Chimney Leaking, Need Advice

[stoveguy123]

House was built in late 70's. Originally looks like it was a wood fireplace, as there is an ash pit...When we bought the house it had an old rusty gas fireplace. We pulled the gas fireplace out and had it inspected by a chimney service, so we could burn wood until we got our nice fancy wood insert.

Chimney service found that it has a metal firebox, and that it is rusted out, therefor no open fire can be had due to it being rusted out and damaged...We have also noticed that during large storm events when it rains the fireplace will drip, slow drip nothing crazy. Now we know why it rusted out, you can literally peel the rusted metal out. Just had the roof re-done and chimney service said the flashing was in excellent condition, crown was in excellent condition, and the mortar and brick of the chimney was in excellent condition. Chimney service estimates that water is coming from seepage of the brick, and needs to be sealed in the summer time once it is dryer and warm enough to apply the waterproofing/sealant. Chimney service also noted that because it is a metal fire box, the metal firebox cannot be repaired. It would have to be replaced which would mean rebuilding the entire chimney?!?!

Would like to get a second opinion from someone who has experience on this site before getting a second opinion, as all the chimney folks in my area cost a minimum of $200 just to come look at it.

So,

1. Does replacement of a metal firebox mean a total rebuild of chimney?
2. Does water seepage from the porous brick sound like a realistic cause of water dripping/damage given everything else is in great condition?

Last thing I want to do is install a new $4k wood stove only to have it rust out in a couple years....

Thanks

 

[begreen]

Is there a cap or top cover over the flue exit on top of the chimney?

 

[bholler]

Does replacement of a metal firebox mean a total rebuild of chimney?

No not at all we cut out the metal and build a masonry box in its place but that is going to cost about the same if not more than a liner and insert.

Does water seepage from the porous brick sound like a realistic cause of water dripping/damage given everything else is in great condition?

I doubt it i would get a second opinion on the condition of the masonry and flashing

 

[stoveguy123]

Is there a cap or top cover over the flue exit on top of the chimney?

Yes, there is...The chimney company also said that the crown and cap where is great shape. Also, the flashing was just installed this last summer (4 months ago, when we had the roof replaced).

 

[begreen]

If the leakage can be stopped then I believe an insert can be installed in the heatform with a full liner as long as there is a double-course of bricks surrounding the heatform.

 

[xterra]

Hello all, long time lurker first time poster. My intention was to have my first post in March 2016 which i was going to drop a bomb on the process of a fireplace root canal. Let's just say when i bought my house I thought something was a little off with a zero clearance inside a masonry fireplace (was prior to finding the site.) Wishing i saved up cash before demo'ing the wall... doh!

i personally did not find much on the net other than an issue of a chimney sweep magazine were a mason out of new jersey explained the process. luckily found a reputable mason in my area, and will probably be paying a premium, but after i started the process of replacing the crappy ZC with a wood insert, i was quickly over my head and needed a professional.

I know the original builder of the house, he said he installed a heatform (steel firebox) fireplace with a field stone facing. I currently had drywall and a ZC, so pulled some of the drywall away to see what was going on. The previous owner obviously had rust issues, so took an air hammer to get it out. He destroyed the whole hearth, the field stone facing, and firebox. I can only assume when he realized how much work it would take to correctly fix, said screw it and put in a ZC for me to be the sucker down the road. He had no idea what he was doing he damaged the firebox so bad. i immediately called the mason because i was worried the entire chimney would collapse from the inside. the firebox was not salvageable...

I am biting the bullet and paying $5+k for the remaining demo, firebox rebuild, and a new hearth and facing to seal up the area between the firebox and the chimney shell. I have given in to the fact it's not something i can do myself considering the weight that's potentially supported of bricks above your head. I am already under contract so will post the project when complete. Again, this could be a premium but my guy is booked far out so i think that says something other than his other jobs i've seen online.

the 2nd phase will be buying/installing the stove into the new setup.

GOOD LUCK. i know i started drinking a little bit more heavily after opening up the wall around the ZC.

 

[bholler]

the 2nd phase will be buying/installing the stove into the new setup.

