Go Tesla

[vinny11950]

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Texting and driving? No problem. The thing drives itself.

Conventional car companies are going to have a fight on their hands just to keep up with the new technology that integrates it all to your smart phone.

 

[begreen]

Out of my tax bracket. Bentley pictured is an ugly beast. Tesla in the picture looks like a stormtrooper's vehicle.

 

[BrotherBart]

I just want a new Dodge minivan. My go-go car days are way behind me. Start. Go to grocery store. Come home. Don't cost me six hundred dollars for changing the spark plugs.

 

[jatoxico]

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Texting and driving? No problem. The thing drives itself.

Conventional car companies are going to have a fight on their hands just to keep up with the new technology that integrates it all to your smart phone.

That was good.

 

[vinny11950]

What's exciting about the new Tesla cars is that they are pushing the car designs in ways outside the box, because they are outside the box. They are the classic outsider / upstart that does something radically differently that the traditional auto makers can't do because they are stuck in their old conglomerate model, which is impossible to move at times. Think of the Takata exploding airbags scandal; they have known for years their airbags could harm people yet they kept making them, and the auto makers kept using them, even though they knew what was happening, and they probably knew there would be a day of reckoning. I mean they have issued recalls on about 40 million cars worldwide! Holy cow, that's a lot of cars.

Here's a good article on why the dealerships are fighting Tesla on their sales model, and how the low maintenance of electric vehicles threatens the money-making-dealership-maintenance-cash-cow.

http://www.wired.com/2014/03/car-dealers-fear-teslas-plan-end-oil-changes-forever/

 

[Lake Girl]

While an interesting concept, what happens when cell service drops? There are crazy long gaps in cell service around my home and on the way to either Thunder Bay or Winnipeg. While humans drivers are bad enough, what happens when you have programs crafted by humans and electrical system malfunction or dropped cell service? The Spark has had two programming flaws ... Don't have to look any farther than this forum and the E2 stoves to see what happens when there are programming errors...

What?? No more planned pillage of car owners in the form of maintenance? I'm sure they will find a way

Can you tell I have control issues ... bad enough teaching my kids to drive

 

[vinny11950]

I am sorry to say the programming ship sailed long ago. I am sure there will be horror stories of cars malfunctioning because of code errors, but I am also pretty sure that those casualties will be small compared to all the lives saved by computers saving the cars from distracted drivers (texting, talking on the phone, and so on). Even at night sometimes, on certain patches of road, I can't see much in the distance because of road bend and headlights in the opposite direction blinding me or making it hard to see, but a few sensors and software would be a nice safety net to have.

I think control will be a major hurtle for people to get over, but once you get in the car and relax, I think the attitudes will change. It could be generational thing too. Kids now look at their smart phones all day, so they will be more trusting.

But what do I know, I still drive a 1996 Jeep Cherokee. Easy to fix myself and handles pretty damn good.

 

[jatoxico]

What's exciting about the new Tesla cars is that they are pushing the car designs in ways outside the box, because they are outside the box. They are the classic outsider / upstart that does something radically differently that the traditional auto makers can't do because they are stuck in their old conglomerate model

A currently airing auto business oriented show on PBS discussed Tesla from a Wall Street point of view. The opinion was Tesla's biggest hurdle is on the manufacturing side. It was said that Tesla could take advantage of some experienced contract manufacturing outfits that could have them up an running in as little as 6 months.

Tesla apparently is opting to develop their plants and processes themselves. If they did contract out the manufacturing of the 3 for instance Wall Street would probably reward them and they could make a great deal of money. But I would guess they want to remain independent of the old auto industry as much as they can and avoid becoming reliant on the traditional suppliers and manufacturing models.

 

[Lake Girl]

I can't believe you said the programming ship has sailed ... a little earlier you mention the air bag recalls. Mesh technological control, rush to market and corporate greed. It happens now so why should the future be any different?

