A truckers electric truck!

[EbS-P]

This has been coming across my feed more frequently. It’s is a serious truck for truckers.
9L cat paired to a big generator so it’s a hybrid!!
This what happens when function wins over form.

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[begreen]

That's a serious beast.

 

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Looks like this series hybrid approach will be an option for the 2025 RAM 1500 truck. Will it show up in a Hellcat too?

Range Sucks When Towing with Electric Trucks, but Not with the 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger

The Ramcharger’s dual-electric-motor drive system is fed by a plug-in battery and a 3.6-liter V-6-powered generator to deliver a claimed 690 miles of combined range.

www.caranddriver.com

 

[EbS-P]

Looks like this series hybrid approach will be an option for the 2025 RAM 1500 truck. Will it show up in a Hellcat too?

Range Sucks When Towing with Electric Trucks, but Not with the 2025 Ram 1500 Ramcharger

The Ramcharger’s dual-electric-motor drive system is fed by a plug-in battery and a 3.6-liter V-6-powered generator to deliver a claimed 690 miles of combined range.

www.caranddriver.com

I don’t see this advantageous to FAST. This series hybrid works well because you can run ice at peak efficiency. The waste heat can be used to heat cabin or battery (it should have a heatpump too but who know. 130 miles battery range is probably meaning a 60kwh??? Battery good enough for all the daily needs. 600 miles combined ice plus battery. Call it 300 towing. I couldn’t get 175 miles with my old 4Runner pulling 1500# 5x8 trailer.

It’s going to be a really low volume. Not if the same tech can scale to 3/4 or 1 ton trucks the. You might be making some sales.

 

[incinerator]

I don’t see this advantageous to FAST. This series hybrid works well because you can run ice at peak efficiency. The waste heat can be used to heat cabin or battery (it should have a heatpump too but who know. 130 miles battery range is probably meaning a 60kwh??? Battery good enough for all the daily needs. 600 miles combined ice plus battery. Call it 300 towing. I couldn’t get 175 miles with my old 4Runner pulling 1500# 5x8 trailer.

It’s going to be a really low volume. Not if the same tech can scale to 3/4 or 1 ton trucks the. You might be making some sales.

I think i saw the battery was almost 100kwh. I agree about towing/range will take a huge hit. Its using their minivan pentastar v6 as a generator i think producing 130kw or something. Not sure how much energy is needed to tow so can that 130kw keep up or will the battery slowly drain as you go along? Could always pull over a fast charge. The thing is basically a chevy Volt. I'm shocked it took so long to come up with this.

 

[EbS-P]

I think i saw the battery was almost 100kwh. I agree about towing/range will take a huge hit. It’s using their minivan pentastar v6 as a generator i think producing 130kw or something. Not sure how much energy is needed to tow so can that 130kw keep up or will the battery slowly drain as you go along? Could always pull over a fast charge. The thing is basically a chevy Volt. I'm shocked it took so long to come up with

70kwh of usable battery of out of 90kwh. It doesn’t matter what the combined HP is. It’s all feeding through the electric motors(s). Flat land high speed towing takes what 150 HP. I’m just guessing. Probably less. That’s less than the generator makes. So you could charge while towing on flat ground. How often to you put the pedal all the way to the floor? Pulling a long pass maybe a couple minutes. That what the 20 kWh reserve capacity it for.

I think it took so long because automakers reluctantly went the pure EV route trying to keep up with Tesla and Rivian and neglected to really understand the market. The real question is cost. Will it be about the same at the pure electric Ram? Surfing a V6 and a generator won’t be cheap. Neither will the really big battery US EV truck buyers will want.

 

[incinerator]

70kwh of usable battery of out of 90kwh. It doesn’t matter what the combined HP is. It’s all feeding through the electric motors(s). Flat land high speed towing takes what 150 HP. I’m just guessing. Probably less. That’s less than the generator makes. So you could charge while towing on flat ground. How often to you put the pedal all the way to the floor? Pulling a long pass maybe a couple minutes. That what the 20 kWh reserve capacity it for.

I think it took so long because automakers reluctantly went the pure EV route trying to keep up with Tesla and Rivian and neglected to really understand the market. The real question is cost. Will it be about the same at the pure electric Ram? Surfing a V6 and a generator won’t be cheap. Neither will the really big battery US EV truck buyers will want.

I think its a pretty good idea because it might bring in guys who would never buy an EV (truck guys). Maybe they will learn to love the instant torque/efficiency of the EV side of it.

