Ecoteck pot needs help

[Bioburner]

After a complete cleaning of an Elena that I purchased used, the only thing needing attention is the bottom of the burn pot is getting brittle and cracking. See photos
1. I can attach a support plate to the bottom with matching but slightly larger holes to not restrict air flow.
2. What type of material should I try?

 

[Lake Girl]

Mine has done the same thing and it is not a maintenance issue as I clean mine once a day. I took it into the old distributor about 6 months ago and was told it shouldn't effect operation (along with the comment on how clean I keep it!)

Any idea on replacement value?

 

[Bioburner]

No idea. My email bounced back from the email link from Ecoteck to US distributer. Its more of a high heat issue and will continue to crumble and if I attach a plate now may get a season or two before having to TIG a new bottom on. Will have to check with a good friend that rebuilds scale steam locomotive boilers on what I should try and use.

 

[Pelleting In NJ]

Do you run your stove on max (Power=5) ?

 

[Lake Girl]

Do you run your stove on max (Power=5) ?

Usually 2, 3 is the highest setting I`ve used when it`s been really cold - more on 3 this year than last and generated a slightly longer crack. Never run on 5, don`t think I`ve ever tried 4.

From what is covered on warranty, the more vulnerable parts are excluded - Firex, gaskets, stainless steel basket, resistance (ignitor I think), paint, majolica ceramics.

Bioburner, not sure you can get those ceramics color changed ... would be taking a chance as they would have to be reglazed and refired. Starting to see small cracks in our glazing as it is - 2 years use. $1,100 for the Bordeaux colored ceramics when purchased.

 

[Bioburner]

I am the second owner. The previous owners tried to use as primary heat for a larger lake home so it probably seen some high fire. Last winter was not much of a winter though for us anyway. I will never need much of a fire as it's being installed in the kitchen dining area for shouldering and when things get real nasty cold and can not get heat upstairs fast enough as the harman with crosslink does most of the work. As I found out the last few days with extreme cold,-24 yesterday morning, a good bump and a low fire would have been the ticket to keeping very comfortable. Having got it stuck in the corner the color is very livable. Just would like to get ahead of any firing issues such as the pot not being 100 percent now while I can track down materials before my busy season starts and gets put on a back burner till fall. Putting in the hearth pad this afternoon and hope to slide the stove into the venting hole I just made. Should be firing tomorrow AM giving time for the silicone on the venting time to cure

 

[Lake Girl]

When removing grate and burn basket tonight for cleaning, noted that the grate was warmer and the bottom of the burn basket was fairly cold... Could the basket be cooling down too quickly, while in final cleaning mode due to the OAK, and causing the stainless to crack?

Just a thought... maybe I should stop thinking

 

[Bioburner]

Having watched the fire now for a period of time it's probably because of the igniter hole continuing to feed extra air with the pellets dropping on top creating the extra heat in that area. If they had the igniter on the end away from the feed drop probably would not have the problem or simply have made the pot heavier like the slatted floor surrounding the pot. Will try and make a plate to insert in the pot or tig in a layer of stainless in the burn hot spot.

 

[myers7457]

Is the burnpot stainless or cast? My stove guy says they are switching to cast. My burnpot is doing the same thing after 2 seasons

 

[Bioburner]

Stainless I am pretty sure. No way cast could standup or be bent with the thickness my current pot is. There is two problems their engineers screwed up. Probably someone fresh out of college. The ignitor placement and the thickness of the bottom of the pot. Its one thing for the pot to crack, but to be consumed. My old countrysides have stainless pots. Most of them crack but do not get consumed. Material is heavier and does not have the ignitor feeding extra air right on the bottom in one spot making it like a blacksmiths forge.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Those cracks are known as creep failure and are the result of heat caused expansion and contraction. All steel can be deformed in a wood fire, it is only a matter of getting the temperature in one spot a lot hotter than in a nearby area. The temperature will be the hottest is when the wood is actually in a burning charcoal (carbon) state and there is a constant blast of air (think a blacksmith's forge), the second hottest is where there is a constant flow of air and fuel. The fact that the burn pot is a pattern of holes and metal also leaves weak spots and places that can get hotter because the heat isn't draw away as fast as in other areas (usually this between the holes closest to the fire and air flow).

Each grade of steel has a different temperature where this starts to happen.

If you search on here for burn pot bubble you'll get a number of threads about the trials and tribulations of some Harmon boiler and furnace people in dealing with this on their units, one of the hearth.com members is a new burn pot lab rat.

 

[Lake Girl]

Stainless burn basket. The burn pot looks like steel plate. So the high heat is more destructive in this case. The coldness really surprised me - like grabbing a beer out of the fridge (couldn't resist!) I know rapid cooling is used to harden steel but wondered if it helped create the problem.

