If graphite seals better then I don't have a problem replacing it every season or two.
2017/2018 VC owners thread
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And you call yourself reckless
5 month old at home so I believe those days are over now.... New name semi reckless
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Dano25
New Member
That is a VC stove in label only. It's really a Century S244. Still sold today.
SonOfEru
Member
Hi all. RandyBoBandy suggested jumping over here from the thread I started, with questions about catalytic in a Defiant Encore 2140.
Here's the thread, but the questions have kinda changed as it went along.
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...k-with-just-a-small-fire.167153/#post-2242012.
So I'd like to pick up with the current questions I have.
The stove came to me from a friend who bought it in 1992 and only used it 5 years or so before going to central heat. So he hadnt got to replacing the catalytic or doing any re-gasketing, which is where my questions come to.
1. I dont want to get too extensive with gasketing in the middle of winter. I do have evidence that there is leaking and overfiring from the leaks. I would think doors, griddle, ash pan should be not too much and should help with leaks. I would wait for flue collar and damper etc at this point
I see a kit on Amazon
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00IN4OSPS/?tag=hearthamazon-20
https://www.amazon.com/3419-Encore-...2&keywords=vermont+castings+encore+gasket+kit
It doesnt say what models it works for. Can I expect it works for a 2140? And the instructions would be enough for a handy guy? I havent seen any YouTube videos specifically for Encores.
2. I can see the cat DOES work, it gets red when it's really hot, and the smoke goes pretty clean after it's been running in cat mode for a bit. But I do want to get a catalytic thermometer so I know better about temps. The stovetop thermometers I have are all over the place in differing from each other [and from their own selves at times!!] and from a borrowed IR thermometer from a friend. So the question is this - the stove came with a Condar flue gas thermometer, a probe into the flue pipe. I look at that and look at pictures of a catalytic thermometer
![[Hearth.com] 2017/2018 VC owners thread](https://www.hearth.com/talk/data/attachments/222/222284-c107a08da90043fcc8dce0df6ef17c1d.jpg?hash=lMoDIWoCgt "[Hearth.com] 2017/2018 VC owners thread")
and they look identical except for the writing on the dial. There's nothing inside the stem that would be different, right? Just a metal rod that conducts heat up to the bimetal coil? Any reason I cant just use the "Flue Gas" probe that I have? I dont have a smart phone to take a photo of mine.
Thanks for any help.
SonOfEru
Here's the thread, but the questions have kinda changed as it went along.
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...k-with-just-a-small-fire.167153/#post-2242012.
So I'd like to pick up with the current questions I have.
The stove came to me from a friend who bought it in 1992 and only used it 5 years or so before going to central heat. So he hadnt got to replacing the catalytic or doing any re-gasketing, which is where my questions come to.
1. I dont want to get too extensive with gasketing in the middle of winter. I do have evidence that there is leaking and overfiring from the leaks. I would think doors, griddle, ash pan should be not too much and should help with leaks. I would wait for flue collar and damper etc at this point
I see a kit on Amazon
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00IN4OSPS/?tag=hearthamazon-20
https://www.amazon.com/3419-Encore-...2&keywords=vermont+castings+encore+gasket+kit
It doesnt say what models it works for. Can I expect it works for a 2140? And the instructions would be enough for a handy guy? I havent seen any YouTube videos specifically for Encores.
2. I can see the cat DOES work, it gets red when it's really hot, and the smoke goes pretty clean after it's been running in cat mode for a bit. But I do want to get a catalytic thermometer so I know better about temps. The stovetop thermometers I have are all over the place in differing from each other [and from their own selves at times!!] and from a borrowed IR thermometer from a friend. So the question is this - the stove came with a Condar flue gas thermometer, a probe into the flue pipe. I look at that and look at pictures of a catalytic thermometer
and they look identical except for the writing on the dial. There's nothing inside the stem that would be different, right? Just a metal rod that conducts heat up to the bimetal coil? Any reason I cant just use the "Flue Gas" probe that I have? I dont have a smart phone to take a photo of mine.
