Feeling Defeated.....

[Old School]

I know I am fixing to get inundated with all the things I am doing wrong but I have tried everything and will be unhooking my 52 Bay today.

I have posted on Mellows thread about my experience with the 52 previously and I realize my first year of burning I treated it like a smoke dragon, fed it green wood and caused the problems myself. Well 3 years later I am burning 2 year c/s/s keeping the cat above 1000 and using ACS spray on each load as well as a couple of CSL logs this season trying to remove the glaze I created on my liner. It was only a thin layer but it bothered me. The stove has been working well this season and I thought I had figured it out until I cleaned the liner today. It was 80% blocked in multiple places with hard creosote and the glaze that was there prior was thicker than ever that I can't remove. I feel like I have done everything right and still no luck. I worry if I keep on like this I will have a significant Chimney fire. It is a 32' 6" stainless flex liner with only a slight bend at the damper.

I will add that using less seasoned wood and way more burns in my old smoke dragon resulted in about a gallon of flaky creosote and I now have a shiny clean liner. I don't understand the old stoves are supposedly worse yet I am getting much better results with the old one. I will also add that I have been burning in stoves for 25+ years and never had the kind of issues I've had with the 52 before.

 

[webby3650]

I know I am fixing to get inundated with all the things I am doing wrong but I have tried everything and will be unhooking my 52 Bay today.

I have posted on Mellows thread about my experience with the 52 previously and I realize my first year of burning I treated it like a smoke dragon, fed it green wood and caused the problems myself. Well 3 years later I am burning 2 year c/s/s keeping the cat above 1000 and using ACS spray on each load as well as a couple of CSL logs this season trying to remove the glaze I created on my liner. It was only a thin layer but it bothered me. The stove has been working well this season and I thought I had figured it out until I cleaned the liner today. It was 80% blocked in multiple places with hard creosote and the glaze that was there prior was thicker than ever that I can't remove. I feel like I have done everything right and still no luck. I worry if I keep on like this I will have a significant Chimney fire. It is a 32' 6" stainless flex liner with only a slight bend at the damper.

I will add that using less seasoned wood and way more burns in my old smoke dragon resulted in about a gallon of flaky creosote and I now have a shiny clean liner. I don't understand the old stoves are supposedly worse yet I am getting much better results with the old one. I will also add that I have been burning in stoves for 25+ years and never had the kind of issues I've had with the 52 before.

Is your liner insulated?

 

[Old School]

Not fully. Stuffed with Roxul top and bottom. Inside a stone chimney with clay liner.

 

[jatoxico]

Well...sorry to hear of your trouble. Most of these problems are solvable if you hang in there. You make creosote when the temp of the flue gases get below about 250. It's not really any mystery, you just need to keep the flue gas temp high. The old stove must have been sending lots of high temp gas up and out. Is it possible you have a leak if the system?

 

[jatoxico]

Not fully. Stuffed with Roxul top and bottom. Inside a stone chimney with clay liner.

How is the stove connected to the chimney??

 

[Old School]

It connected to a liner that goes out and connects to a top plate. Full connect system. No air leaks.

 

[bholler]

Insulate the liner and probably replace the cat after sending all of those chemicals through it.

 

[bholler]

It connected to a liner that goes out and connects to a top plate. Full connect system. No air leaks.

Is there a tee or is it an insert? If there is a tee is the tee cap on it?

 

[Old School]

It's an insert.

 

[bholler]

It's an insert.

Ok well at this point i would call out a sweep to clean it and evaluate the issues. What stove is this?

 

[Old School]

An Appalachian 52 bay.

It is in a finished basement and it's basically a backup heater. I use my older insert on the main floor 24/7 and have only used the 52 when it's real cold. At this point I am not spending any more money on this stove and honestly running 2 stoves is more work than I anticipated when I set things up this way so I am going to sell this stove and reinstall the gas logs that used to be in the basement to be my backup. No more than I use them and with gas cheaper it's probably the better option at this point. Maybe in the future if gas sky rockets again I can insulate the liner and find an old fisher or the like to go down there.

Thanks for all the advice.

 

[bholler]

Maybe in the future if gas sky rockets again I can insulate the liner and find an old fisher or the like to go down there.

or you could figure out how to properly use your current insert. Have you had it looked at by a pro? was it installed by a pro? A fisher insert will not work well on a 6" liner

 

[Old School]

Yes it was installed by a pro the stove shop recommended

I am sure the problem is the liner is not staying hot enough but even if I pulled it and insulated it myself I'm looking at several hundred dollars and no guarantee that will fix the problem. I am burning dry wood. Keeping the cat in the active range I shouldn't have this kind of buildup.

 

[Old School]

Also I was thinking a free standing stove next time connected to a T. Like a Papa Bear or even if I get a new stove I think i will avoid a cat stove. My opinion is that it does not let enough heat up to keep the liner hot.

 

[Old School]

I don't mean to offend any cat stove users. It may just be my burning habits but my opinion is that the cat operation is my problem and not for me.

 

[bholler]

I don't mean to offend any cat stove users. It may just be my burning habits but my opinion is that the cat operation is my problem and not for me.

Ok so sell it and get a non cat don't take the massive step backwards to an old smoke dragon. Have you asked the installer for his input? How about the stove shop or an independent sweep? These are decent stoves and while an insulated liner should help you should be able to run it on a non insulated one.

 

[JA600L]

With a cat stove, I find it very important to burn hot at the beginning of the fire. It brings everything up to temperature including the liner before you shut it down for a long burn. It also brings the room up to to temperature so the stove can focus on maintaining the temp in the room verses trying to bring it up.

 

[Old School]

I have talked to both the shop and the installer the advice I got was open the air all the way and let it burn hot the entire time.

Here in the rural south I am not sure that the stove shop or the sweeps are all that expert. Most sweeps are carpenters or landscapers who sweep on the side.

I called a bigger company a few counties over and there advice is that cat stoves are old technology and never work well in our climate which I also do not think is the best advice.

That is why I utilize this site to get better opinions.

 

[JA600L]

Have you thoroughly cleaned the cat?

 

[begreen]

Also I was thinking a free standing stove next time connected to a T. Like a Papa Bear or even if I get a new stove I think i will avoid a cat stove. My opinion is that it does not let enough heat up to keep the liner hot.

A cat stove will have cooler flue gases. This is why an insulated liner is important. It should be mandatory, especially for cold exterior chimneys.

 

[Woody Stover]

using ACS spray on each load as well as a couple of CSL logs

may just be my burning habits

replace the cat after sending all of those chemicals through it.

I think bholler is right. You probably fried your cat with the chemicals. That would explain why you have such a bad creosote problem. The manual states to not burn anything but wood through the cat.

 

[jatoxico]

I think bholler is right. You probably fried your cat with the chemicals. That would explain why you have such a bad creosote problem. The manual states to not burn anything but wood through the cat.

The ACS spray is listed as cat safe, don't know about the logs.

 

[Old School]

I always left the bypass open when burning the logs. ACS is supposed to be safe.

 

[Old School]

Update

I called a buddy who is building a cabin and he said he wanted the stove so I disconnected the liner and pulled it out to find that the liner is about 4 ft too long and when installed the installers evidently connected the liner then put the stove in the fireplace causing the liner to make a an N shape about 3 ft up the chimney. I had noticed a tight spot when cleaning (I use the rope dropped down tied to brush and pull the brush down to clean) but never would have known it was that jacked up. Once I straightened out the liner and gave it a shake all this fell out and I was able to get the liner clean.

 

[JA600L]

Throw that stove back in there dude. Don't give up. Get the liner fixed and enjoy a properly installed wood stove.