Blaze King Princess Insert CAT ?

[pete97]

I was doing my annual cleaning on my Blaze King Princess Insert today. I have used it just over 2.5 yrs now. Burning only well seasoned and dry wood. CAT didn't look too bad but upon closer inspection I found a couple of the "honey combs" on the CAT are broken and there are many more that are cracked. Do I need to be concerned? Normal? Do I need to replace it already ? Thanks. Getting ready. Weather is already cooling off here in Pa. Thanks Pete.

 

[clemsonfor]

I saw a good bit of cracks at the cleaning before last winter. They lasted only a month or 2 until they failed. They still got to temp even end of season just hear. To get there bit the chimney was almostly clogged and smoked badly when burning. Not as bad as when not engaged but still pretty smoky.

 

[webby3650]

You might want to talk to the dealer that it came from. We replaced one in a Princess inert under warranty that was only a year old. It failed and there was no good explanation really. Even if it's not free, BK has a pro-rated warranty on the Cat. The sooner the better.

 

[Todd]

Go to the dealer and claim the warranty. It will only get worse and may not last the season. Better to go into this next Winter with a new cat.

 

[BKVP]

Good morning all....I'd like to clarify the combustor warranty issue first. Federal Law requires any catalyst equipped stove to carry a 3-year 100% warranty for thermal destruction or degradation of the combustor (Catalyst).

The 3-year warranty can be claimed with proof of purchase date through any Blaze King dealer. Additionally, Blaze King offers an additional warranty of three more years in which the warranty coverage is prorated. That is our standard combustor warranty.

In March of 2013, we began a promotional program offering a 100% combustor warranty for a 10 year period. We were able to begin this warranty promotional program with the support of all our suppliers. This is only available because of the extremely low claim rate with our combustors/combustion design.

To address combustor failures, we have conducted VERY extensive studies of precisely what the contributing factors are to early failure. Without exception, the leading cause is an air leak around the front door seal. Failure to conduct the dollar bill test described in the Owners Manual will nearly always be the culprit for small cracks and later premature failure. The air leaks are ongoing and continual without maintenace. Depending upon the volume of room air hitting the face of the combustor, the duration of time necessary to cause failure varies.

When I discuss this matter with consumers I tell them first, their warranty is still in effect (if it is in terms of time frame) and then ask them to tell me (this requires honesty on their behalf) "when was the last time you did the dollar bill test?" Nearly 100% of the time it has not been done. This does not result in warranty being denied, and I always appreciate the honesty.

The second leading cause is thermal shock. In our units (with the bimetallic thermostat) over firing is very seldom the issue. However, tossing snow laden, or ice laden wood into a hot stove can create thermal shock. The rapid change is temperature is a big culprit to failure.

Down the list are burning improper items, too much paper, cardboard, green wood etc. These usually result in "over plating" or covering up of the precious metal which the keeps the combustors from operating correctly, leading to plugging and then it's all down hill from there.

Again, our incident rate is so very small because most folks do conduct the dollar bill test while others just use the Owners Manual to start their first fire! Any question, owners can always call us at 509-522-2730. We like to talk with owners and help them when needed.

Thank you to all of you for your support!

 

[aansorge]

Thanks BKVP for that good information. I put a brand new gasket in this summer ( and a new cat is going in as well) and I will be sure to be diligent on the dollar bill test.

Also, I don't plan to start the stove more than twice during the winter (early oct. and after winter vacation) but what is acceptable to start a fire? Is newspaper fine?

 

[Highbeam]

In March of 2013, we began a promotional program offering a 100% combustor warranty for a 10 year period. We were able to begin this warranty promotional program with the support of all our suppliers. This is only available because of the extremely low claim rate with our combustors/combustion design.

Chris, didn't this program begin in March of 2012? My stove has the 10 year warranty and it was bought in 2012.

I too have noticed cracks across my catalyst. No chunks falling out but corner to corner cracking on at least two of the three sections. The door seal is tight. I even added a turn to the latch to get extra tension.

 

[BKVP]

Asmall amount of paper is fine. This problematic issues center on folks that use their stoves as incinerators as opposed to getting a paper shredder. And it really is not good for the emvironment to burn "trash" in any wood stove, cat or non cat.

