First Power Outage w/52i = smoke

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Randy Fischer

Randy Fischer

Member
Dec 3, 2014
84
Purcellville Va
Greetings all, we had a 20 minute power outage a few days ago while the Harman was going full tilt. Flame went out immediately as you would expect. There really wasn't much smoke in the burn box. But after abou 2-3 minutes, a small amount of smoke started to come out of the side doors, especially the left side with the controls. Most of it was coming from the vents of the control board enclosure. No smoke at all from the hopper. This got me to wondering, if the OAK/burn pot/exhaust path is air tight (which I assume is true), where did the smoke come from?

I understand a UPS is recommended for this reason, but our installation makes this difficult as our stove is powered by a power outlet behind the stove insert so that there are no messy wires (the one request of the wife).
 
Obviously something isn't a airtight as you think. Even though I have an auto-start genny I tested a power out by unplugging the stove just in case. No smoke, good draft and it actually lazily burned out. You need to do some detective work.
 
I don't think we have much draft as the vent shoots out the back of the fireplace enclosure. You suppose a little smoke could make its way up through the auger assy and out the fines box cover? I have not had mine off yet, is there a gasket on it?
 
Randy Fischer said:
I don't think we have much draft as the vent shoots out the back of the fireplace enclosure. You suppose a little smoke could make its way up through the auger assy and out the fines box cover? I have not had mine off yet, is there a gasket on it?
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That's sealed pretty well. Doubtful. You could check it but I'd suspect either the vent or the OAK.
 
You will most likely have another outage. See if you can at least use a UPS or something similar, somewhere on that outlet or circuit..
 
What does it mean if smoke is pouring out the bottom of the stove if you have power loss? Not trying to hijack the thread but wondering, this has happened with mine.
 
Randy Fischer said:
never used a UPS, do you have to touch them often, or could I bury behind the insert?
Click to expand...
Google UPS for pellet stove. Better you get comprehensive information in one or two places than piecemeal here.

You also seem to need more vertical on your vent. Who did or advised you on the install?
 
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mystove said:
What does it mean if smoke is pouring out the bottom of the stove if you have power loss? Not trying to hijack the thread but wondering, this has happened with mine.
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Not enough information about the stove or the install to venture an opinion.
 
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A harman-approved ups, or much taller vent seems in order.

I didn't get an adequate power-off condition till i extended the vent from 5' to 10' verticle.
 
[quoala"Randy Fischer, post: 1872449, member: 39693"]Surrounded by windows![/quote]
You can't go up at all?
 
Randy Fischer said:
Local pellet stove contractor that dealer uses. Good guy, factory trained, I probley led him off course by telling him we did not want any exposed wires. Damn, just looking at UPS prices, Geesh....
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OK. You need a UPS that'll give you an hour or two at most. I assume you had them put the socket in during the installation. Maybe it's easily enough accessible that they can wire the UPS into that socket alone. Since you had a professional installation I'm assuming you aren't comfortable with a DIY so I'd recommend you go back to the dealer and explain what happened and what you need. As well, you'll have to run your igniter in MANUAL so your UPS doesn't try to restart the stove but shuts it down.
 
[quote As well, you'll have to run your igniter in MANUAL so your UPS doesn't try to restart the stove but shuts it down.[/quote]
Nope, pretty experienced DIY here, did all the electric and marble work as well as a new wood floor. I was just to busy and tired!

So if the UPS switches real fast, how does the stove know to shut down when in manual mode? Missing something here...
 
Hey Randy, sorry to hear this happened. From all my research I understood that unless you have a really good natural draft (the one you get from a real chimney), getting some smoke from your stove when the power fails is expected. In your case, having a direct vent, you just don't have enough draft to let it all go naturally. I don't think your installer is at fault on that.

That said, he is at fault of putting that power outlet behind the stove, not making it accessible and not educating you on the matter. Maybe you can call him and have him come over to address?

Here is the link to the Harman document on UPS:
(broken link removed to http://www.hearthnhome.com/downloads/communications/batteryBackupInstructionsHarman.pdf)

We have the SureFire 512H with a marine battery attached, all is plugged into a one outlet surge protector (the 512 does not provide surge protection) - this will cost you at least $400-$500 to do and you need an outlet and space next to the stove. I can get 8-12 hours on manual out of this setup with no power, just tested it a few weeks ago with a 3 hour power outage - the stove didn't loose a second. it was our light and heat for 3 hours and I didn't need to power any generators.

The easy and cheap fix is maybe to just get the APC BE750G UPS (connect it to you computer first to shutdown most of the annoying beeps they like to make when on) pull the stove out and put it behind it. This will give you both a graceful shutdown and surge protection. A good UPS battery can last 2-3 years easy, so it should not be too much of a pain even if its behind the stove... then maybe Alan can fix it more long term and move the plug. We put a nice basket next to the hearth, it has the battery, surefire, space for all my cleaning stuff and you don't really see the power cable much at all.
 
[So if the UPS switches real fast, how does the stove know to shut down when in manual mode? Missing something here...[/quote]

"When power is lost, a fully charged UPS will power a combustion blower only shut-down. Your
appliance will pulse the blower every few seconds to clear exhaust until the fire is out."

I.E - it can detect the loss of sine curve and pulses down on DC power.
 
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Randy Fischer said:
[quote As well, you'll have to run your igniter in MANUAL so your UPS doesn't try to restart the stove but shuts it down.
Click to expand...
Nope, pretty experienced DIY here, did all the electric and marble work as well as a new wood floor. I was just to busy and tired!

So if the UPS switches real fast, how does the stove know to shut down when in manual mode? Missing something here...
Click to expand...

Well OK then. Perhaps you can DIY the UPS then. Even a momentary blip is enough to reset the stove. Harman has an 800 number. I suggest you call them and get their recommendations on a UPS. I know you CAN put a UPS behind an insert but every install is different and I'd get a professional to scope it out first. We're you going next to the stove that'd be easy.
 
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