Dry stack cultured stone

[freddy]

Hello all.

I am looking at upgrading my existing brick fireplace with a dry stack cultured stone. I was told that I could just use mortar to the existing brick and the stone would stick right to it. This seems too easy and most of my home projects are not as easy as I am told. Is there any other preperation that may need to take place before installing this stuff to existing brick? Some of the bricks have a white residue on them and I was told to remove that first. Any input or advise is appreciated!

 

[Ashful]

No advice on application, but being an old house nut owning many old stone houses, I can give you advice on design. Most of the cultured stone applications I see (many on this forum) are simply horrendous. It can be done well, but so few take the time to look at what a real stacked stone fireplace really looks like, before jumping into the nuts and bolts of how to stick it together.

For starters, stone should never, never, NEVER look like this:



The mason (or homeowner) who built that has clearly never taken the time to look at a real stone wall, or they'd realize stone is never laid up on the edge like that, excepting perhaps down the center of an end wall containing an interior chimney.

Stone is laid and stacked flat, so that you see the edges, like this:



Two applications, both cultured stone. One is beautiful, the other a horrendous choice.

 

[begreen]

Different regions stack different stone differently. They have different material to work with. A good New England drystack wall after a century holding its own speaks well of the builder.

 

[Highbeam]

The mason (or homeowner) who built that has clearly never taken the time to look at a real stone wall, or they'd realize stone is never laid up on the edge like that, excepting perhaps down the center of an end wall containing an interior chimney. Stone is laid and stacked flat, so that you see the edges, like this:

But joful, that depends on the stones. We blast rock out of basalt formations and our rocks are not square. We stack them however we can, sometimes on edge. As shown in your round rock example, stones don't always have a flat side. I like the stacked square rock look myself but realize that it is fake.

This low rock wall was built by me with 4-8" quarry spalls. Dry of course.

 

[begreen]

The stone veneer on a fireplace should look like what the owner wants to look at. I have always found the squared flat look of stone to be more prairie style. This is the fireplace stonework in the inn my wife grew up in. It was built during the chestnut blight of the early 30s.

 

[Ashful]

begreen, those two dry-stacked walls are indeed stacked the way I describe it should be. Laid for the most part on the flattest / broadest side, not on edge.

That fireplace in your second post had a few accent stones laid on edge for an intentional effect, which is a whole other side to the art. I'm talking about the folks who lay "lick and stick" stone up on a fireplace, intending it to look like a real stone fireplace, not grasping the concept of how a real stone structure is actually built.

I've always said, "they need to make ties for guys with bad taste, too." Likewise with stone, you can do whatever you like, but I see so many people spending money to get a lay-up like I show in my first photo, and then wondering why it doesn't look nearly as nice as (or as "right" as) the stonework in the old houses they're often trying to replicate. "Why doesn't this look like that?" Just trying to educate...

 

[bsruther]

I'm in the process of rebuilding my fireplace and I plan on using stone veneer field stone to refinish it. Whenever I do a home project that I'm not familiar with, I research as many resources that I can find, discovering how to and sometimes, how not to do that project. Youtube as well as many other DIY and other forums including this one, have been great resources. But when it comes to cultured stone, I haven't found a whole lot of info. What I have found leads me to believe that it's not that difficult and not much different than setting tile. The only thing that worries me is placement of the rocks, but I have come up with a solution for that. I'm going to make a layout of the area I'm covering, on the floor and have the wife lay all of the stones where she thinks they should go. I'll then transfer them to the wall, in that same pattern. If it doesn't look right when it's finished, guess who's fault it will be.

I'm going to set the stone on backer board and I'll probably give it a scratch coat and let it dry, before setting the stone. Most of the videos I've seen, say to only butter the back of the stone and not the surface it's being applied to, but I'm kind of concerned that it won't get complete contact. I figure a scratch coat will give it more contact.
My demolition should be done next week. So far, this has been one of my funnest house projects.

