Can you "throttle" down the burn rate?

[Jerry_NJ]

I've found with my new (this year) Quadrafire 4100I Insert that with a temperature difference between room and outside in excess of 40 degrees (F) that even with both vents shut down as far as they will go I am unable to hold the fire down. Here I not I'd like to keep the thermometer (magnet attached mechanical) attached just above the fire door below 600 degrees, it is impossible when there is a lot of free space (not sure what happens if the fire box if fully loaded) in the firebox. Even with the recirculater fan running at top speed I get temperatures readings in the 800+ range, close to over firing (?). Is this normal, or should I be able to choke the air flow off enough to really shut down the fire?

This also makes a large open living room too hot/dry, runs at about 75 degrees (outside in the upper 20s). This is too hot for me.

This also makes me wonder how much room heat I'm losing up the chimney when the stove/insert is not being used. Clearly the "dampers" don't really close off air flow.

 

[offroadaudio]

Mine runs a little hot also. It helps to load some rounds instead of splits, bank the air flow down earlier, and load east / west not N / S.
Also arrange the splits so that they are tight to one another to minimize airflow.
Hope that helps

 

[karl]

I don't much about Quads but I'll assume they are pretty much like any other non cat stove.

First, how tall is your chimney? If it's crazy tall you might have a problem.

Second, in excess of forty degrees is a pretty good delta to maintain, but most of us can do a little better. It should draft really well like that but it shouldn't run away.

I would look for leaking gaskets in the stove. I bet it's getting air from somewhere if it's staying at 800 for any length of time.

Also, is it running at 800 for a long time? My Summit will get really hot when the secondaries kick in, but it stablizes in an hour or so.

Are you using big splits or small stuff?

If the stove isn't full of wood. I don't see how you could get it that hot.

Lastly check your thermometer to see if its accurate.

 

[savageactor7]

Well Jerry that does sound a little too hot to me. If ya had a stove I'd recommend an inline damper but with an insert ...I dunno?

Maybe once you have an established coal bed you could try burning a split at a time or like was already suggested a round. I take it you already tried to move the excess heat to the rest of the house with little effect too. hummmm.

 

[Jerry_NJ]

Thanks.

To the question: chimney is about 32' and is in a masonry chimney and the liner has the insulation wrap.

I have not yet loaded the stove full, and as the cold weather is just arriving here in central NJ, I'm still burning mostly small pieces that are real dry. This stuff I had on top of my wood supply to be sure to burn it this year, not let it slip to the back of the stack and still be there for next year. So, I was in the more-or-less "recreational" burning mode, putting in a few pieces of wood every hour or two, not loading. Still, for example, last night before going to bed at midnight I put two splits in (all hardwood) that were just "typical", not real thick, and this morning at 8 am the face of the insert was still hot to the touch and, of course, there were still hot coals in the ashes. Looking at my central heating control I found the room temperature still 2 degrees above my set-back temperature, suggestion to me the heat pump did not come on at all over night. It got down into the low 20s outside, the living room was at 62 and upstairs at 63+.

I do have some 4-5" rounds that I planned use for longer burns. I also have some large splits, large compared to my 2 CF fire box.

I would not say the stove was in runaway, but I think 800 degrees is higher than desired and is over range for the markings on my thermometer which marks 300-600 as the best range for creosote contol.

For those who like to compare stats, my house is about 25 years old, a two story 2000 square footer with frame construction, but with a 8 foot wide brick wall that contains the fireplace (subject insert) as well as a fireplace in the MBedroom upstairs. The house was built as an "all electric" so it has R38 or better in the ceiling, and R19 walls with thermal glass, but still plenty of glass for heat loss. Fifteen years ago I upgraded the heat pump to a geothermal heat pump.

 

[Corey]

Thanks.

To the question: chimney is about 32' and is in a masonry chimney and the liner has the insulation wrap....

GAWD!! - There is your problem...that thing is probably drafting like a Hoover vacuum cleaner! Search around the forums a bit for 'overdraft' and read about solutions others had success with - or maybe someone will chime in here. But generally, you may be looking at adding a second damper to lower the draft a bit.

 

[daleeper]

From your first post that indicates the problem develops when the the temperature deviation is 40 degrees was the first clue that draft was increasing too much at that point. When you announced a 32' chimney, that is clue number 2 that too much draft is an issue. It is my understanding that you cannot completely close the air off an epa approved stove as they are designed to allow some air in with the controls completely shut down, so you will not be able to completely shut air off at the stove. I would however make sure that there is no other air leaks in the stove and flue before taking the next step. This would include door gaskets, and your flue connections. From there, I default to the chimney experts on how to deal with too much draft, as I have no experience in dealing with this problem from the chimney side with a masonry chimney.

Good luck.

 

[Jerry_NJ]

Thanks, the insert is running right now, with an outside temp of 40 and inside about 72. I'm still burning small pieces, just a few at at time and the insert is running stable at about 450, with the fan on medium speed. Really a very pleasant burn looking through the windows into the fire. I had the damper almost all the way off and just now pulled it to full off.

Yes, we now have a much lower delta temp, of about 30 degrees, and at night that goes toward 50 degrees. Still I'm not characterizing the fire as a run away, just running hotter than I wanted and I couldn't pull it down with the insert's damper.

I was also concerned about when there is no fire in the insert, am I losing much room heat up the chimney, i.e., the old fireplace leaky damper problem. I assume not, that is with a cold fire box there isn't much "suck" on the room air, nothing like what there is when the fire is going and it's 1000 degrees plus inside the firebox, there other side of the damper.

 

[savageactor7]

Jerry I think 450-500 is good burning...

... as far as your back up heat going out the chimney I don't think that should be a big problem. Of course I'm no engineer but the stove more or less being a closed system and heats property to rise, NO, your worries are totally unfounded.

I think your just more conscience of 'heat loss' because of all the up grades you've done to the house over the years. All you have to do is hawk enough wood to burn just a few pieces at a time and fix moving that heat around the house so you can enjoy the fire. I say you're golden but don't know it.