Sensors may start out at top rate quality but manufacturers always find a way to cut corners or reduce costs. How much were the ignition switch costs for the GM vehicles? Pennies compared to the total cost of the vehicle... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_ignition_switch_recalls

 

[jatoxico]

But what do I know, I still drive a 1996 Jeep Cherokee. Easy to fix myself and handles pretty damn good.

I have a 98 that I bought to have as a third vehicle. They are pretty easy to work on which is good as it doesn't like to stay fixed for very long!

Just did ball joints, hubs and changed differential fluids. Its something of a hobby so not really the point but saved a bundle in labor on that job.

One tip is to buy and use use Fluid Film, cheap, non-toxic and environmentally friendly. Rust is the enemy of the Cherokee.

 

[vinny11950]

I can't believe you said the programming ship has sailed ... a little earlier you mention the air bag recalls. Mesh technological control, rush to market and corporate greed. It happens now so why should the future be any different?

Sensors may start out at top rate quality but manufacturers always find a way to cut corners or reduce costs. How much were the ignition switch costs for the GM vehicles? Pennies compared to the total cost of the vehicle... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_Motors_ignition_switch_recalls

Hey, I agree with your misgivings about where this is going, but I also can't see smarter cars/vehicles killing more people than people drivers. It is uncharted territory because not all software development will be the same, so some software will be good and others will be bad and prone to hacking, which raises more concerns.

What I meant with the ship has sailed comment is that all or most new vehicles already have software running critical functions on the vehicle, so it makes sense to upgrade new cars and keep pushing the process forward for more safety, better efficiency, and maybe better ride sharing.

 

[vinny11950]

One tip is to buy and use use Fluid Film

Good to know. I have been using LPS 3, but I will check out the Fluid Film. I also did the ball joints last year (and everything else in the front suspension), lots of fun.

 

[vinny11950]

It is not far fetched to imagine a near future where people adjust their lives and cities to have minimal car use, so that there is a shared fleet of smart electric cars waiting to be called on by users on their smart phones for general tasks around town. The vehicle arrives at your door and drives you to your location. For our generation it seems crazy to give up so much control of our schedules and the control of steering the car, but I think future generations will trust technology more and will view a car as a smart device that gets you from one point to another. They will not want to burden of owning and maintaining a car with all the upfront costs. Instead they will pay incremental fees as they need it.

 

[Knots]

The guy I commute with talked Tesla into loaning him a car. We commuted to work in it one day.

He rolls up onto I95, gets up to speed and then puts it on auto pilot. With his hands off the wheel and feet off the pedals it would negotiate the corners, slow for cars in front, and change lanes (if you put on the signal).

After I thought about sensor reliability or what happens if a bird hits one of the sensors, I asked him to put his hands back on the wheel.

Cruise control. That's about as far as I can go with this stuff yet...

 

[blades]

Sensors fail, computers fail, wiring harnesses that are anything but robust, also not sealed against intrusion at various plug points. Backing plates( mostly as a heat sink) of a dissimilar metal to that which they are mounted leading to corrosive failure. Oem replacement parts that are not correct or have significantly different operating parameters than the original as well as different pin assignments. The sad part is none of these are new problems. The latest twist which didn't get much play outside of automotive circles is MFG's considering their software of the computer as proprietary hence any modification other than their own is a criminal offense. I do not know how that court case finished out though.

 

[begreen]

Add that modern wiring insulation is often soy-based plastic which appeals to mice and rats. This is increasingly becoming an issue with modern cars and will be until some sort of bitter or deterring additive is added to these plastics.

 

[firefighterjake]

The guy I commute with talked Tesla into loaning him a car. We commuted to work in it one day.

He rolls up onto I95, gets up to speed and then puts it on auto pilot. With his hands off the wheel and feet off the pedals it would negotiate the corners, slow for cars in front, and change lanes (if you put on the signal).

