drywalling bathroom mud question

[struggle]

This is more of I just want to know thing. I am remodeling a bathroom of which I did not intend to re-drywall, but since I hate wallpaper and I spent two hours removing two layers of a small section I decided to gut it and start from scratch and spare the agony of pulling wall paper for good.

My question it more of technique. How have you handled the mudding? I use the heavy premixed stuff in the pails and start with a small trowel and then step up to a bigger one and then one more step after that and sand in between coats and touch up as needed before primer.

This method is painfully slow as I am not quick like the pros at this but have in all the rooms I have done I yet to find a crack in any wall joints I have ever done.

What works for you.

I am not going to texture this bathroom as I will do some type a two coat paint thing that looks kind cool but cannot think of what it is called.

I left the ceiling intact and will have to do the best I can with it as the joint goes and if I am not happy then crown modeling will go up.

 

[pegdot]

Don't you just want to throttle whoever hung that paper without sizing the walls first?
If the old wallpaper is stuck on that tight all over I'd likely just smooth any seams with mud then prime and paint right over it.

 

[Eric Johnson]

I did that to a small bathroom in our house and when I got the wallpaper all off, discovered that whoever did the work in the first place never taped the joints. That might be one reason why the wallpaper tore in the corners. Anyway, taping everything up took a lot more time, and then of course I had to mud everything down right. It always takes me forever, too, but I've noticed that you (I) can't get it all smoothed and feathered out without at least three coats of mud--more in some cases. That's just the way it is.

You can avoid some of that messy sanding between coats by taking it down with a wet sponge instead, but you should still sand the final coat or two for a good finish. If the wallpaper is intact in the corners, then I'd mud right over it like pegdot said. The worst job is plastering a ceiling; you eat a lot of dust, but the results are worth it and if you do it right, you'll never have to do it again.

 

[eba1225]

Struggle,

Unfortunately that method is the probably the best way to do it. I do not use paper tape, but use the tacky mesh tape, it sticks to the wallboard a little better and hold the mud a little better also. It usually takes me three passes to get it ready for painting:

1 - Attach tape and mud the tape in, paying attention not to leave an big mounds.

2 - Lightly sand previous coat where there are bumps and install the 2nd layer of mud.

3 - Again lightly sand previous coat where there are bumps and install the final layer of mud.

Then final sand and paint.

The more you pay attention to not leaving bumps and mounds the less sanding you will have to do. There have been times where I only sanded once, the final sand before painting.

 

[thephotohound]

Struggle -

I'm far from an expert, but I've done a lot of drywall. As far as the sanding goes, the greatest tools I own are a Ryobi orbital palm sander ($30) and a standard shop-vac. Buy the sander-to-vac attachment, some 100 and 180 sanding discs, and you're good to go. Connect the two, turn the vac on, then the sander, and go to town. 100 for your first coat, and 180 for the next 2 (unless you have some tough spots to grind down, then use 100 again, but always 180 last). This eliminates 75% of the dust and cuts the time in 1/2. I don't know what I'd do without them. But just like spray painting, always keep the sander moving, and keep one hand free to constantly feel the wall for smooth transitions. Also, keep a bright light (I use a 500 watt halogen) on the area you're working on. It shows the imperfections. After some practice, you can't go wrong with this method. Good luck!

 

[Eric Johnson]

Then final sand and paint.

Or, prime and then paint.

 

[struggle]

Don't you just want to throttle whoever hung that paper without sizing the walls first?
If the old wallpaper is stuck on that tight all over I'd likely just smooth any seams with mud then prime and paint right over it.

While I know little about wallpaper is sizing something they put down so the wallpaper can be removed? I tried with the jell stuff and scarring wheel and it was clear it was going to take more time to do that then to remove the old drywall which is what I have done.

It was like the paper was super glued on. There where two layers of wallpaper.

I like the sound of using a sander on it. I may look into that.

 

[Corey]

There is a good set of tutorials at: (broken link removed to http://www.drywallschool.com/protips.htm)

I stumbled on most of these after working through about 4 rooms of drywall. The 'big' tips that I think help me out the most

1) Thin that mud down It's way too thick right out of the bucket. It should be like mayonnaise or thick pudding.
2) When you put the tape on, make sure you get mud squishing out both sides - if not, it won't stick
3) Do only one side of the corner, let it dry, then do the other.
4) It is WAY easer to fill in a little low spot than to sand off a high spot - if you have to err, make it a little low.
5) I spend an extra buck or two and get the lightweight, dust control, easy sanding mud. It really helps on all aspects. I only use the 'normal' mud for the knockdown texture afterward.

There are tons more tips on the page, and video's too.

