Can my EKO also heat my future shop

[hartkem]

Yet another question that I know you guys will have fun answering.

I originally installed the EKO 40 with the intention of heating both my house and my future shop. The future shop will be 32x48 with 2x6 walls, well insulated, about 60 foot from my boiler shack. My concern is i'm not sure if the EKO can heat both buildings because when its below 20 degrees outside I have to fire my boiler every 8 hours. I have 500 gallons of storage but it only extends my heating time by 4 hrs when its cold out. The boiler does seem to be able to increase storage temp very slowing when the house is drawing heat off it. My thought is that if I would fire the boiler every 4 hours it could heat both. I would mostly be using the building after work and some on the weekends. So only 3-4 hrs at a time. I plan to let it go cold and then heat it to 55-60 degrees so its comfortable working in. My house is 3700sqft and I believe the heat load to be 70k-90k btu when its in the teens outside. Im coming up with this number because i have a 90% 100k btu furnace that runs almost constantly when its in the teens outside. I'm debating if I should just put in a wood stove cause it would probably be cheaper and a lot easier, although i like the idea of heating with the fire I would have going anyway and not smelling the creosote inside the shop. Shop will be stick built, not pole barn.

I wanted to add that I run my fan speed at 70% (newer controller) I suspect that if I run it at 100% I would get more output?

 

[Bob Rohr]

Yet another question that I know you guys will have fun answering.

I originally installed the EKO 40 with the intention of heating both my house and my future shop. The future shop will be 32x48 with 2x6 walls, well insulated, about 60 foot from my boiler shack. My concern is i'm not sure if the EKO can heat both buildings because when its below 20 degrees outside I have to fire my boiler every 8 hours. I have 500 gallons of storage but it only extends my heating time by 4 hrs when its cold out. The boiler does seem to be able to increase storage temp very slowing when the house is drawing heat off it. My thought is that if I would fire the boiler every 4 hours it could heat both. I would mostly be using the building after work and some on the weekends. So only 3-4 hrs at a time. I plan to let it go cold and then heat it to 55-60 degrees so its comfortable working in. My house is 3700sqft and I believe the heat load to be 70k-90k btu when its in the teens outside. Im coming up with this number because i have a 90% 100k btu furnace that runs almost constantly when its in the teens outside. I'm debating if I should just put in a wood stove cause it would probably be cheaper and a lot easier, although i like the idea of heating with the fire I would have going anyway and not smelling the creosote inside the shop. Shop will be stick built, not pole barn.

I wanted to add that I run my fan speed at 70% (newer controller) I suspect that if I run it at 100% I would get more output?

Same boiler that I run. If it is firing at 80% efficiency expect around 109,000 BTU/hr from it. If in fact your house load is 90,000 at design, you don't have a lot EKO output to spare. I suspect you see some conditions below 20F in your area, So at a design of 0 F, the EKO will be pressed to meet the house load.

The shop load, maybe 20 btu/ sq. ft puts that load at 30,000BTU/hr, depending on construction and the design indoor temperature you desire. Also add some transmission loss piping across.

I've used very inexpensive, easy to build, barrel stoves in a few of my former shops, they heat quickly and hold a good load of wood. Be careful of flameables or storing mowers, etc that could cause a fire hazard. Codes and Insurance could be an issue with a wood burning appliance in a garage.

What about a sealed combustion pellet stove?

 

[stee6043]

If your EKO has the output to satisfy both at max output running full-bore you'll certainly be more efficient to heat both loads with the EKO vs adding a wood stove. It's all going to come down to your load. I personally would think that you could easily super-insulate your new shop and make it easily heatable by the EKO (along with your hosue). You would probably spend less on some high end insulation than you would a wood stove for the shop. Insulate that sucker to the hills and you can heat it with a 100W lightbulb.

 

[maple1]

Just seat of the pants here - but it sounds like you're almost maxing the Eko out now just with the house with how you're having to fire it. But, if you build the shop as well insulated as you can, and don't heat it much as you say you're planning - you could likely do it with the more frequent firings when needed. The shop would likely end up with a fraction of the heat load the house is (that's a big house!). I'd likely try it, depending on how big of a job running the lines to it will be.

