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Simpson DuraVent > Jotul 602 B

Post in 'Classic Wood Stove Forums (prior to approx. 1993)' started by Psuedotsuga, Oct 9, 2011.

  1. Psuedotsuga

    Psuedotsuga New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2011
    Messages:
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    Loc:
    Durango, CO
    Hi all. I'm new to this site and hope to gain some valuable knowledge here.

    I just picked up an old Jotul 602 B and new Simpson DuraVent Duratech 6" insulated chimney pipe. The 602 B is stamped 1980 and has a dark green enamel finish.

    I have an unusual installation...we live in a yurt (see www.coloradoyurt.com for info if you're unfamiliar with yurts). I'm installing the stove and chimney myslef and have a few questions.

    1. Because the yurt wall is different than a nomal stick-built wall, I'm not planning to use a wall thimble (the yurt company provides a steel pipe outlet). Therefore, it would be difficult to transition from interior black stove pipe to exterior chimney pipe. So, I'm planning to use chimney pipe for the entire installation (interior and exterior). Does this pose any problems? Is it alright to attach the insulated Duratech pipe to the stove outlet? Or should I plan on transitioning from stove pipe to chimney somehow (I've seen it done on other yurts and know it's possible with the right parts)?

    2. We have wood floors. What materials are acceptable for the hearth? Hearth dimensions? Thickness?

    3. We live in spruce/fir/aspen at 8300' in Colorado. Which of these species are preferred for burning in the Jotul? We also have access to gambel oak, pinon, and juniper, which I'm thinking might burn better/longer...thoughts?

    4. Any tips on firing the 602 B?

    5. The 602 has some surface rust on the dark green enamel and on the cook plate...best ways to clean/remove rust?

    Any advice would be appreciated. We can't wait to try out the stove!
    Thanks!

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  2. Nonprophet

    Nonprophet Minister of Fire

    Joined:
    Jan 27, 2009
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    Loc:
    Oregon
    Hi,

    Fellow yurt dweller and wood burner here--we have a 30' Pacific Yurt.

    My first questions would be:

    1. How big is your yurt?
    2. Do you have the roof and wall insulation package?

    Depending on your answer to those two questions, you may find that the Jotul 602 is just not going to produce enough heat for your needs. Because of the tall ceiling and the minimal R-value of the insulation packages for most yurts, in my experience you're going to want to at least double the square footage figure when figuring out the rated heat output of a wood stove for your needs. For example, our 30' yurt is 740 sq ft, but I wouldn't even think about using a stove rated for less that 1,400 sq ft, especially if at high elevation and/or cold conditions (i.e. 20 degrees and colder), most likely what you're going to experience in Durango (I used to live in Boulder...).

    We used both a Jotul Oslo and a VC Defiant-Encore in our yurt. Both of those stoves are rated to heat somewhere between 1,600-2,200 sq ft.--I don't have the specs right in front of me. While we were warm using both stoves, we were hardly toasty--the interior temps at night would average around 70-75 when the outside temps were about 30, and our yurt is sheltered from the wind and has 3" solid foam core insulated floors.

    I have used both single wall and class A double wall exterior pipe for the external chimney--I'll tell you more about that once we have a better idea of the space you're trying to heat.


    NP
  3. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

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    Messages:
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    Loc:
    South Puget Sound, WA
    I was thinking the same thing. The 602 might be able to produce enough heat, but you would be filling it hourly when it gets very cold and windy. For connecting the stove in a yurt, here are some shots of an installation I helped a friend with. We used 45's to soften the exit angle to compensate for the shorter flue. The thimble kit is from Simpson, adapted with a custom metal trim plate. I think this is a 24' diameter yurt, with insulation. They've heated it with the Morso 2110 with temps in the teens.

    http://www.hearth.com/econtent/index.php/forums/viewthread/27154/
  4. Psuedotsuga

    Psuedotsuga New Member

    Joined:
    Oct 6, 2011
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    Loc:
    Durango, CO
    Nonprophet,

    Our yurt is 24' diameter (approximately 450 sf). We have the standard foil/bubble wrap insulation provided by the yurt company. It has a pretty low R value.

    I chose the 602 because it's so compact and we also have a Vermont Castings Stardance gas heat stove converted to propane. Other yurt dwellers around here have told us that their wood stoves were too hot in the small space.

    I guess we'll find out this winter. We could always switch to a larger stove if we find it lacking.

    Thanks.
  5. Psuedotsuga

    Psuedotsuga New Member

    Joined:
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    Loc:
    Durango, CO
    Begreen,

    Thanks for the info and photos. That's a nice installation; I like the custom wall treatment.

    Because the 602 has a rear outlet, I was planning to go straight out through the wall and then 90-degree elbow up. I have about 15' of Duratech for the vertical section of chimney.