Thanks for any help.
SonOfEru
SonOfEru
Member
Oops, forgot one more question.
The primary air control handle seems to bottom out at straight down, 6 o'clock. That is, it does swing from 8 o'clock back to 4 o'clock but when I look at the shutter down below, it is closed completely when the handle is straight down.
That cant be right. What's with that?
The primary air control handle seems to bottom out at straight down, 6 o'clock. That is, it does swing from 8 o'clock back to 4 o'clock but when I look at the shutter down below, it is closed completely when the handle is straight down.
That cant be right. What's with that?
Durantefarm
Member
hello my wife and I boutght a VC Montpelier in January and we are learning so much from the forum ! so I learned about buying a moisture meter which I did and that is helping with the wood we bought that's not all the way down to 20%. my question is that once my wood is completely seasoned (next winter ) will I get better/hotter burns with less wood ? I love the insert but I feel the heat isn't putting out heat . my buddy has LOPI stove and its almost like he can throw higher moisture wood in his stove and it burns hotter. any info I can get from VC owners would be great . thank you so much.
the probe itself might have a different rating, and a lot of the cat thermometers are bent, so you can see them from the top. I might recommend the Auber AT100, which gives you a visual display and faster reporting.
SonOfEru
Member
Absolutely you will get hotter burns. When I went to seasoning mine a second year they are lighter, quicker to flame, hotter. They dont have that work to do of driving off the remaining moisture. I would be stunned if your LOPI friend actually gets hotter burns with wetter wood. The physics would be the opposite
Durantefarm
Member
it just might be that his LOPI is much bigger than mine so it throws more heat out. he uses ash just like me and he just cuts and uses it without looking at moisture . where if my wood is above 23% the woods burns like chit . I have been placing logs in front of glass to warm up and I find the wood burns better. im from ohio and not a real fan of winter but I can honestly say I cant wait till next winter so I can see how my wood burns with a year of season time. im started cutting my own wood now for next year and years to come .
The 3419 gasket kit has all the gasket you need for the stove top, doors, ash door, and more. The replacement is pretty straightforward. You just need to make sure that you remove all of the old gasket cement before installing the new gasket. I did it recently, and found that an air needle scaler does a fantastic and quick job of removing the old cement without damaging the castings. Harbor Freight has them for about $20 or so. A prior post about rebuilding an Encore contained a link to the 0028/2140 repair manual, which has all the information you need to replace the gaskets or even do a complete rebuild. Here's the link: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/encore-2550-rebuild-start-to-finish.112149/page-8#post-1536832
SonOfEru
Member
Let me ask a little more about my question of a catalytic thermometer. I figure I better ask a basic question first. How long of a probe should I have? I dont even know how deep it needs to go into the refractory chamber. I have a heat shield so that's another inch and 1/4, so I would need to drill through the shield and then into the stove itself.
I see them at Condar in 4 inch, 6 inch, and 6.5 inch.
But then I wonder about having any of it sticking out free in the air. It would be losing at least a little of its heat into the air before it's conducted all the way out to the bimetal spring so it might read a bit lower than true temp. Or is that not a big deal? I have played with a mirror, which I think would do fine to make it so I could see the dial without contorting. So I wouldnt mind cutting a 2 inch hole in the shield to allow me to mount the probe flush and view it through the cutout.
And does it need to extend all the way into the chamber so it touches the other side? Or is that also not a big deal as long as it is good and covered with flame?
Thanks for any tips [I have let go of the idea of a remote digital display with a cable]
I see them at Condar in 4 inch, 6 inch, and 6.5 inch.
