars. Third . . . if your wood is good and you have a decent draft there is a good chance you will eventually be able to decrease the air control even more . . . and still burn safely and efficiently . . . leaving the air control open half way means that a lot more of the heat will go up the chimney and you will not get as long a burn time. Finally, don't feel like such an idiot . . . I mean you are a law enforcement officer, so it's understandable . . . but more important we all started out as novices and learned from each other. Keep asking questions.

I'll look into the thermometers today. Nobody sells the plunge style for double walls around there that I know of. I'll order one if I have to. I'll get one that magnets to the stove today though. Menards has em. Probe style . . . I've had good luck with my Condar thermometers . . . you may either have to order one on-line . . . you might be able to find one at a stove shop.

You guys are great, thanks so much for your your good advice. If I can ever absorb all the wealth of information in these forums, I'll be warm and safe. Keep asking questions . . . it's the fastest and surest way to learn quickly Brother.

 

[Stump_Branch]

Id love to be able to see my stack temps. But no way i could get a thermo 18 in. Away. Right now its rear vent into a T connected to liner. Could i probe the T like off the side? Would this be close to accurate?

Any thoughts or opinions?