1975 Vermont Defiant or ??

[bryansong]

I'm working on buying a wood stove for my mother's house and am trying to get one that is easy
for them to understand how to operate and one that is easy on the wood, efficient.
Money is a issue and so far it looks like my family and I need to save a little more money before
we can get a pretty good stove. Below, here is a couple of contenders and quotes for a local dealer.

Buck 74 8" Clearance on Back of Stove $2166.00 w/Close Clearance Shield and Legs Included

Pacific Energy Super 27 Stove $1975.00 with black door and blower 5" Clearance on Back of Stove
(broken link removed to http://www.pacificenergy.net/products/wood/super/super/)

Here is the reason for this post. I see on craigslist about 100 or so miles away there is a 1975
Vermont Defiant for sail for $850. I really don't know what I'd get in a unknown 40 year old wood stove
but I do like those stoves. I have never seen one in person but I like that it is wider than it is deep and
that would be a preferred orientation for placement in my mother's room. I also really would like to get the back
of it as close to the wall as possible.

If I were to consider buying this can I place it anywhere near the wall or is there something I could put on the
back of the stove?

I think that I will most likely pass on this but at least it has me thinking.

Bryan

 

[begreen]

I would not get the old Defiant. It is a more complex stove and 40+ yrs old. Not sure what size would be appropriate but I would look at getting an Englander Madison or Monroe (50-SHSSW02) or a 30NC. Or in the Drolet line a Drolet Legend II or HT2000. These stoves will be cleaner burning and produce more heat from less wood. Caveat being the wood needs to be fully seasoned.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_669024-76845-50-SHSSW02_1z0w5u2Z1z0zn7uZ1z13zl0__?productId=999918850&pl=1
(broken link removed to http://www.amfmenergy.com/50masmheup18.html)

How large an area would the stove be heating? How tall is the chimney?

 

[peakbagger]

I have had an old Defiant for around 20 years. For the vast majority of homes it throws out too much heat. Great for a big poorly insulated Vermont home where it was designed but it will drive folks out a typical modern home. It also requires a minimum 8" chimney flue and the chimney arrangement needs to be good, preferably an interior chimney that discharges near the high point of the roof. The price is high, unless its in like new condition or someone has gone through it and reconditioned and resealed it, its pricey. The early defiants had a design flaw and a subsequent "recall" related to the single piece firebacks, they warped and eventually the primitive secondary air system ceased to work. Many had a conversion kit installed that switched it to a two piece fireback and once that was installed they were great stoves if you need the heat. For the majority of homes the smaller siblings, the Resolute or Vigilant are a better option.

 

[mwhitnee]

Yup the only reason I could see buying that stove for that price is if it was completely redone with a 2 piece fire back kit. And you would need an open floor plan or big room for it. I had one and liked it, but glad I switched to a newer stove, less work and better for the environment.

 

[bryansong]

I would not get the old Defiant. It is a more complex stove and 40+ yrs old. Not sure what size would be appropriate but I would look at getting an Englander Madison or Monroe (50-SHSSW02) or a 30NC. Or in the Drolet line a Drolet Legend II or HT2000. These stoves will be cleaner burning and produce more heat from less wood. Caveat being the wood needs to be fully seasoned.
http://www.lowes.com/pd_669024-76845-50-SHSSW02_1z0w5u2Z1z0zn7uZ1z13zl0__?productId=999918850&pl=1
(broken link removed to http://www.amfmenergy.com/50masmheup18.html)

Ok, I can clearly see the Defiant isn't for me or my mom. I do appreciate you giving me better options.
The Englander link you gave 50-SHSSW02 had a couple of good reviews but one bad.

Please read the reviewer's opinion from Lowe's (your link)? This kind of thing scares me.
You must have read or heard something good about this stove. Can you tell me more?
For the price that looks like a great way to go but I haven't been able so far to find much information on
this stove.
If this a good stove I could save $1,000 dollars off what I was going to spend on a Buck 74 or an Pacific Energy Super 27

How large an area would the stove be heating? How tall is the chimney?

The main floor is 1330sqft and the 2nd level would be a guess of 500sqft.

 

[bryansong]

I forgot to mention this is a new install, there is no flue at this time. this is a single story room attached
to the house, and el really, so I the flue would only need to go up maybe 8 or 10 feet.

 

[peakbagger]

One thing about Vermont Castings stoves of that era is they were the equivalent of an Apple product currently. They were a must have for the "green set". VC massaged potential buyers egos with slick marketing and design. Compared to the box stoves of the era, the stoves were something that folks would install in their living room to show to their friends that they were "green". More than a few were rarely if ever operated for much more than occasional holidays when the greenies discovered that dealing with wood in general was dirty. Right along with the Volvo and the lab or the golden retriever, it was part of the image that greenies cultivated. Even though the primitive secondary burn had its issues compared to todays stoves, the efficiency gain over a standard box stove was significant and the only company that gave them a run on efficiency were the small Jotul's and they were regarded by many as just a bit too funky. Folk forget that VC dealers made a bundle selling accessories and more than few would load on the accessories on their floor models. There was a wait list for the stoves, if you wanted a stripped on you may need to wait a couple of months but if you wanted one right a way they would gladly sell you a floor model with all sorts of accessories at a good markup.

 

[bryansong]

The main floor is 1330sqft and the 2nd level would be a guess of 500sqft.

Hey, what about the Drolet? I could not find the Legend II locally and I think the HT2000 is too big.
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200307391_200307391

 

[bryansong]

Hey, what about the Drolet? I could not find the Legend II locally and I think the HT2000 is too big.
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200307391_200307391

Is this one of the other stoves you recommended? http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200649084_200649084
It would be nice to go with something from Northern Tool because I have one of them near by.

 

[begreen]

Hey, what about the Drolet? I could not find the Legend II locally and I think the HT2000 is too big.
http://www.northerntool.com/shop/tools/product_200307391_200307391

Drolet is fine. The HT2000 and the Legend are both close to the same size ~3.4 cu ft. The HT2000 is a little wider, but a bit less deep too. Unfortunately recently Drolet started pimping their fire box size and now report the HT2000 as a larger stove. As far as I can tell the Drolet Legend is the less expensive version of the 3.4 cu ft Osburn 2300 and the HT2000 relates to the 3.2 cu ft Osburn 2400. Either should work. FWIW, the Defiant is no little stove either.

Moving the thread to the main forum for EPA stove discussion.

 

[bryansong]

Drolet is fine. The HT2000 and the Legend are both close to the same size ~3.4 cu ft. The HT2000 is a little wider, but a bit less deep too. Unfortunately recently Drolet started pimping their fire box size and now report the HT2000 as a larger stove. As far as I can tell the Drolet Legend is the less expensive version of the 3.4 cu ft Osburn 2300 and the HT2000 relates to the 3.2 cu ft Osburn 2400. Either should work. FWIW, the Defiant is no little stove either.

Having never seen the Defiant I don't have a very good reference as to it's physical size though I know it's the big one. To be clear, I know that is
too large, too nice, too expensive and too difficult to operate from what I can tell. I initially liked the way it was wider rather than deeper plus it looks
so cool.
Moving on, I would like to find out if one of those mentioned earlier wood work. I do think that the Drolet HT2000 is too big. May something just a little smaller that is efficient.

Moving the thread to the main forum for EPA stove discussion.