But then I wonder about having any of it sticking out free in the air. It would be losing at least a little of its heat into the air before it's conducted all the way out to the bimetal spring so it might read a bit lower than true temp. Or is that not a big deal? I have played with a mirror, which I think would do fine to make it so I could see the dial without contorting. So I wouldnt mind cutting a 2 inch hole in the shield to allow me to mount the probe flush and view it through the cutout.
And does it need to extend all the way into the chamber so it touches the other side? Or is that also not a big deal as long as it is good and covered with flame?
Thanks for any tips [I have let go of the idea of a remote digital display with a cable]
SonOfEru
Member
I'm curious that even though the Encore provides a port in back for a probe, there is nothing about a probe in the manuals. Owners and Service manuals dont even have the word "thermometer"
SonOfEru
Member
Well I'm back to considering, and the Auber AT100 is what folks keep talking about. But I am curious that the K probe recommended is really short - looks like it would stick into the refractory chamber only an inch or so. How thick is the refractory itself, anyway.
It must be ok, so many recommendations but I am still curious. And it touches on my question above about how much needs to be stuck into the flame
![[Hearth.com] 2017/2018 VC owners thread](https://www.hearth.com/talk/data/attachments/222/222409-0f7262d2fde2a5718079f7669f3eb6b2.jpg?hash=sFk-ClBQLh "[Hearth.com] 2017/2018 VC owners thread")
And I know I am dithering and indecisive on this one, I just never did a cat probe of any kind.
"I just never did a cat probe of any kind." Ha, me either...prolly take two hands though...
I just ordered the AT-100 and the WRNK-191, 6" cat probe. The probe is available with two different connectors, spade and mini. The tech said the AT-100 comes with a special green connector that you must use with this probe...told me to order the one with the "spade" connector, then leave them a note when checking out, and that they would make the switcharoo for me.
Question: Were you having trouble removing/inspecting the old combustor? I can't recall from the other thread if you were able to get to it or not.
I just ordered the AT-100 and the WRNK-191, 6" cat probe. The probe is available with two different connectors, spade and mini. The tech said the AT-100 comes with a special green connector that you must use with this probe...told me to order the one with the "spade" connector, then leave them a note when checking out, and that they would make the switcharoo for me.
Question: Were you having trouble removing/inspecting the old combustor? I can't recall from the other thread if you were able to get to it or not.
SonOfEru
Member
Aha - I went to the Auber site and the one I showed is just the first of a number of K types, I just saw "K" and clicked on it. That one is only good for 780 degrees.
So with all the variants of K type, is the WRNK-191 the one to get? Looks like it is the only one to go to 2000.
SonOfEru
Member
I got the stove used. Bought in 1992, used 5 years then the owner got central heat. So the cat plainly works but I'm not sure how good condition it is. The cover panel screws are rusted on really good. I know how to drill and tap if I have to break them, but I balked at getting that far into things in the middle of winter.
I sure wish VC had built in a thermometer, or a glass window in back so you could see the cat action.
Yes. The perfect fit would be the 4", but since Auber does not have one with 2000*F, then the 6" was a way to go. Works fine.
SonOfEru
Member
So if I were to mount it flush it would go in 4"? I have the heatshield so 6" is going to stick out a couple inches and the shield is only 1 1/4 away from the stove body [not the access panel, the body of the stove]. I will have to drill the shield and put it through that and into the stove port. And so there will still be 3/4 inch or so free beyond the shield
Can I ask again - if 2" of the probe is not in the combustor flame, does the heat dissipate before being measured? 1/3 of the length is going to be outside.
And what is the mechanism of the measuring? It's not a bimetal spring, I can see that.
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This would have been a good idea, i wish i thought of it. As others have said, i went at100 and the 2000f k @6". I just disassembled the yellow plug and wired it to the green. I did have to recalibrate the probe until I was within a degree or two. I found that calibrating for Celsius then switching to Fahrenheit doesn't work well.
The probe that came with my stove is a 6" as well. It stuck out a little bit, but it also isn't nearly as sensitive. I don't think the extra makes a difference.
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