FYI: Timer to turn on 25 pdvc stove

[thesource]

After reading all of the internet and not finding what I needed, I managed to figure it out. All I wanted was to have the stove turn on before I get home from work.
I built this:

Main timer circuit from Amazon: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00IP5LMJA/ref=sr_ph?ie=UTF8&qid=1421619710&sr=1&keywords=relay+timer

The hard part was wiring it up to the control panel (pu-cb04). From the right, it needs to be wired to the first and third pins under the ribbon cable. These pins are connected when the ON button is pressed.


This timer will "push the ON button" after a set amount of time. I wish there was a terminal for the one button; would've been so much easier.

 

[CladMaster]

Interesting !

You got any pictures of this all connected up, with details etc ?

 

[thesource]

I don't have a pic of the actual connection to those pins. Basically, I just wired them to a DC power plug: http://www.radioshack.com/size-n-coaxial-dc-power-plug-2-pack/2741573.html#.VLw-U0fF-VE.
That plugs into a DC power jack http://www.radioshack.com/size-n-co...-switch/2741583.html#start=33&q=dc+jack&sz=12 which connects to the Normally Open terminal on the relay.
Since this thing rated for 5V, I wired a USB cable to it and power it from one of those USB wall chargers. I threw in a tiny 15ohm resistor just because. Testing with 3 AA batteries was successful if you don't want to power this from the wall but I don't know if the timing was slower with less than the 5 volts.

The timer itself has 18 functions. I only need function 3. It activates the switch for T1 seconds (I'll set for a number of hours before I leave for work; 8 maybe), and then lets the switch go after T2 seconds (1 second). So it presses the ON button for one second and that's it. I can unplug it and plug it back in to restart the timer.

If you need more details on the connections, I can elaborate further.

 

[jintoreedwine]

This is a really neat project! When you were playing around trying to figure out what the on-button controlled did you happen to note if that same section of pins were also wired to the blower speed and heat range buttons?

I was interested in doing something similiar myself. I wanted to rig up something to a RaspberryPI I have laying around. I was hoping to do On/Off and control the heat range/blower speed settings with a webcam pointed on the control board so I could see the results.

I realize this probably sounds insane, and border line dangerous since the stove was not made to do this originally, but I still think it would be an interesting project. I write software for a living, so I am confident I could whip up that side of things, but until I saw your forum post I was much less confident that the hardware side was possible.

 

[thesource]

I probably should have mapped all the buttons but I was just too excited to figure out the ON button. It was really easy to figure out once I thought about it.

Disconnect the ribbon cable and connect two wires to two of the connection points in the cable.
The two wires can connect to an LED and a battery or a resistor and a voltmeter.
Press the button you want to map and you should see the LED turn on or the voltmeter register the resistance.
If not, move one of the wires to the next hole.

Here's a hint; There are 9 buttons and 10 pins. 1 pin must be common to all the buttons. I'm guessing it's the one on the end.

You have to think about how you're going to hook up all those wires to the pins. I'm embarrassed by my wiring job. I basically wrapped the wires tightly around the pins. If you're going to connect to so many pins, you might want to do it a different way. There should be some kind of adapter that lets you plug in the ribbon cable while jacking into the pins. I'm thinking of something like this http://www.aliexpress.com/w/wholesale-pcb-terminal/2.html.

I used a relay switch because it keeps the timer and the stove isolated. I didn't want to introduce anything into the system that shouldn't be there such as extra current. But since 1 pin is common, it makes me think a button just passes a "HIGH" to a single pin.

Let me know what you come up with.

 

[jintoreedwine]

Hmmm, ok, that is useful information. I probably won't get to work on this until this Spring or Summer, but I'll be sure to say something when I start playing with it. Given the nature of what I'll be trying to do, and the risk of messing up the control board, I kind of want to wait until I don't need the stove ... .

 

[pageyjim]

That's neat! I was looking at something like this. Now I don't know.

http://www.amazon.com/GE-15143-8-Ho...41&sr=8-2&keywords=ge+light+sensing+timer#Ask

 

[acammer]

Why use this setup over a programmable thermostat?