 

[struggle]

Cozy that is a great site! Thanks for that as it is bookmarked now :coolsmile:

 

[Hogwildz]

I went through the same thing in two bathrooms at the old house. I tried the enzymes, strippers etc etc etc. I ended up scraping with a 6" Spackle blade. Took forever, a lil a night after work each night. Dug the crap out of the drywall. But was determined to avoid demolition. I too finally bought a Ryobi orbital sander and some 60 & 80 grit paper for it. Worked great Of course the digs & where the drywall top paper came off down tot the brown layers was all over the place. I ended up skim coating the walls & ceiling 3x with a good drying & sanding in between. Took a long time, but in the end looked better than any other drywall in the rest of the house. I hate drywall, and I hate wallpaper even more! Hence the reason for the pine tongue & groove in the addition in the new place here. Will leave the pine natural, and seal it with satin finish clear coat. Of course guess what is on the kitchen & downstairs walls here? Argh, and to top that off, the pop corned the bathroom ceiling. I can see serious scraping and skim coating somewhere down the road. The other option is, to put a layer of thin 1/4" or so drywall over top the old walls. I will prolly be doing more tongue & groove myself.

Edit: I just remembered. I had a leak in the shower upstairs above the kitchen last year. The drywall soffit area above the kitchen counters was....... WALL PAPERED sides & ceiling! I started with the enzymes again, then scraped. Then bought a steamer at HD. It worked great!! Loosened it right up and scraped under & off. But the drywall was sized, so I am sure that made the difference.

 

[GVA]

The Mrs. has used a spray bottle with warm water and a bit of Downey fabric softener in addition to the scoring wheel, works like a charm and cheaper than that DIF stuff ;-)
This is in response to removing wallpaper...........And has nothing to do with the original question ;-P

 

[Eric Johnson]

Cozy that is a great site! Thanks for that as it is bookmarked now :coolsmile:

Ditto!

 

[struggle]

The Mrs. has used a spray bottle with warm water and a bit of Downey fabric softener in addition to the scoring wheel, works like a charm and cheaper than that DIF stuff ;-)
This is in response to removing wallpaper...........And has nothing to do with the original question ;-P

Dif is what I used on the start ( and scoring tiger wheel) and I was able to remove the paper but the layer of glue was the problem. Once I recoated the glue it ended up damaging the drywall so I went nuts and removed all the drywall except the ceiling. At least this way there will be no hint of wallpaper in that room. I did the same thing with the master bath as well but that remodel included wall reconstruction for a different shower.

Wall paper in my mind sucks big time. I just hate it with a passion. Way to time consuming even if we wanted to just put new wallpaper on.

 

[Hogwildz]

I went through the same thing in two bathrooms at the old house. I tried the enzymes, strippers etc etc etc. I ended up scraping with a 6" Spackle blade. Took forever, a lil a night after work each night. Dug the crap out of the drywall. But was determined to avoid demolition. I too finally bought a Ryobi orbital sander and some 60 & 80 grit paper for it. Worked great Of course the digs & where the drywall top paper came off down tot the brown layers was all over the place. I ended up skim coating the walls & ceiling 3x with a good drying & sanding in between. Took a long time, but in the end looked better than any other drywall in the rest of the house. I hate drywall, and I hate wallpaper even more! Hence the reason for the pine tongue & groove in the addition in the new place here. Will leave the pine natural, and seal it with satin finish clear coat. Of course guess what is on the kitchen & downstairs walls here? Argh, and to top that off, the pop corned the bathroom ceiling. I can see serious scraping and skim coating somewhere down the road. The other option is, to put a layer of thin 1/4" or so drywall over top the old walls. I will prolly be doing more tongue & groove myself.

Edit: I just remembered. I had a leak in the shower upstairs above the kitchen last year. The drywall soffit area above the kitchen counters was....... WALL PAPERED sides & ceiling! I started with the enzymes again, then scraped. Then bought a steamer at HD. It worked great!! Loosened it right up and scraped under & off. But the drywall was sized, so I am sure that made the difference.

did you do the enzymes after using a "paper tiger" gizmo that is a roller with spikes that punches holes into the wallpaper before applying the enzymes?

Yeap I sure did. Bottom line is, if it ain't sized prior to the wallpaper going on, your in for a long hard scrape, or cover with new wall board, or tear off and resheet.

 

[pegdot]

Here's a good explanation of sizing.....http://www.askthebuilder.com/377_Wallpaper_on_Drywall_-_The_Right_Way.shtml

I've struggled with the same situation on plaster walls. The paper came off after a lot of effort but the glue didn't because it had actually seeped into the wall surface. Sanding it off, repairing any gouges, and then priming it before painting was a pain! I cussed whoever put it up for days on end. lol A steamer will sometimes get the surface glue off but you'd still need to seal the wall before painting or hanging new paper.

My husband was a drywall finisher for several years. He's really good at it and probably about as fast at it as a human can get but there simply is no way to speed up the process beyond a certain point. It takes multiple coats, with drying time in between, no matter who's doing it. Honestly, the only short cut is to do whatever you can to minimize the amount of sanding that's needed. To little mud applied smoothly is ALWAYS better than too much applied poorly. Doing another coat is just flat out faster, cleaner, and easier than sanding off blobs of excess mud.