 

[EbS-P]

I gotta see the price. But..
“Combined, its two electric motors product 663 horsepower and 615 pound-feet of torque. That's good for a 0-60 miles per hour sprint in just 4.4 seconds.“

Who needs a charger challenger camero or a mustang with those specs. Sure it won’t corner. But who cares if it tows.

It probably all comes down to how the EPA rates the milage. It may not get much more than 20 mpgs.

 

[DBoon]

A series hybrid approach for a pickup truck with a 20-30 kWh battery (enough to get you around town on shorter errands, and have a little storage for assisting a smaller engine up hills while towing) would seem to be a pretty smart technical approach for a pickup truck and a great way to keep costs low(er) and introduce the benefits of electrification to a market that is mostly resistant to it right now.

 

[EbS-P]

But

A series hybrid approach for a pickup truck with a 20-30 kWh battery (enough to get you around town on shorter errands, and have a little storage for assisting a smaller engine up hills while towing) would seem to be a pretty smart technical approach for a pickup truck and a great way to keep costs low(er) and introduce the benefits of electrification to a market that is mostly resistant to it right now.

you have to have the gobs of current that US truck buyers want. Toyota already has a parallel hybrid for the Sequoia and Tundra. It doesn’t seem like it’s a selling point.

 

[incinerator]

Ramcharger has a 27 gallon fuel tank. Hmmmm... 92kwh battery pack (about 3 gallons of fuel)..so 30 gallons of fuel and 690 miles of range is 23mpg if you ran it all empty.

 

[EbS-P]

Ramcharger has a 27 gallon fuel tank. Hmmmm... 92kwh battery pack (about 3 gallons of fuel)..so 30 gallons of fuel and 690 miles of range is 23mpg if you ran it all empty.

Yep…. And a 3.5 eco boat F150 gets 24 highway. Big heavy squares/rectangles going down the highway at 70 mph are not very efficient.

 

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And a 3.5 eco boat F150 gets 24 highway.

Under perfect conditions, level road and 55 mph, in summer. Real world is more like 16-18, especially for daily around town runs. At least that's what ours got. Loaded with a camper in the mountains it went as low as 9 mpg and best at 16.

 

[ABMax24]

My brother had a 19 3.5 Ecoboost. He moved himself and wife to Nova Scotia and back in a 9 month period, towing a 22ft 9,000lb enclosed trailer both ways, he averaged 8mpg both ways. That's a lot of fuel. My 6.7 Powerstroke gets 11mpg towing our 35ft 11.5k lb fifth wheel. The eco boosts are not good at all under load.

Fellow co-worker bought a new Power boost, he's a contract electrician. Loves it, it runs the climate control with the engine off, and he can charge/power his tools off the truck battery via its 120v inverter. Says overall he uses about 2/3 the fuel his 5.0 F150 used to.

 

[EbS-P]

I don’t see how a generator driven tuck would get more than 8 mph towing either. Physics says it might even be less so to losses in generator but you would have some regen.

 

[ABMax24]

I don’t see how a generator driven tuck would get more than 8 mph towing either. Physics says it might even be less so to losses in generator but you would have some regen.

It comes down to the efficiency of the engine, and utilizing the electric powertrain to absorb the peaks and valleys in engine load. Most modern vehicle engines at some point sacrifice efficiency for higher specific power outputs. Hybrids allow instead power to be sacrificed for efficiency, and the electrics to make up the difference. Fords power boost is a poor example of this, it works great when the truck is empty, because the engine can remain off for periods of time, but not while heavily loaded as the engine is still operating on the wrong side of its efficiency map.

I think this is part of Edison's thought process. Put a smaller, yet more efficient engine into the truck, whose sole goal is to convert diesel into mechanical energy at the most efficient rate possible.

Toyota did this with the Rav 4 hybrid. The 2.5 Atkinson Cycle engine isn't very powerful by modern standards, but it breaks 40% thermal efficiency in parts of it's operating map, allowing the powertrain to be programmed to operate in that rpm and load range as much as possible.

 

[incinerator]

It comes down to the efficiency of the engine, and utilizing the electric powertrain to absorb the peaks and valleys in engine load. Most modern vehicle engines at some point sacrifice efficiency for higher specific power outputs. Hybrids allow instead power to be sacrificed for efficiency, and the electrics to make up the difference. Fords power boost is a poor example of this, it works great when the truck is empty, because the engine can remain off for periods of time, but not while heavily loaded as the engine is still operating on the wrong side of its efficiency map.

I think this is part of Edison's thought process. Put a smaller, yet more efficient engine into the truck, whose sole goal is to convert diesel into mechanical energy at the most efficient rate possible.