After I thought about sensor reliability or what happens if a bird hits one of the sensors, I asked him to put his hands back on the wheel.

Cruise control. That's about as far as I can go with this stuff yet...

You're a better man than me . . . I don't even like cruise control.

 

[Swedishchef]

Meh. While I am happy to see Tesla build and push the car world to a whole new level, I won't buy one. I enjoy my 2005 IMpreza. No VDC, stability control, nothing. I hit the gas and it goes. I turn the wheel and it turns. When I drive, the phone is off and my attention is on the road. IN terms of cost...well, let's see long term reliability. A friend of mine just purchased a Dodge Powerwagon. The touch screen (which now controls everything) has a 3 year warranty and costs $6000 to replace. You had better hope that at 3 years and 1 day it doesn't short out.

Andrew

 

[begreen]

Unless you are in a self-driving car, touch screen controls are not safe, particularly when used for common functions like heater/defrost control. Sooner or later there is going to be a lawsuit where there were serious injuries due to someone taking their eyes off the road to adjust the controls via a touch screen.

 

[Lake Girl]

A friend of mine just purchased a Dodge Powerwagon. The touch screen (which now controls everything) has a 3 year warranty and costs $6000 to replace. You had better hope that at 3 years and 1 day it doesn't short out.

The 2013 Spark with MyLink (phone and radio) did make the 3 years but it was past the 60,000 km just barely. However, my Hubby had been having troubles with it dropping his cell for months before that. The dealer couldn't rectify issue when it was under 60,000km. Dealer didn't care when it all died, they wanted $500 for a new unit ... Not impressed.

 

[Swedishchef]

Unless you are in a self-driving car, touch screen controls are not safe, particularly when used for common functions like heater/defrost control. Sooner or later there is going to be a lawsuit where there were serious injuries due to someone taking their eyes off the road to adjust the controls via a touch screen.

We are banning cellphones from cars..yet we are building them with touch screens in order to control everything. And must navigate from one system to another (from the radio to the climate control, etc) in order to make the changes we want. Ugh. Counter productive in terms of driver attention. And trust me, at work we have a 2015 Chrysler 200S and 2015 Jeep Grand Cherokee; both vehicles have touch screens to control everything. Kind of reminds me of Flight of the Navigator (anyone remember that movie..).

A

 

[jatoxico]

Replacing ordinary controls with circuit boards and touch screens is not a good trend. Pointless over engineering in most instances.

 

[vinny11950]

Flight of the Navigator (anyone remember that movie..)

Great movie!

 

[begreen]

We are banning cellphones from cars..yet we are building them with touch screens in order to control everything. And must navigate from one system to another (from the radio to the climate control, etc) in order to make the changes we want. Ugh. Counter productive in terms of driver attention. And trust me, at work we have a 2015 Chrysler 200S and 2015 Jeep Grand Cherokee; both vehicles have touch screens to control everything. Kind of reminds me of Flight of the Navigator (anyone remember that movie..).

Push back at the manufacturers. Let them know you don't like this. I met a guy last week that went and bought back his 10 yr old Ford F250 because he didn't like the touch screen controls in his new Ford truck. First gen Chevy Volt owners told GM that they loved the car, but hated the capacitance touch center console because too many basic functions required taking ones eyes off the road. They listened and degeeked the new Volts with analog controls for most normal functions outside of the radio and GPS. Smart move and the press reviews are applauding it.

 

[maple1]

We are banning cellphones from cars..yet we are building them with touch screens in order to control everything. And must navigate from one system to another (from the radio to the climate control, etc) in order to make the changes we want. Ugh. Counter productive in terms of driver attention. And trust me, at work we have a 2015 Chrysler 200S and 2015 Jeep Grand Cherokee; both vehicles have touch screens to control everything. Kind of reminds me of Flight of the Navigator (anyone remember that movie..).

A

Techno gadgets - ruining everything from driving to relationships.

Kind of sad, really.