Got a used Pellet Stove, Some questions.

[mortimer]

Hello.

Found a pellet stove for $50 (delivered!) at a yard sale. It is a manual start that has some surface rust and other cosmetic issues. Not concerned about fixing these. For that price I expect to have to put some work and $$$ into it. The good news is that it works! Of course it does have some issues.

The issues that I would like to address are:
1) The company that built it is long gone. Any leads on a user manual would be helpful. The only information that I have on it is in the first and third attachments.
2) The exhaust fan is really loud. I would like to find a quieter motor. Right now it is Fasco Model D127, AO, type U63B1. The motor is newer than the rest of the stove. It is much louder than the circulating fan, a Fasco Model <not specified>, AO, type U63. Both are 'blower' style. Might just need to be oiled. Any references on 'where' to oil it?
3) The circulation fan seems to take forever to turn on.
4) There are three sensors that I am trying to find out more about.
a) A two pole labeled F140-20P on the exhaust fan housing.
b) A two pole labeled (stenciled in metal) L250-4 with a 'W' inside a crown like emblem on the fire box.
c) A three pole labeled L140-20F on the fire box. The third pole goes to the control box and doesn't seem to do anything. I suspect this sensor is causing issue #3.
5) The control panel has an on/off switch and two pots. I suspect that the fan pot used to be something else. Any idea what?
6) There is a fibrous batting that lines the fire box that could use replacement. Any sources?
7) The glass smokes up almost before you get the door closed. Is there a Scotchguard like application for this issue?

Also... Any recommendations on heat resistant tape and caulk?

I have a *lot* of pictures and can take more if you would like them.

Thanks in advance!

Edit: The third picture renders poorly. the flame is about 6- 8" high, orange, and dances.

 

[GVA]

Just a start here old old thread
https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/204/

Next..
replacement fasco motor
http://www.fasco.com/pdf/p13.pdf
They sound like stock motors all around
Either fasco or AO Smith
although the u63b1 won't come up in the catalog.

The sensors when you say 2 pole or 3 pole do you mean to say 2 , 3 wire?

 

[mortimer]

Thanks for the pointer!

 

[GVA]

Hello.

Found a pellet stove for $50 (delivered!) at a yard sale. It is a manual start that has some surface rust and other cosmetic issues. Not concerned about fixing these. For that price I expect to have to put some work and $$$ into it. The good news is that it works! Of course it does have some issues.

The issues that I would like to address are:
1) The company that built it is long gone. Any leads on a user manual would be helpful. The only information that I have on it is in the first and third attachments.
2) The exhaust fan is really loud. I would like to find a quieter motor. Right now it is Fasco Model D127, AO, type U63B1. The motor is newer than the rest of the stove. It is much louder than the circulating fan, a Fasco Model <not specified>, AO, type U63. Both are 'blower' style. Might just need to be oiled. Any references on 'where' to oil it?
3) The circulation fan seems to take forever to turn on.
This fan on most stoves will not come on till proof of fire is established (that is the stove reaches a certain temp)
4) There are three sensors that I am trying to find out more about.
a) A two pole labeled F140-20P on the exhaust fan housing.
b) A two pole labeled (stenciled in metal) L250-4 with a 'W' inside a crown like emblem on the fire box.
c) A three pole labeled L140-20F on the fire box. The third pole goes to the control box and doesn't seem to do anything. I suspect this sensor is causing issue #3.
5) The control panel has an on/off switch and two pots. I suspect that the fan pot used to be something else. Any idea what?
I suspect the pots are feed rate and circulation fan speed
6) There is a fibrous batting that lines the fire box that could use replacement. Any sources?
Does it look like rope gasketing?
7) The glass smokes up almost before you get the door closed. Is there a Scotchguard like application for this issue?

Also... Any recommendations on heat resistant tape and caulk?
Rutland High temp 500* silicone
I have a *lot* of pictures and can take more if you would like them.

Thanks in advance!

Edit: The third picture renders poorly. the flame is about 6- 8" high, orange, and dances.

 

[mortimer]

That's what I was thinking. May replace the sensors. Just because. I am going to replace the wiring. Looks like several people have had a go at it. One person didn't believe in mechanical connectors. Another switched the color coding all around.

No, it's not the rope. This looks more like soft tan fiberglass. It lines the back of the fire box.

Can you get the Rutland at the box stores?

Edit: Yes I did mean wires when I said pole. Oopsie.

 

[GVA]

I downloaded a st croix manual and it does look alot like an old st croix style even placement of the sensors on the back

IF ITS THE SAME
the one on the blower housing is called auger low limit 110*
the 2 wire on the firebox wall is the 250* high limit
the 3 wire on the firebox wall is a 3 way fan switch...described as below
During operation.... temp's of 170* or below, this allows the potentiometer to control the room blower.
temps over 170* the blower will automatically turn on to high speed.
Zeta has a st. croix prescott and could probably give you some more pointers if they are 1 in the same..
this is from the st croix service handbook located here..
(broken link removed to http://www.eventempinc.com/stcroix/downloads/analog/analog.html)

 

[GVA]

do you have a picture of the operator panel?
Yes rutland is available at the box stores but only this time of year in a couple of colors red black and clear..