Thanks BKVP for that good information. I put a brand new gasket in this summer ( and a new cat is going in as well) and I will be sure to be diligent on the dollar bill test.

Also, I don't plan to start the stove more than twice during the winter (early oct. and after winter vacation) but what is acceptable to start a fire? Is newspaper fine?

 

[BKVP]

Highbeam, you caught my typo!! I though about logging on and fixing it but thought "I wonder if this will get caught". I forgot you were lurking! Good catch.

As for your combustor, even mine has very fine cracks in the ceramic squares. It's 8 or 9 years old and I get a discount (haha) so I will probably replace later. I am testing it to see how well it does post these small cracks. Although I don't have a dilution tunnel in my living room, I do have enough other stuff attached to it and the cat is functioning just fine.

I'll add you to my short list of close knit friends that tests these to there point of failure. I don't think you'll see much change, just don't take it out and mess with it.

I did start using the NE Idaho logs 3 years ago. They do burn pretty darn hot! And while I do keep the door seal tight, I may have burned the stove a bit too hot a few times. My thermocouple and data logger showed temps over 1700 twice last season. (Can I blame my wife?)

Keep me up to date on your experiences....

BTW, the I won't be able to go to the DC event! I drew a coveted whitetail deer tag for Idaho. Just got to get my priorities straight!

Chris, didn't this program begin in March of 2012? My stove has the 10 year warranty and it was bought in 2012.

I too have noticed cracks across my catalyst. No chunks falling out but corner to corner cracking on at least two of the three sections. The door seal is tight. I even added a turn to the latch to get extra tension.

 

[pete97]

BKVP,
Can I call you ? I am not sure if what I am seeing is normal or if I should have it replaced. I could take some pics and email them to you ? Can I go through you for warranty or my dealer ? I bought the stove in March of 2010. Thanks Pete

 

[BKVP]

Pete:

I get up at 4:30 every day. I'll be at work after 6:00 a.m. M-F (unless I'm on the road)

You (and anyone) can call me anytime. Always good to get acquainted.

So if this works, email your images to [email protected] tonight if possible.

Then call me at 6:00 (PST) or later tomorrow and we can go over your concerns, install, burning practices etc.

The earlier you call the more likely we can have some more time. Fill up your coffee mug.....

Chris

BKVP,
Can I call you ? I am not sure if what I am seeing is normal or if I should have it replaced. I could take some pics and email them to you ? Can I go through you for warranty or my dealer ? I bought the stove in March of 2010. Thanks Pete

 

[pete97]

Chris, Thanks. I will call tomorrow and try to get some pics tonight. Thanks a lot.

Pete:

I get up at 4:30 every day. I'll be at work after 6:00 a.m. M-F (unless I'm on the road)

You (and anyone) can call me anytime. Always good to get acquainted.

So if this works, email your images to [email protected] tonight if possible.

Then call me at 6:00 (PST) or later tomorrow and we can go over your concerns, install, burning practices etc.

The earlier you call the more likely we can have some more time. Fill up your coffee mug.....

Chris

 

[jeff_t]

I have many small cracks, running back into the cells, as well. Maybe 1/4-3/8". I'm not in a panic over it, but this will be the third winter. I may look harder at it toward the end.

I did brush the pipe today, for some reason. Always seems like a waste of time. The cap got cocked in a nasty thunderstorm, so as long as I was up there to straighten it, I ran the brush down.

 

[weatherguy]

Mine ran great for two years and I skipped the dollar bill test the third year figuring it was tight last I checked, bad move, I had a small leak and it wrecked the cat, my fault for being lax. I put in a new cat and I check the door whenever the stoves cold.

 

[Todd]

I adjusted my door a couple times last year. Maybe BK needs to improve on their door seal or look more into steel cats?

 

[pete97]

Thanks Chris from Blaze King for taking the time to speak with me this morning. Blaze King has the best customer service that I have ever experienced. Chris took the the time to answer all of my questions and concerns and we were on the phone for almost an hour. Thanks ! Pete

 

[Highbeam]

I adjusted my door a couple times last year. Maybe BK needs to improve on their door seal or look more into steel cats?