Toyota did this with the Rav 4 hybrid. The 2.5 Atkinson Cycle engine isn't very powerful by modern standards, but it breaks 40% thermal efficiency in parts of it's operating map, allowing the powertrain to be programmed to operate in that rpm and load range as much as possible.

One of the Ramcharger engineers was on TFL podcast video yesterday. During it he mentioned that the Ramcharger v6 (while running) will have some sort of rev matching with throttle position due to noise/more natural feel.

 

[EbS-P]

It comes down to the efficiency of the engine, and utilizing the electric powertrain to absorb the peaks and valleys in engine load. Most modern vehicle engines at some point sacrifice efficiency for higher specific power outputs. Hybrids allow instead power to be sacrificed for efficiency, and the electrics to make up the difference. Fords power boost is a poor example of this, it works great when the truck is empty, because the engine can remain off for periods of time, but not while heavily loaded as the engine is still operating on the wrong side of its efficiency map.

I think this is part of Edison's thought process. Put a smaller, yet more efficient engine into the truck, whose sole goal is to convert diesel into mechanical energy at the most efficient rate possible.

Toyota did this with the Rav 4 hybrid. The 2.5 Atkinson Cycle engine isn't very powerful by modern standards, but it breaks 40% thermal efficiency in parts of it's operating map, allowing the powertrain to be programmed to operate in that rpm and load range as much as possible.

One would assume the pentastarV6 has some peak efficiency below max output. But these generators will be run at constant rpm I would guess. So maybe you he could get close to 40% at max output. But as the numbers suggest a 20ish mpg empty would translate to 10 ish when add drag and weight of a trailer.

The answer is battery powered trailers. Campers an already have a gernerator. Make it bigger and able to run while towing. Add a battery and hub motors. Campers will start at 6 figures.

All of this comes down to a battery cost and weight issue. They will get cheaper and lighter with time. In the meantime hybrids for towing make sense but I leave you with this thread. People tow with BEVs!

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/ohmmans-airstream-adventures.83350/

 

[EbS-P]

One of the Ramcharger engineers was on TFL podcast video yesterday. During it he mentioned that the Ramcharger v6 (while running) will have some sort of rev matching with throttle position due to noise/more natural feel.

Any engine noises from speakers to imagine. ‘Merica for the win!

 

[sloeffle]

All of this comes down to a battery cost and weight issue. They will get cheaper and lighter with time. In the meantime hybrids for towing make sense but I leave you with this thread. People tow with BEVs!

$100 a month in tire costs

 

[EbS-P]

$100 a month in tire costs

No $70

 

[sloeffle]

No $70

I saw that in your other post. Tongue weight of the trailer added to the existing weight of the BEV and the trailer tires. $100 was just a high ball park figure.

 

[begreen]

I don’t see how a generator driven tuck would get more than 8 mph towing either. Physics says it might even be less so to losses in generator but you would have some regen.

IIRC I thought the battery management system always kept some reserve capacity so that the vehicle was not running solely on the generator. At this point, it's mostly speculation. We'll know more about mileage in a year when real-world testing shows up.

 

[incinerator]

One would assume the pentastarV6 has some peak efficiency below max output. But these generators will be run at constant rpm I would guess. So maybe you he could get close to 40% at max output. But as the numbers suggest a 20ish mpg empty would translate to 10 ish when add drag and weight of a trailer.

The answer is battery powered trailers. Campers an already have a gernerator. Make it bigger and able to run while towing. Add a battery and hub motors. Campers will start at 6 figures.

All of this comes down to a battery cost and weight issue. They will get cheaper and lighter with time. In the meantime hybrids for towing make sense but I leave you with this thread. People tow with BEVs!

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/ohmmans-airstream-adventures.83350/

Engineer guy said it won't be run at constant speed (i think toyota atkinson cycle does that). So i'd imagine that 130kw will vary depending on how much you have your foot into the gas pedal.

Will the waste heat of the engine be used to warm the cab or even the battery pack? I could see some uses for that in cold climate.

 

[EbS-P]

Engineer guy said it won't be run at constant speed (i think toyota atkinson cycle does that). So i'd imagine that 130kw will vary depending on how much you have your foot into the gas pedal.

Will the waste heat of the engine be used to warm the cab or even the battery pack? I could see some uses for that in cold climate.

I would assume so. But integrating those two separate systems might really not give that much extra range. So maybe not. To me this system has lost mile delivery applications. Like who ever made UPSs hybrids had a hand in this or now has competitors. I don’t see the appeal as a truck owners truck. Unless gas goes way up.