BK install question.. chimney pipe hole

[BETELGUESE]

Hello, I just discovered this website and it's already been very helpful. I hope my first post isnt too long to get some responses. I also apologize for my lack of terminology.

I am replacing my old Coal/Wood circulator for a new BK Princess 32. Circulator is inefficient and one cast hinge for the ash pan door busted off. After considering my options I am opting for the Princess 32. I wanted the King40 but the 8" pipe size isn't ideal. Princess 32 is still on backorder for 90 days, so I have time to fix issues beforehand.

The circulator was in the house before I arrived. It has a 6" exhaust, and the 6" pipe goes from the circulator to my chimney, however the pipe increases to 8" as it passes through my chimney. There is no additional pipe in my 25' chimney.

I will be adding single wall pipe into my chimney according to code.

My major questions are in regards to the hole in my chimney where the stove pipe enters. It appears a 8.5"x8.5" square was originally cut out of my chimney for the pipe. The people before me put in an 8" pipe fitting and then cemented around the pipe. Well fast forward to now, the cement used to fill the gaps around the chimney pipe is cracking and coming loose. My questions are:

1) What are the proper list of steps to re-cement this area around the chimney pipe?

2) Should I be decreasing the chimney hole fitting from 8" to 6"? (I'm under the impression that BK wants the pipes to be exclusively 6" except for King 40)

I plan to burn wood as my primary heating source, but will have an oil furnace as backup. Any suggestions, questions, or any engagement with me at all will be hugely appreciated. I am still learning & would love to hear what you knowledgeable folks have to say or suggest.

Thanks in advance. I added a pic of my old circulator and a few pics of the chimney pipe hole thats deteriorating. Again, sorry for my lack of knowledge & proper terminology.

 

[BETELGUESE]

Full circulator pic

 

[bholler]

Hello, I just discovered this website and it's already been very helpful. I hope my first post isnt too long to get some responses. I also apologize for my lack of terminology.

I am replacing my old Coal/Wood circulator for a new BK Princess 32. Circulator is inefficient and one cast hinge for the ash pan door busted off. After considering my options I am opting for the Princess 32. I wanted the King40 but the 8" pipe size isn't ideal. Princess 32 is still on backorder for 90 days, so I have time to fix issues beforehand.

The circulator was in the house before I arrived. It has a 6" exhaust, and the 6" pipe goes from the circulator to my chimney, however the pipe increases to 8" as it passes through my chimney. There is no additional pipe in my 25' chimney.

I will be adding single wall pipe into my chimney according to code.

My major questions are in regards to the hole in my chimney where the stove pipe enters. It appears a 8.5"x8.5" square was originally cut out of my chimney for the pipe. The people before me put in an 8" pipe fitting and then cemented around the pipe. Well fast forward to now, the cement used to fill the gaps around the chimney pipe is cracking and coming loose. My questions are:

1) What are the proper list of steps to re-cement this area around the chimney pipe?

2) Should I be decreasing the chimney hole fitting from 8" to 6"? (I'm under the impression that BK wants the pipes to be exclusively 6" except for King 40)

I plan to burn wood as my primary heating source, but will have an oil furnace as backup. Any suggestions, questions, or any engagement with me at all will be hugely appreciated. I am still learning & would love to hear what you knowledgeable folks have to say or suggest.

Thanks in advance. I added a pic of my old circulator and a few pics of the chimney pipe hole thats deteriorating. Again, sorry for my lack of knowledge & proper terminology.

View attachment 298541 View attachment 298542 View attachment 298543 View attachment 298544 View attachment 298545

When you say single wall pipe to code do you mean a stainless liner? And do you know if your chney currently meets code with the required clearances to combustibles?

 

[BETELGUESE]

Thank you for responding!

I believe I do mean a stainless liner. Sorry my terminology is awful, but I'm happy to learn.

My current chimney does meet code requirements. It is the highest point of the roofline of my ranch style home. The chimney is about 3.5' taller than my roof.

 

[bholler]

Thank you for responding!

I believe I do mean a stainless liner. Sorry my terminology is awful, but I'm happy to learn.

My current chimney does meet code requirements. It is the highest point of the roofline of my ranch style home. The chimney is about 3.5' taller than my roof.

There is allot more to meeting code than just the height. It looks like it's probably an interior chimney from the pic. Than means it needs 2" clearance from the outside of the block to any combustible materials. If you don't have that your liner will need to be insulated

 

[BETELGUESE]

Hope this photo helps.

 

[bholler]

Hope this photo helps.

View attachment 298558

That only tells me it is high enough but doesn't give any indication of proper clearances. Does wood touch the outside of the masonry structure anywhere?

 

[BETELGUESE]

No

 

[bholler]

No

Ok if there really are no combustible materials within 2" of the outside of your chimney you would not need insulation on your liner to meet code requirements

 

[BETELGUESE]

Thats what a few separate stove stores said to me as well but its always good to get other advice too.

The most worrisome part for me is the degrading cement around the (flue pipe?), that goes into my chimney. Im not sure if this should be resealed to a 6" pipe fitting instead of the current 8" that is currently there. The stove shops said they do not do any masonry work. Luckily i have a few months time to get it ready before installation.

