Turbulator types/ efficiencies/ whether to do a full scrub?

[pybyr]

Is anyone aware of any information relating to how different types of turbulators (chain, swirl, others I may not know of...) compare in their effect on efficiency of a fire-tube boiler?

The reason that I ask is that my least favorite aspect of my Econoburn 150 is the wrestling match that I need to get into in order to pull the turbulators so that I can scrub the fire tubes.

The boiler comes with a side lever to move the turbs up and down to accomplish some cleaning, and that works to a point, but does not manage to completely scrape all of the surface of the tubes. So once a year, prior to heating season, I like to pull the turbs and scrub the tubes (and I do remove some buildup that the lever arrangement does not displace).

On the Econoburn design, that means not only pulling a top plate, but also pulling a back plate that includes the flue outlet, then undoing several bolts on the lever/turb linkages, and then convincing all the turbulator strips to all go in the same direction while clearing some close quarters to the lever linkage.

I get better each time I do it, but it's still a real pain, and I do sometimes consider leaving the OEM turbulators out and putting some chain turbulators in- so that I could simply remove the top plate, lift the chains out, and run a brush down in.

Or, another question- does anyone have any information on how much it may or may not matter (efficiency wise) to do the "deep scrub" that I do vs. simply letting the turbulator spiral/ lever mechanism do a less thorough scrub? I am not sure how much a thin partial coat of ash/ creosote really affects the fire tubes' efficiency at transferring heat to the water.

Thanks

 

[kabbott]

I really can't answer your question... If you have a means to measure the exhaust temp you may want to check what the before/after cleaning temps are.
This will give some idea of if/when cleaning is needed. One of the reasons I went with the Varmebaronen and possibly it's best selling point is the ease of
cleaning. They recommend cleaning when the flue gas temp rises 25 C above the cleaned boiler temp.

 

[Singed Eyebrows]

Is it possible to make a chain/spiral turbulator? You could cut the OEM turbs in small sections & put a link between them & when in the tube they should still scrub the tube without bunching. They should then remove like a chain for better cleaning. My non expert guess is that clean tubes transfer heat a lot better than ones with even a thin layer of buildup. I wish I had this problem, my plate type exchanger on the Atmos is iffy at best, Randy

 

[willworkforwood]

The reason that I ask is that my least favorite aspect of my Econoburn 150 is the wrestling match that I need to get into in order to pull the turbulators so that I can scrub the fire tubes.
Thanks

Similar story here. The turbs came out ok this year, but there is WAY too much time required to break everything down and reassemble. Because of this, my primary issue is not being able to clean the tubes during the burning season. So, first I asked Dale about substituting chain for the spirals. He said they have tried that at the factory but it didn't break up the laminar flow well enough, and stack temps went up (i.e. loss of efficiency). I had no reason to doubt what he said, but still wanted to clean the tubes - threads from other boiler make owners indicate significantly better efficiency with clean tubes. So I altered my turbulator linkage by replacing all of the rigid suspension bars with 4 individual short pieces of chain. The chain is suspended in a manner that allows the turbs to be pulled and the tubes cleaned via top plate removal only. This is not a factory approved method, but it wasn't rejected either. Dale's cut was: "I don’t think it will be a problem, the chains may not last as long but give it a try". I've been burning on and off for a couple of weeks, and so far, so good. I'll be pulling the top plate this week to lift the turbs out and run a brush down the tubes, so that will be the first checkpoint. My main concern with this setup is turbs hanging up (i.e. not dropping back down the tube), and I'll be watching carefully for signs of that happening. It shouldn't happen unless significant creosote forms, which is what the regular scrub should prevent.

 

[lawandorder]

I have a Tarm Solo, I pull them usually once a month to clean them off and scrub the tubes. Not much build up but enough to notice the increase in the stack temp. I definitly noticed the difference when i originally added them. Seemed to get more btus out of the unit and my storage temps seemed to be a bit higher than before.

 

[pybyr]

The reason that I ask is that my least favorite aspect of my Econoburn 150 is the wrestling match that I need to get into in order to pull the turbulators so that I can scrub the fire tubes.
Thanks

Similar story here. The turbs came out ok this year, but there is WAY too much time required to break everything down and reassemble. Because of this, my primary issue is not being able to clean the tubes during the burning season. So, first I asked Dale about substituting chain for the spirals. He said they have tried that at the factory but it didn't break up the laminar flow well enough, and stack temps went up (i.e. loss of efficiency). I had no reason to doubt what he said, but still wanted to clean the tubes - threads from other boiler make owners indicate significantly better efficiency with clean tubes. So I altered my turbulator linkage by replacing all of the rigid suspension bars with 4 individual short pieces of chain. The chain is suspended in a manner that allows the turbs to be pulled and the tubes cleaned via top plate removal only. This is not a factory approved method, but it wasn't rejected either. Dale's cut was: "I don’t think it will be a problem, the chains may not last as long but give it a try". I've been burning on and off for a couple of weeks, and so far, so good. I'll be pulling the top plate this week to lift the turbs out and run a brush down the tubes, so that will be the first checkpoint. My main concern with this setup is turbs hanging up (i.e. not dropping back down the tube), and I'll be watching carefully for signs of that happening. It shouldn't happen unless significant creosote forms, which is what the regular scrub should prevent.

Thanks for the observations/ suggestions. My EBW-150 has "hinged turbulators" (2-piece, with a link in the middle) to deal with the fact that my old house basement limits working room above the boiler. These drag a bit in the firetubes, and would definitely not drop down on their own with only a chain in place of the solid link. But again, thanks for the suggestion.

 

[jebatty]

Might be helpful to resurrect an old post of mine: Chain Turbulator. These chain turbulators have been in use since Jan 2008, and now entering the 4th heating season. Although discolored, the chain turbulators appear to remain in excellent condition. As a bonus, when I remove each to brush each hx tube, I first rattle the chain around in the tube to knock off any accumulation on the chain and also knock off a good part of any accumulation in the hx tube. I then do a final brushing of the tube.

As mentioned in the post, I got flue temp reduction of about 100F, translating to about a 3% increase in efficiency. I clean the fire tubes when I see flue temp start to rise consistently above a "normal" range, and after cleaning the flue temp drops right back down again.

 

[willworkforwood]

My EBW-150 has "hinged turbulators" (2-piece, with a link in the middle) to deal with the fact that my old house basement limits working room above the boiler. These drag a bit in the firetubes, and would definitely not drop down on their own with only a chain in place of the solid link.

Know where you're coming from on that - I once had an old house too. It must be a bear to brush the tubes with so little clearance. And I agree that hinged turbs would have a high likelihood of hanging up without the help of solid downward force. I'm sure you will have much less of a creosote issue, once your storage is up. Creosote normally only forms on the tubes if the wood is greater than 20% MC and/or the boiler idles a lot. I seem to recall that you use dry wood, so the boiler running full-out into storage should eliminate your problems

 

[Hansson]

Tarm have a good cleaning thing for round turbulators
It is made of small springs .I run it in my screwdriver and it gets really clean

 

[lawandorder]

Hansonn, Where did you get the cleaning rod and tips from>??