Does he know this? Because if so he would relly not need to build a complete firebox just make sure you have enough masonry between the insert and any combustibles and then rebuild the face

 

[xterra]

Yes, I'm not getting a 100% functional firebox, but what is there now is all cracked up and does not appear solid. Same with above the lintel. I opted for the tearout/rebuild so that way I can fit a large insert. If a new course of bricks was placed inside the current situation, i'd loose space to the point where I'd have a dinky insert.

On the flip side i could have installed the insert into the ZC that is in there now, but then again, it would be the dinkiest insert on the market.

http://issuu.com/ncsg/docs/sweepingaug2015_8_20_15

here's the link for the story. could be as easy as adding an insert/liner, or busting out a plasma torch. I'll be back when my project is completed! Major PITA for my specific situation.

 

[elmoleaf]

drips from flue...hard to say without pics or eyes on the situation . Perhaps: improper drip edge on crown, open gap between crown and clay liner (ideally this should be a flexible sealant joint, as cement and clay expand/contract at diff rates and open crack will occur), leaking from adjacent uncovered flue, mortar gaps or cracks not yet discovered further down the chimney, or condensation dripping from flue.

 

[webby3650]

Yes, there is...The chimney company also said that the crown and cap where is great shape. Also, the flashing was just installed this last summer (4 months ago, when we had the roof replaced).

Can you take a picture of the crown? I'd put money on the crown being the culprit!

 

[stoveguy123]

I will post some pics this weekend when I have some day light. By the time I get off work its dark out ):

 

[stoveguy123]

Here are the pics, let me know what you guys think! Thanks!

 

[The Principal]

If you do end up taking the box and the liner out, I would have all masonry work done and wait for a few rainstorms to inspect for leakage prior to any new instal. I faced a mystery leak in my last home's chimney and it was a serious pain and source of stress.

 

[webby3650]

I see several things that are suspect. Theres no storm collar where the pipe passes through that plate. The plate isn't sealed down, water could be blowing in or splashing in there. Could also be condensation forming on that plate since it's not sealed down.
The crown has a few cracks, the crack right at the edge where the crown meets the brick is a likely culprit. In one pic I can see a limestone ledge about halfway down, it's got moss all along its edge where it meets the brick. There's also several places on the brick itself that has moss and algae growing on it, that's a sign that water is weeping out of the bricks there. I'm not sure where I'd start on this one.

 

[elmoleaf]

Yup, metal flashing not sealed at the ends that arent turned down. Improperly formed crown..should project beyond face of brick below and ideally have drip cut. In on of last photos it also appears to be an open vertical mortar joint between bricks

 

[jetsam]

I would guess that that flashing has been leaking from the first day it was installed. Water is free to run off the side and back around the bottom of the flashing, even if the masonary was in perfect shape.

 

[zig]

You need a different chimney guy.

 

[stoveguy123]

Thanks for the advice guys. Any idea what it would cost to get the crown and cap replaced? Rough ballpark?

Oh and is there anything I can do in the mean time to seal the gaps, like a caulk or temporary grout. As I said before, the fire box is toast so there will be no fire in it till we get everything fixed. It would be nice however to get the leak to stop...

 

[bholler]

Thanks for the advice guys. Any idea what it would cost to get the crown and cap replaced? Rough ballpark?

Oh and is there anything I can do in the mean time to seal the gaps, like a caulk or temporary grout. As I said before, the fire box is toast so there will be no fire in it till we get everything fixed. It would be nice however to get the leak to stop...

Honestly the crown doe not look to bad. It would be much better if it over hung yes but it is not necessary. It does need cleaned and re pointed. I am not sure but it looks like a few bad brick to be replaced. And then do a proper top setup on the liner and seal the crack between the chimney and crown. I would think that would fix your issues. We would charge roughly $800 for that $1200 to $1400 if we were pouring a crown to. If it needed re flashed that would be additional also.

 

[stoveguy123]

Wow, if there is one thing I've learned from all this, it's that chimney's are expensive...

 

[bholler]

Wow, if there is one thing I've learned from all this, it's that chimney's are expensive...

There are guys that will do it cheaper i am sure