    Any advice on my previously posted questions?

    Thanks.
  6. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

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    48,191
    Loc:
    South Puget Sound, WA
    It gets warm under the 602. I don't have the original manual, but this is a place I wouldn't fudge. It should be put on a good hearth pad (not just a cheap metal one) that extends all the way to the yurt wall behind the stove, at least 8" to each side and at least 16" in front of the stove. In the least I would use something like a sheet of metal on top of a layer of full bricks.

    Have you inspected the inside of the stove? You don't want to run it much if the side burn plates or top baffle are warped or cracked. Be sure to put a layer of sand or wood ashes in the bottom of the stove before firing. And make your first fires small break-in fires.

    For wood, high altitude spruce or the oak would probably be the best for burn times. In milder weather the stove will go about 2-3 hrs between refills. In very cold weather, I wasn't exaggerating about feeding it hourly. We have one in our 240 sq ft greenhouse and it maintained about 50 degrees inside, while burning hardwood, when it was 15 deg outside. The older 602's need full air to start the fire. Once a coal bed is established, close the air down almost all the way. Just a 1/16" opening makes a big difference, especially if this stove is starting to leak a little at the seams. The stove will take off like a rocket with just a 1/4" opening on the air control. Get a thermometer for the hot plate so that you can control better. It's easy to overfire this little baby if you aren't paying attention.
  7. Psuedotsuga

    Psuedotsuga New Member

    Joined:
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    Loc:
    Durango, CO
    Thanks for all the helpful advice. I appreciate it!
  8. Nonprophet

    Nonprophet Minister of Fire

    Joined:
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    517
    Loc:
    Oregon
    On our top venting stoves, we came up about 4' with single wall, then went into a 90 degree single wall elbow, crimped both ends of the elbow, and fitted the other end directly into the female end of a 4' piece of 6" SS Class A pipe (it fits perfectly) that went horizontally through the yurt wall and into a "T" outside, then straight up with the rest of the Class A pipe. In my opinion, it's worth trying to use as much single wall as possible inside because you will get much more heat out of the single wall pipe.

    Aren't the 602's capable of a rear or top vent configuration? I thought they had a movable plate where you could vent them either way...

    NP
  9. Psuedotsuga

    Psuedotsuga New Member

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    Loc:
    Durango, CO
    Yes, they do vent either top or rear and I was planning on going straight out the back, through the wall, and then 90 up. Thanks for the info.
  10. Nonprophet

    Nonprophet Minister of Fire

    Joined:
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    Oregon
    I think I'd really consider venting off the top--that way you get to use more single wall inside the yurt the create more heat, I think you'd be surprised how much heat a 4' or so length of single wall pipe can generate. Plus, I think it would draft better if you went straight up for a bit first--gives the smoke more "momentum" before going into a 90 degree turn, but that's just my opinion!


    NP
  11. Psuedotsuga

    Psuedotsuga New Member

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    Durango, CO
    Thanks for the advice. I'll give that some thought, especially because the old 602 B is set up to top vent right now and the rusted/creosote-covered screws won't budge!
  12. Psuedotsuga

    Psuedotsuga New Member

    Joined:
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    Loc:
    Durango, CO
    Hi again.

    Should the sand go under the bottom burn plate? Do I need to remove that plate to lay the sand? I used some cleaning products on the stove to remove rust and loosen screws, so I was thinking about firing it outside (not connected to any pipe) to burn off the contaminants before installing it inside. Would that pose any problems? I assume there wouldn't be much of a draft, but it just needs to heat enough to clean the oil and cleaner out.

    Thanks.
  13. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

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    No, the sand or a bed of ash is at the bottom of the firebox. Don't remove the bottom burn plate for this. There is already a thin layer of insulation there.

    No problem burning outside with a 4-6' piece of pipe.
  14. Psuedotsuga

    Psuedotsuga New Member

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    Well, you guys weren't kidding...third night burning in the 602...this little guy likes to be fed! If loaded with the largest possible single split and with the damper almost closed, I can still have coals 5-6 hours later, but the stove doesn't produce much heat during that slow burn. It seems like keeping the damper half way open produces much better heat output, but burns through the wood fast.

    I'm burning Lodgepole Pine right now, so maybe denser wood would help. And I know rounds may also be better than splits, so I'll try that. The low temp outside has been around 10-20 degrees. Our propane heater kicks on after the 602 burns out, but it'd be nice to get more sustained warmth from the woodstove.

    I'll have to keep experimenting...any more advice?

    Thanks again!
  15. begreen

    begreen Mooderator Staff Member

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    You are getting about the best this little stove will do. See if you can get some dry high altitude spruce or tamarack (larch) for a bit longer burn.

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