 

[mchasal]

I believe the PDVC stoves only have "hi-lo" mode, so the thermostat solution would only be able to idle the stove, not shut it off/turn it on. I don't know if that's the OP's reason, but it's the main difference between this and a normal thermostat setup with this stove.

 

[thesource]

Exactly. A thermostat won't turn on the stove, according to some things I've read.

 

[acammer]

That makes sense - I didn't realize that the PDVC did not have the same options as my PAH for thermostat usage.

 

[the cug]

That makes sense - I didn't realize that the PDVC did not have the same options as my PAH for thermostat usage.

couldn't u just use a heavy duty timer to turn it on at a certain time everyday?

 

[mchasal]

couldn't u just use a heavy duty timer to turn it on at a certain time everyday?

The stove will not start when you "plug it in". Someone (or something, mua haha) has to press the "On" button to initiate the startup.

 

[the cug]

right,even on a stat it would have to be turned on to stat. position. I was always trying to think of a way to have my stove turned on at camp (cottage) . it always goes back to asking the neighbor.

 

[jintoreedwine]

Assuming I can find the time to poke around and figure everything out my end goal is to extend the scope of the OP's original project be able to control the stove remotely. For starters I would settle for being able to control it from the sofa, but ultimately I'm shooting for being able to control it from anywhere I have Internet access.

Is this necessary? Of course not, I just enjoy tinkering .

 

[bill3rail]

Amazing that you went this far, Great to hear people redesigning OEM to make it better. Hopefully, the manufacturers listen to what we want!

Bill

You have to think about how you're going to hook up all those wires to the pins. I'm embarrassed by my wiring job. I basically wrapped the wires tightly around the pins. If you're going to connect to so many pins, you might want to do it a different way. There should be some kind of adapter that lets you plug in the ribbon cable while jacking into the pins.

I was thinking about a Ribbon Cable Extension.

Exactly. A thermostat won't turn on the stove, according to some things I've read.

I thought it would turn on, but not turn off with a T-Stat.

 

[mchasal]

Assuming I can find the time to poke around and figure everything out my end goal is to extend the scope of the OP's original project be able to control the stove remotely. For starters I would settle for being able to control it from the sofa, but ultimately I'm shooting for being able to control it from anywhere I have Internet access.

Is this necessary? Of course not, I just enjoy tinkering .

One interesting aspect of something like what you're going after is that you could do some smart things. Like make the stove operate in a modulating fashion based on outside temperature and even rate of indoor temp change. Could be a fun project. Keep us posted.

 

[Dr.Faustus]

I had always wanted to do this, never got around to thinking much about it and probably never will. My idea had always been some kind of actuator on a timer that would actually push the on button at a specified time. This however seems easier.

 

[jjlrrw]

I was planning to do this last fall then before I knew it spring was here. So now I am back at it.

I am planning to program a PIC micro to simply output a logc "1" for 1 second, then connect that to a transistor to turn on a relay. Looks like pin 1 and 3 is what I want???

I have this stove in our cabin 3 hours away, I have a timer I plan to set to turn on Friday AM that will apply power to my circuit that will fire the relay that will activate the "ON" button. It takes a good 12 hours to get the cabin up to temp so this will be the difference in arriving to a place in the 20's to a place in the 60's.

How did this work out for you?

Any updates on if it worked?

Thanks,
john

 

[thesource]

It worked every time. With my timer, I had to figure out when I'd be home and then calculate how many seconds until when I wanted the stove to turn on. Something smarter that was aware of the current time would be able to take an actual date/time to turn on.

You can get at least 12 hours on a single hopper? I don't think I could get more than 8. Make sure you're working with the same model. I'm sure they're all different.

I haven't looked at this thing in a year. From what I remember, the pin all the way on the right is common to all the buttons and the other 9 pins corresponds to each of the buttons on the panel. I only needed the ON button but If you have the need for the others or just want to play around, maybe wire up to all the pins to create a kind of expansion panel that can be exposed on the outside. I bought some pieces to think about trying something like that but I'm moving soon and won't have to hack a pellet stove anymore.