 

[hartkem]

I also think the EKO has its hands full heating the house. I believe the previous owner sold the house because the propane was insane. I was paying 450 month last winter(mild winter) with house at 66 degrees. I haven't had any trouble keeping the house at 70 so far this winter but it hasn't been below 14 degrees outside yet. The house is realatively new contruction and has some flaws. I have fixed some of them but have some to go but I don't expect a big improvement in the heat load. Bottom line is the house is large with a entire wall of 8' tall windows on the north side with cathedral ceilings. Since Im not running antifreeze what do you suggest for freeze protection for the water lines in the new shop? My outdoor boiler shack has a backup electric heater in it and is super insulated. I plumbed in boiler tappings for future expansion. I thought about putting an A419 in the shop with the sensing bulb attached to the copper line set at 33 degrees which would activate the circ pump for the shop circuit. Good idea or is there a better alternative.

 

[mr.fixit]

8 hour reloads hartkem?

I agree with Stee on this one,heat everything with one unit,even if it's maxed out.
Your storage might not be as useful but the EKO will be more efficient running more.

I must be doing dang good because I heat around 4000 sq. ft. in 3 separate buildings(4 if you count the garage where the boiler is located)with an EKO 40.
Now granted it does run almost all the time when it's cold out but what's wrong with that?

I put the boiler in because I had 3 wood stoves going previously and some days it was a full time job just stoking fires.
I would never go back to that.

If you put infloor radiant in the shop and insulate it well it shouldn't take to much to keep it 50-55 degrees.

Thats what I would do but then again according to others here I'm kinda a cobbler.I suppose I am somewhat but if it works,what the heck.

 

[hartkem]

8 hour reloads hartkem?

I agree with Stee on this one,heat everything with one unit,even if it's maxed out.
Your storage might not be as useful but the EKO will be more efficient running more.

I must be doing dang good because I heat around 4000 sq. ft. in 3 separate buildings(4 if you count the garage where the boiler is located)with an EKO 40.
Now granted it does run almost all the time when it's cold out but what's wrong with that?

I put the boiler in because I had 3 wood stoves going previously and some days it was a full time job just stoking fires.
I would never go back to that.

If you put infloor radiant in the shop and insulate it well it shouldn't take to much to keep it 50-55 degrees.

Thats what I would do but then again according to others here I'm kinda a cobbler.I suppose I am somewhat but if it works,what the heck.

Unfortunately thats all im gettting. If its 30-40 outside I can get 12hrs with no problem. There has to be some output left since I can go 8 hours. If I was down to 4-6 hrs I would say that its maxed out. Only reason Im not big on in floor radiant is the slow recovery. I want to go outside, turn the heat on and be comfortable within an hr or so. Im thinking an electric an handler with wahx in the plenum. That way I can also have A/C if I want to. Still concerned about the lines freezing.

 

[Quincy]

Just a thought could you find some good used cast iron rads and plumb them in series on the return side from the house these emitters will heat with temps down to 100 degrees might be an option.

 

[ewdudley]

Only reason Im not big on in floor radiant is the slow recovery. I want to go outside, turn the heat on and be comfortable within an hr or so. Im thinking an electric an handler with wahx in the plenum. That way I can also have A/C if I want to. Still concerned about the lines freezing.

You don't know how the garage will be used in the future and it should be quite economical to maintain the floor at 40 degF or whatever if the place has any solar gain to speak of. Then have a WAHX to get the place up to 50 or 55 and you'll have the best of both worlds; comfortable air temperature and a floor that doesn't chill your feet. I didn't put PEX in my garage floor years ago and I've regretted it ever since.

 

[Bob Rohr]

Im coming up with this number because i have a 90% 100k btu furnace that runs almost constantly when its in the teens outside. I'm debating if I should just put in a wood stove cause it would probably be cheaper and a lot easier, although i like the idea of heating with the fire I would have going anyway and not smelling the creosote inside the shop. Shop will be stick built, not pole barn.

 

[Bob Rohr]

If your 100,000, 90 % furnace runs non stop then you house load is pretty close to 90,000 BTU/hr at that outdoor temperature in the teens. Figure some duct loss so also. That sounds reasonable for a 4000 square foot home, at about 22 BTU/ sq ft heating load.

If temperatures outside drop below the teens the indoor temperature will start to drop. Infiltration is the biggest thief, even in mild temperature conditions, look for ways to tighten up the air leaks to bring down the house load. See if you can get a blower door test performed. Many utilities offer that service for a low fee, or free.

So at any day below design conditions you would have some EKO output to spare. Keep in mind that is with the EKO cranking at full speed, it takes some "fire-sitting" to keep them stoked to full output 24/7.