First year stove owner issues.....new direction or stay the course?

[Andrewj]

We spent about 2,400.00 total for stove and chimeny. I did the install myself after much research and planning - good call, saved 5-600 more dollars and learned a LOT. Total chimney cost fo Selkirk metalbestos double wall was around 1,000 bucks.

So we bouht a very small "room heater" stove - a Jotul F100 for around 1,400.00. It actuall does a minimally acceptable job of heatingthe room/area but I'd like more heat and overnight burns.

Torn between the relatively inexpensive Englander NC 30 from home depot, (6 hundred an change delivered?) and the stunningly expensive blaze king princess (around 3 grand).

I realize it is cat v. non cat. Can anyone provide other factors to consider, or has anyone been in my shoes? Thanks for any help.

 

[Grisu]

Can you give us some more info? Like, what size house you want to heat? Level of insulation? Outside temps in winter? Stove as supplemental or primary heat? Are you plan on running the stove 24/7? Do you need long burn times because no one will be home to feed the stove? What kind of wood do you have and how well seasoned is it?

 

[smokedragon]

I would go with a cat stove over a secondary stove (because of your climate). Secondary stoves burn clean and efficient when they are running 900+ in the firebox. Cat stoves run well at half of that.

You might also consider a hybrid (progress hybrid, ideal steel from woodstock/ Lopi freedom I think is also a hybrid).

Those stove can burn in secondary when you want lots of heat (20 degree nights for you and me) and cat burn when you want long burns and less heat.

The princess is a great stove. I drove 80 miles to see one, and if my house were smaller, it is actually what I would have purchased. If the KING ran a 6" liner, it would already be in my family room installed.

In SC climate, I would recommend a cat or hybrid stove. Plenty of folks burn secondary stoves in our climate, but you have to run a good hot fire (so you burn and get the house to 80, then let it burn out and cool back to 70).

7acres runs a Jotul F55 (one of the other stoves I was looking at) which is secondary burn. He is in SC, so maybe he will chime in. Not sure if he got it installed or not yet.

My $0.02

 

[Andrewj]

Can you give us some more info? Like, what size house you want to heat? Level of insulation? Outside temps in winter? Stove as supplemental or primary heat? Are you plan on running the stove 24/7? Do you need long burn times because no one will be home to feed the stove? What kind of wood do you have and how well seasoned is it?

Usablehousespace in winter is 1600 feet, upper and lower story mostly lower. Stove should be primary, and 24/7. It's south carolina, so we get some really cold temps in the 30s and 40s sometimes. haha.

 

[Jags]

so we get some really cold temps in the 30s and 40s sometimes.

- not funny.
The 30 is a serious heater - very possibly too serious for your application. The princess might be a better fit.

 

[Grisu]

Have to agree with Jags, given your mild climate and only 1600 sqft of heating space the NC-30 sounds like overkill. A catalytic stove may be a better choice for you as you will be able to control the heat output better. The Blazeking Princess or their 30 series would be good fit. A Woodstock Fireview may also work.
If you want to go for a non-cat look for a firebox size in the 2.3 cu ft range. Can be lower if your insulation is good if not a slightly larger firebox would be a good idea. If you are on a budget Englander is planning on coming out with a medium-size stove that is probably less than 1K. Here is a picture:
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads...6-4-7-on-the-mall.112056/page-12#post-1577545
Stoveguy2esw works for the company; you can send him a private message to inquire when it will be for sale. The Drolet 1800 would be another budget stove with a 2.4 cu ft firebox.

There are plenty of different medium-size stoves available. Do you have preference for either steel, cast-iron, soapstone? More traditional or modern look? Your budget?

 

[kennyp2339]

Andrew J, I'm seriously considering changing out my epa (secondary combustion stove) out for a cat stove due to the high temp cruise levels I'm experiencing, I'm located up in Northern NJ (much colder climate) and my stove (comparable to the NC30) bakes me out of the house when the temps are in the upper 20's and above, I figure the cat stove (BK Princess) would fit me better because of the fact that I can always take a low temp clean burn and turn the t-stat to a higher level to get a hotter clean burn, were as the epa stove you need a hot stove no matter what to get the clean re-burn secondary's going. Hope that helps you out.

 

[smokedragon]

+1 to Jags, with that square footage, you should go with a cat stove.

A stove like the NC30 needs to burn hot for a clean burn, I think it would run you out most nights (unless you cut it back and made it smolder, which is not efficient).

If your house was more like 2500 sqft in that climate, I would say go with a secondary burn stove that size. But if you try to heat that small space with that big stove, I think you will need to crack a window

 

[BrotherBart]

I think it would run you out most nights (unless you cut it back and made it smolder, which is not efficient).