Im in contact with the owner of the stove shop I'm ordering the BK from. I asked him the same questions and sent photos. Unfortunately he's on vacation until next Wednesday.

 

[bholler]

Thats what a few separate stove stores said to me as well but its always good to get other advice too.

The most worrisome part for me is the degrading cement around the (flue pipe?), that goes into my chimney. Im not sure if this should be resealed to a 6" pipe fitting instead of the current 8" that is currently there. The stove shops said they do not do any masonry work. Luckily i have a few months time to get it ready before installation.

Im in contact with the owner of the stove shop I'm ordering the BK from. I asked him the same questions and sent photos. Unfortunately he's on vacation until next Wednesday.

Yes you would typically re cement it after installing the liner and connecting everything with stainless sticking out of the wall

 

[BETELGUESE]

Ok that is great to know. Thank you. That makes more sense than my initial guess. Looks like I need to get the chimney liner and stainless fitting ahead of the install.

Should the fitting be reduced from 8" to 6"?

What is the specific name for the stainless fitting that connects my chimney liner & woodstove pipe as it passes into my chimney?

Is there a reputable website or 2 that people like to order liners & fittings from?

 

[bholler]

Ok that is great to know. Thank you. That makes more sense than my initial guess. Looks like I need to get the chimney liner and stainless fitting ahead of the install.

Should the fitting be reduced from 8" to 6"?

What is the specific name for the stainless fitting that connects my chimney liner & woodstove pipe as it passes into my chimney?

Is there a reputable website or 2 that people like to order liners & fittings from?

If you are getting a 6" stove the entire system should be 6"

 

[begreen]

When you order the liner, order it with the stainless steel tee. The tee, without the snout, gets attached to the liner before inserting it down the chimney. The snout of the tee gets attached after the liner is in place and the receiving hole in the tee is aligned with the hole in the basement masonry. If there is a cleanout below, then a short liner extension that is capped can be added to the bottom of the tee. This should stop at the top of the cleanout door to facilitate cleaning. If no cleanout, then cap the tee at its bottom before installing.

 

[BETELGUESE]

Thank you. I wasnt sure. You have been extremely helpful.

 

[BETELGUESE]

I do have a cleanout. I will order a 6" stainless tee and 25' of chimney liner.

Very thankful.

Is there a certain furnace cement brand or other product you guys recommend to seal the hole in the masonry after adding the chimney liner & Tee?

What is the rule for how thick or deep the hole should be cemented after install?

 

[begreen]

I would probably put in a section of 8" round clay tile to create a thimble and mortar that in. Then the gap between the snout and the new clay thimble could be filled with rope gasket. This would create a thermal break between the snout and the masonry.
Note that bholler is the expert on chimneys here, so I would wait for his advisement.

 

[kennyp2339]

All good info here, let us know how you make out.

 

[BETELGUESE]

Ok great to know about the clay idea. You all have helped me so much, very thankful for your time and expertise.

 

[logfarmer]

If you have an 8” liner in there and it checks out good, why put a whole new liner in there instead of having the 8x6” reducer at the thimble? Lot of money you can keep in your pocket..if you want to rework the mortar in the thimble that’s fine but that new stove will draft just fine in that 8” liner. Good luck with everything.

 

[BETELGUESE]

The main reason i wanted to add a liner was because the 4 stove shops near me i visited were all pretty shocked i burnt wood without one. Told me it was against code. I need a way of seeing my clay lined chimney. It appears in good shape from the easily viewable areas.

My chimney is centrally located with no wood within 2". The wood is framed around it. There is insulation in the gap... unsure the rules on that.

I am all about saving money but I want to try and make this setup last a long time. The BK Princess is about 4200 clams without pipe or delivery.

Cheapest price I was given was 4000 or so but sold out until next year.

 

[begreen]

If you have an 8” liner in there and it checks out good, why put a whole new liner in there instead of having the 8x6” reducer at the thimble? Lot of money you can keep in your pocket..if you want to rework the mortar in the thimble that’s fine but that new stove will draft just fine in that 8” liner. Good luck with everything.

The Princess takes a 6" liner. There is a difference between a masonry, clay liner and an insulated stainless liner wrt performance and code.

There is no additional pipe in my 25' chimney.

This is the issue.

 

[logfarmer]

The Princess takes a 6" liner. There is a difference between a masonry, clay liner and an insulated stainless liner wrt performance and code.

This is the issue.

So he has an 8” thimble that goes into a clay liner…yes the princess is 6”..so he has the clearances around the chimney correct? Insulated liners can help with performance but not always needed is all I’m saying or is the use of clay liners 100% against code today? Even though they still produce and sell them!

 

[begreen]

If the interior chimney has the required 2" clearance all the way up through the roof, then yes, the clay liner is ok as long as it is still in good working condition and sized properly for the stove. I don't think we know the ID or condition of the current chimney liner. According to the manual, the stove really should have 6" all the way up.

 

[bholler]

If you have an 8” liner in there and it checks out good, why put a whole new liner in there instead of having the 8x6” reducer at the thimble? Lot of money you can keep in your pocket..if you want to rework the mortar in the thimble that’s fine but that new stove will draft just fine in that 8” liner. Good luck with everything.

It may and it may not. There are lots of factors that go into that