Would fabricating a new basket out of plate eliminate the problem or a different grade of stainless? We have scraps of steel left of varying thickness from other projects and my brother-in-law is a demon on welding (Hubby's good but his brother's better!) What design changes might be needed?

 

[Pelleting In NJ]

I run my Ecoteck on 4 most of the time, and sometimes on max (5) and do not have any cracks in my burn pot. I have about 1400 hours of run-time on my stove (check menu #6). How many hours of work are on your stoves? As far as fixing your burn pot, why not just buy a new one for $90? Sounds like it may need to be replaced every 3 or 4 years of stove use.

Also, I doubt the igniter hole placement has anything to do with the cracks on the bottom. The igniter is on the side of the pot, and it is only on for a small fraction of the running time of the stove.

 

[Lake Girl]

Run hours approximately 6,000 - primary heat, second year. Burn pot now has continuous crack but no material missing yet. Yes, could just buy another burn pot but the crack started before end of year one. If a better, more stable material can be found that will resist cracking that quickly, why wouldn't you switch to that instead of throwing $90 out the window yearly?

 

[Bioburner]

My stove is on the second short season. The running of the ignitor is not the problem but that the air is still continuing to come in from it and the fuel is dumped directly on the strong airflow like heaping coal into the middle of a forge. You can watch the flame deflection in the pot around the ignitor port. I don't have access to any metal testing equipment nor the acid to do a quick check for nickel. If its simple cold rolled steel I will simply replace the bottom with some heavier metel. Will take more time to drill the holes than weld together. I don't think any stove should have to have a simple vital part replaced that regularly. I have a 83 Whitfield that has all original parts. Going into the greenhouse this spring after this big storm allows me to put the top on.

 

[wil lanfear]

Run hours approximately 6,000 - primary heat, second year. Burn pot now has continuous crack but no material missing yet. Yes, could just buy another burn pot but the crack started before end of year one. If a better, more stable material can be found that will resist cracking that quickly, why wouldn't you switch to that instead of throwing $90 out the window yearly?

This is what I've tried to convey to Harman for the past 6 years with the burnpot issue in the pf100 and the pb105 but they seem not to get it. The link below is to a alloy, IMHO, that would resolve this issue.


High-Temperature Nickel (Alloy HX)

http://www.mcmaster.com/#nickel-sheet-metal/=lpw86d

 

[myers7457]

mine has 2359 hrs. I noticed it cracked start of this season

 

[Lake Girl]

Any idea what type of stainless Ecoteck uses for burn basket? Site above has stainless that is more temperature resistant. Forgot that my other brother-in-law has metal fabricating shop (second business - retired young but guess that didn't take). Hmmm....

Nickel better than stainless?

 

[wil lanfear]

Any idea what type of stainless Ecoteck uses for burn basket? Site above has stainless that is more temperature resistant. Forgot that my other brother-in-law has metal fabricating shop (second business - retired young but guess that didn't take). Hmmm....

Nickel better than stainless?

YES, here is another link.

http://www.sandmeyersteel.com/A600.html

 

[Bioburner]

Nickel is what makes steel strong not carbon. Maraging steel is more what we are looking for. Chromium is the primary component for making steel stainless. High heat can cook out the carbon leaving us with our problem. IMO. I was was wrong in the statement of the steel being stainless but made a incorrect grouping of higher nickel steels with chromium ones of both having antirust abilties. I must have 200 lbs plus of nickel-stainless welding rod and wire. Good for welding cast iron and use like brazing on metel that I don't want penetration.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

Maybe a good cast iron pot is called for, but that stuff also has its own related issues.

The burn pot in the Nu-Tec Upland is a five pound cast iron one and that is where the stove makes and burns the charcoal formed from pellets.

 

[Bioburner]

I was hoping to not have to reinvent the wheel when I started this thread. Seems the italian stoves have a common problem of being a bit cheap or poorly developed pots. I don't think it is a very big one. Easily fixed I think.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

I was hoping to not have to reinvent the wheel when I started this thread. Seems the italian stoves have a common problem of being a bit cheap or poorly developed pots. I don't think it is a very big one. Easily fixed I think.

It isn't just Italian stoves that have the problem there have been a lot of burn pot cracks discussed. Have a chat with those steam engine folks.

 

[Bioburner]

It isn't just Italian stoves that have the problem there have been a lot of burn pot cracks discussed. Have a chat with those steam engine folks.

With ten plus inches of snow on the way I will be happy to just keep the fires lit and the our butts warm.

 

[SmokeyTheBear]

With ten plus inches of snow on the way I will be happy to just keep the fires lit and the our butts warm.

When I can't go somewhere I use the phone or email.