I love how folks talk about soapstone stoves and masonry heaters but say a five hundred pound steel stove is too much stove. Put a half load in the 30 last night and ten hours later it was keeping the place warm and never got over 500 stove top when I went to bed. And the joint wasn't overheated on a 40 degree night.

Ya do not have to run'em like a blast furnace to burn clean. Getting kinda tired of typing that for years and years.

 

[Grisu]

I love how folks talk about soapstone stoves and masonry heaters but say a five hundred pound steel stove is too much stove. Put a half load in the 30 last night and ten hours later it was keeping the place warm and never got over 500 stove top when I went to bed. And the joint wasn't overheated on a 40 degree night.

Ya do not have to run'em like a blast furnace to burn clean. Getting kinda tired of typing that for years and years.

Sure you can do it but pretty much every day letting it go cold, then fire it up again? Not to mention that the flue also will get cold so you have more risk of creosote. It is not so much that a non-cat would not work but a 3 cu ft firebox is just oversized. The Super would probably work just fine at those temps even at 1600 sqft. Maybe the PE True North would be an inexpensive option that is more adequate than the NC-30.

 

[smokedragon]

Ya do not have to run'em like a blast furnace to burn clean. Getting kinda tired of typing that for years and years.

I agree, but you do have to run them hotter than a cat stove to burn clean.

I totally agree that it is fine to get a bigger stove than you need an burn small, hot fire in it.

I have read about people on here who burn for 4 hours before bed, and then relight in the morning.

That beats the heck out of running your small stove full-tilt and still not heating your house.

But in reality, most people don't burn like that, then they complain about the stove.......

 

[Seasoned Oak]

Torn between the relatively inexpensive Englander NC 30 from home depot, (6 hundred an change delivered?) and the stunningly expensive blaze king princess (around 3 grand).
.

Since you already have $2400 in, another $650 for a 30 would not break the bank. I run my 30 with half loads and pine in the shoulder season. You dont need a $3000 stove to do that. If money is no object, then by all means get the cadillac.

 

[kennyp2339]

all comments are very true, what I was referring to was when the fire box gets to its max lite off and everything starts burning, once you get that then the temps shoot way high (normal high for the stove) even when the damper is shut the secondary's pull air through, maybe get a little to warm for South Carolina standards.

 

[begreen]

I love how folks talk about soapstone stoves and masonry heaters but say a five hundred pound steel stove is too much stove. Put a half load in the 30 last night and ten hours later it was keeping the place warm and never got over 500 stove top when I went to bed. And the joint wasn't overheated on a 40 degree night.

Ya do not have to run'em like a blast furnace to burn clean. Getting kinda tired of typing that for years and years.

Agreed, it seems like some folks have never run a modern stove, especially a large one. All that mass actually helps buffer the temperature swings. This is particularly true if there is an extra 150 lbs of cast iron jacketing the stove. We heat regularly at 40F. There's a half load in the stove right now. And we live in a mild climate. Yes, a stove half this size will also heat the house well, down to about 20F. Have also done that too, but I'm very happy to have the reserves and have yet to overheat this place.

 

[Seasoned Oak]

My 30 with the air setting all the way down burns clean and stovetop is between 400-500. Perfect for milder weather.
If i want a 700+ stovetop for very cold weather thats possible as well. Cant ask anymore than that from a $600 stove.

 

[TradEddie]

Lopi freedom I think is also a hybrid

I wish! The only complaint I have about my Lopi freedom is that it's a struggle to burn cleanly at milder temperatures, although art of my problem is that I only have oak and hickory right now, no shoulder season wood.

TE

 

[Grisu]

If we are at pet peeves then mine is the insistence by some that an insert will absolutely require a blower to heat a place. Heat does not just disappear. It is either lost up the flue (which no blower can change) or through the back of the fireplace when it is at an exterior wall. Otherwise, it will just take longer for the insert to heat up the joint because the masonry will act as a huge thermal mass that you pay extra for when buying a soapstone stove. Thus, a blower in an insert is either for heating the house faster and to reduce the risk of overfires not because an insert does not heat without it.

 

[stovelark]

1400 For a Nordic?? That's list plus it sounds like- we sell them for $1099, anyway. Why not move up to a Castine F400?
That sounds like the appropriate stove too, more than enough for your climate, but not too much for warmer days and moderate temps. Agree with all that's been said, don't be against larger steel stoves, just run them more modestly. Steel stoves are easy to operate, dominate the stove world (almost 80% market) in the US, except New England, cast iron rules. I'm not a big fan of cat stoves, but BK is changing that paradigm, their stoves seem to perform very well, the one requirement is not many bends in the chimney. That Ashford 30 is a real beaut too. If on a budget, don't shy away from steel stoves, they are the easiest to afford. Good luck with your choice, whatever it may be.