To answer your question though, yes, it will adhere directly to the brick, from what I've seen.
Skip to 10:25 in this video and they show how to apply it to brick

 

[Ashful]

Oh... just noticed I left the round rock photo attached to my OP. Not intended, but I was looking at that as an example of exactly what Highbeam says... different materials can lead to different design. In answering the OP, I was assuming a more traditional field stone dry stack.

 

[freddy]

I'm in the process of rebuilding my fireplace and I plan on using stone veneer field stone to refinish it. Whenever I do a home project that I'm not familiar with, I research as many resources that I can find, discovering how to and sometimes, how not to do that project. Youtube as well as many other DIY and other forums including this one, have been great resources. But when it comes to cultured stone, I haven't found a whole lot of info. What I have found leads me to believe that it's not that difficult and not much different than setting tile. The only thing that worries me is placement of the rocks, but I have come up with a solution for that. I'm going to make a layout of the area I'm covering, on the floor and have the wife lay all of the stones where she thinks they should go. I'll then transfer them to the wall, in that same pattern. If it doesn't look right when it's finished, guess who's fault it will be.

Great video and info.

Thank you!

I'm going to set the stone on backer board and I'll probably give it a scratch coat and let it dry, before setting the stone. Most of the videos I've seen, say to only butter the back of the stone and not the surface it's being applied to, but I'm kind of concerned that it won't get complete contact. I figure a scratch coat will give it more contact.
My demolition should be done next week. So far, this has been one of my funnest house projects.

To answer your question though, yes, it will adhere directly to the brick, from what I've seen.
Skip to 10:25 in this video and they show how to apply it to brick

 

[Oregon aloha]

Here is how the brick looked and the cultured stone was just buttered on and then grouted. It's not dry stack but it is cultured stone.

 

[billb3]

No advice on application, but being an old house nut owning many old stone houses, I can give you advice on design. Most of the cultured stone applications I see (many on this forum) are simply horrendous. It can be done well, but so few take the time to look at what a real stacked stone fireplace really looks like, before jumping into the nuts and bolts of how to stick it together.

For starters, stone should never, never, NEVER look like this:

View attachment 116383
.

Um, that's a quite popular way to build a stone wall around here.
It can take weeks of tap, tap, tapping to break the stones open to do that.
Expensive. Labor extensive and slow going.

 

[madison]

A few pics, we've had 2 different fireplaces done with cultured stone at our previous residence, same mason same technique. Mesh used on both, one was "dry stacked" the other was grouted.

Note these were both gas inserts....

Only one image of the dry stacked, our old mutt died at 17 yrs of age a few months after this picture

 

[Ashful]

Um, that's a quite popular way to build a stone wall around here.
It can take weeks of tap, tap, tapping to break the stones open to do that.
Expensive. Labor extensive and slow going.

Actually, it's the cheap way out, and a dead give-away that it's not the true stacked stone wall it's posing to be. If you're going to use stone as siding, at least take some effort to make it look half real, not like stones glued to a concrete wall.

 

[Paul L]

Actually, it's the cheap way out, and a dead give-away that it's not the true stacked stone wall it's posing to be. If you're going to use stone as siding, at least take some effort to make it look half real, not like stones glued to a concrete wall.

You're correct in that it wouldn't be correct to call that install "stacked stone" ... at the same time it is perfectly acceptable. Whether you like it or not is a matter of taste. Lots of folks like it.

To say "stone should never ever look like this" is way off base....that is a good install.

 

[Ashful]

Okay, point taken... but I can then argue that some of us have better taste than others. ;-)

Here's what was done for the 1994 addition on my house. New 2x6 construction with 8" stone veneer, but people who aren't masons or old house nuts have a very hard time distinguishing the new stone work (foreground) from the original 1770's work (background).



My primary objective wasn't to criticize, although I'm sure it came across that way. More, I hear so often people saying their new stone veneered house just doesn't look as nice as an old stone house, but they can't seem to put their finger on the reason why...

 

[DevilsBrew]

Interior design might have a lot to do with the final product, Joful. Rustic surroundings are going to bring out the character of the stone. Stick the same fireplace in a modern house and it will have a different look to it.

By the way, Freddy, I favor stonework so I hope you post pictures of the finished project.