Knowing how much this door seal is costing them in cat replacements, you'd think it would be a priority to optimize the door seal design. In looking at mine last night, august 14th!, I can see that the knife edge door frame on the stove really depends on an accurate installation of the rope gasket. Too long or short on the rope and the knife edge doesn't hit the gasket in the middle.

Does BK install the OEM gasket or is that a dealer thing? It feels like mine could be longer so that the gasket circle is wider which would hit the knife edge better. If I was really tiny and could do the dollar bill test from the inside of the stove, I'm not so sure it would pass.

 

[jeff_t]

I adjusted my door a couple times last year. Maybe BK needs to improve on their door seal or look more into steel cats?

I've never touched mine. I checked it again yesterday, and the only place I could pull the bill out was on the hinge side. It wasn't easy, and on the verge of tearing if it wasn't a new bill.

 

[BKVP]

High beam....the actual fact is it isn't costly hardly anything in combustor warranty, hence the 10 year, 100% warranty. But give me a call and we can go over any concerns you may have.

I'm out for a home show until Monday, but call Monday or later and we can talk. We do use a special 3 layer 7/8" gasket in our doors. The bigger issue and one area we can do better is communicating the need to adjust the gasket tension beginning day 1. Too tight and the gasket gets crushed and too loose, there can be an air leak. The dollar bill test is the best tool....but we can do a better job communicating the process/need.


Thank yo

Knowing how much this door seal is costing them in cat replacements, you'd think it would be a priority to optimize the door seal design. In looking at mine last night, august 14th!, I can see that the knife edge door frame on the stove really depends on an accurate installation of the rope gasket. Too long or short on the rope and the knife edge doesn't hit the gasket in the middle.

Does BK install the OEM gasket or is that a dealer thing? It feels like mine could be longer so that the gasket circle is wider which would hit the knife edge better. If I was really tiny and could do the dollar bill test from the inside of the stove, I'm not so sure it would pass.

 

[BKVP]

Perfect!

I've never touched mine. I checked it again yesterday, and the only place I could pull the bill out was on the hinge side. It wasn't easy, and on the verge of tearing if it wasn't a new bill.

 

[Highbeam]

High beam....the actual fact is it isn't costly hardly anything in combustor warranty, hence the 10 year, 100% warranty. But give me a call and we can go over any concerns you may have.

I'm out for a home show until Monday, but call Monday or later and we can talk. We do use a special 3 layer 7/8" gasket in our doors. The bigger issue and one area we can do better is communicating the need to adjust the gasket tension beginning day 1. Too tight and the gasket gets crushed and too loose, there can be an air leak. The dollar bill test is the best tool....but we can do a better job communicating the process/need.


Thank yo

Thanks Chris, I'll take some photos. I am a tinkering nerdy kind of guy and sometimes fix things that aren't even broken!

 

[rdust]

Too tight and the gasket gets crushed and too loose, there can be an air leak.

My latch has a coarse thread, which can leave you too tight or too loose in one turn. I have plans to make a fine threaded latch which should give me a better range of adjustment.

I also found my door was hitting the gasket off center(top to bottom) so I used some spacers last year to raise my door some to center it better. Not sure if it needed this but I felt better with the sealing edge in the center of the gasket. Here is my post about it. <a href="https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...read-everything-bk.93182/page-29#post-1391180">2012-2013 Blaze King Performance Thread(everything BK)</a>

 

[Highbeam]

I also found my door was hitting the gasket off center(top to bottom) so I used some spacers last year to raise my door some to center it better. Not sure if it needed this but I felt better with the sealing edge in the center of the gasket. Here is my post about it. <a href="https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...read-everything-bk.93182/page-29#post-1391180">2012-2013 Blaze King Performance Thread(everything BK)</a>

So are you happy with the spacers?

 

[aansorge]

My gasket seems to tight on the hinge side and to loose on the latch side. I guess I'll just make it real tight so that the latch side is tight enough. Any downside to to tight?

 

[rdust]

So are you happy with the spacers?

They seem to be working fine. I don't "think" I had an issue the other way, I feel better with it this way though.