 

[jjlrrw]

Great, Thanks! I will make sure it's pins one and three before I wire it up. I think my stove is the same one it holds just a little less than a full bag of pellets. When set on 5 It will last 10 - 12 hours. If I turn it on about 10AM when we arrive about 8PM it may not be fully warm but we won't be going to bed still seeing our breath...

Should be able to test it out in a few weeks will report back then

 

[Cory S]

I think most pellet stoves should have this feature.... It wouldn't cost more than about $30.00 to add the circuitry.

 

[Dr.Faustus]

I thought about this for a long time. to get it to turn on either remotely or at a specified time. I never sat down to take a crack at it but in my head i had always pictured an actuator connected to a timer. when activated the actuator would cycle and push the button. This is clever tho. Didnt think of the pinout...

 

[jintoreedwine]

I think most pellet stoves should have this feature.... It wouldn't cost more than about $30.00 to add the circuitry.

I have thought about this myself and have come to the conclusion that, at least for stoves where you need to clean them before a relight, it would be considered too dangerous (by the manufacturer) a feature without the stove having a way of "knowing" you cleaned it first or at least some sort of button you'd have to press to let the stove know that it would be good to go for its next ignition cycle.

I am actually about to pull the plug on a digikey.com order I've been working on with some parts that I hope to use to add some of these features to my 25-PDV with a Raspberry PI. My plan is to have the PI control all of the button functions and then write some software (web application or Android app, haven't decided yet) that could be used to control the stove remotely. This would also open up the possibility of having the stove start at a set time and allowing me to, for example, have a flag to maintains whether the user has said the stove was cleaned or not so I could avoid firing the stove up on a timer if it wasn't marked as having been cleaned.

I don't know when I'll be done with this project as I only have my free time to work on it, but if there is any interest in the outcome I'll probably post my code and the list of parts. I fear this is somewhat of an ambitious project for just my free time, so we'll see how it goes... . I have a healthy respect for what _could_ go wrong with this project and I think a lot of my time will be spent trying to make sure what I rig up is actually safe.

 

[Dr.Faustus]

I have thought about this myself and have come to the conclusion that, at least for stoves where you need to clean them before a relight, it would be considered too dangerous (by the manufacturer) a feature without the stove having a way of "knowing" you cleaned it first or at least some sort of button you'd have to press to let the stove know that it would be good to go for its next ignition cycle.

I am actually about to pull the plug on a digikey.com order I've been working on with some parts that I hope to use to add some of these features to my 25-PDV with a Raspberry PI. My plan is to have the PI control all of the button functions and then write some software (web application or Android app, haven't decided yet) that could be used to control the stove remotely. This would also open up the possibility of having the stove start at a set time and allowing me to, for example, have a flag to maintains whether the user has said the stove was cleaned or not so I could avoid firing the stove up on a timer if it wasn't marked as having been cleaned.

I don't know when I'll be done with this project as I only have my free time to work on it, but if there is any interest in the outcome I'll probably post my code and the list of parts. I fear this is somewhat of an ambitious project for just my free time, so we'll see how it goes... . I have a healthy respect for what _could_ go wrong with this project and I think a lot of my time will be spent trying to make sure what I rig up is actually safe.

Yes, on these stoves, cleaning is important before a re-light but it does depend on how long its been on and how hard you've been running it. If it was on all night at 8, you wouldn't want to have this thing auto relight because there would be a big old clinker in there and it would dump pellets into the clinker/ash mess, the pellets wouldn't light and it would error out.
However if you just ran it for 3 hrs on setting 2 or 3, a relight would be ok without a cleaning because you would just have a bit of fluffy ash and the stove would get going anyway. What is really needed here I think its a burn pot stirrer. These reasons (and no time) are why I never took on this project seriously. I think i'll wait for my next stove and make sure it has a stirrer and the capability of start/stop from a stat. Something like that would be a stove worth adapting to be able to control from a cell phone app.