 

[mortimer]

Some pictures, might take two posts.

The fan controller (first image) is marked Power Controls Group of San Antonio.

 

[mortimer]

Here is a pic of the label and the fuel feed control.

 

[mortimer]

Forums down?

 

[mortimer]

Went to Lowes today. Pellets for $179 a ton, 235 for red cedar. Know this isn't the place but it is a free bump.

 

[GVA]

Have you checked with St. Croix to see if they are the same line(, or design).
Have you downloaded the manuals on the link I put up to see if the inner workings look familiar?
Not much more I can come up with.

 

[mortimer]

Have you checked with St. Croix to see if they are the same line(, or design).
Have you downloaded the manuals on the link I put up to see if the inner workings look familiar?
Not much more I can come up with.

Haven't checked with St Croix yet. I did download the manuals. The manuals seem newer than the stove that I have. I then did a lot of research and fiddling and found:
1) The F140-20P sensor on the exhaust fan is used to automatically turn off the exhaust fan when temps permit (fire out). I believe that this one is working as:
a) The fan always runs when main switch is in the 'on' position whether there is a fire or not.
b) The fan shuts off when the main switch is in the 'auto' position and fire goes out.
2) The L250-4 sensor on the back of the fire box is a high limit switch. I haven't figured out a really good way of testing this although the stove shuts off if either of the wires is disconnected. Maybe this simulates the open on rise condition that the sensor is looking for.
3) The L140-20F sensor on the back of the fire box seems to be a fan controller. It seems to start the convection fan at some temperature. This one is my problem child:
a) It takes a really long time to close the circuit and start the convection fan. I was able to swap the wires and get the fan to be always on. A better long term solution is to replace the sensor. Maybe with a lower temp version.
b) One of the three poles was connected to the control box. The position of the fan speed control on the control box does not seem to matter. This makes sense as the fan motor is single speed.
4) The reason that the exhaust fan motor is so loud is that metal on metal contact is causing resonance. I am going to get some gasket material to use as a separator.

Do these make sense? Feel free to say so if you think I'm wrong.

Edit: I also plan to track down a smoke bomb to test the firebox. I know that it's negative pressure but I will be in the same room with it when I move it inside. It's outside on a concrete patio until it gets my seal (or otter) of approval.

 

[GVA]

Have you checked with St. Croix to see if they are the same line(, or design).
Have you downloaded the manuals on the link I put up to see if the inner workings look familiar?
Not much more I can come up with.

Haven't checked with St Croix yet. I did download the manuals. The manuals seem newer than the stove that I have. I then did a lot of research and fiddling and found:
1) The F140-20P sensor on the exhaust fan is used to automatically turn off the exhaust fan when temps permit (fire out). I believe that this one is working as:
a) The fan always runs when main switch is in the 'on' position whether there is a fire or not.
b) The fan shuts off when the main switch is in the 'auto' position and fire goes out.
(auger low limit?????)
2) The L250-4 sensor on the back of the fire box is a high limit switch. I haven't figured out a really good way of testing this although the stove shuts off if either of the wires is disconnected. Maybe this simulates the open on rise condition that the sensor is looking for.
Yep sounds like a high limit (snap switch) it's a saftey and almost all safties are designed to fail open that is they are normally closed allowing voltage through them till they hit a predetermined temp when they open breaking the circuit, kinda like unplugging a wire
3) The L140-20F sensor on the back of the fire box seems to be a fan controller. It seems to start the convection fan at some temperature. This one is my problem child:
a) It takes a really long time to close the circuit and start the convection fan. I was able to swap the wires and get the fan to be always on. A better long term solution is to replace the sensor. Maybe with a lower temp version
b) One of the three poles was connected to the control box. The position of the fan speed control on the control box does not seem to matter. This makes sense as the fan motor is single speed.If this is a shaded pole motor and it most likely is... The RPM is adjustable via the potentiometer



Where to start on the problem child?????
If I read the description of that correct it is merely a saftey for keeping the stove from overheating...
That is to say at 170* the fan will kick in to high speed to pull excess heat off the stove..
from proof of fire up to 170* the pot on the control board will control the blower speed.
If this part is not working perhaps the pot is bad :sick: Sorry the potentiometer is bad or has the wrong resistance or the wires are wrong (if it had been messed around with by a previous stove owner.....
It is possible too that the stove sees proof of fire but isn't telling the blower that it is running till this switch sees the 170* temp...
Maybe The quads are run in a similar way (experts......)
4) The reason that the exhaust fan motor is so loud is that metal on metal contact is causing resonance. I am going to get some gasket material to use as a separator.

Do these make sense? Feel free to say so if you think I'm wrong.

Edit: I also plan to track down a smoke bomb to test the firebox. I know that it's negative pressure but I will be in the same room with it when I move it inside. It's outside on a concrete patio until it gets my seal (or otter) of approval.

I will poke around on the above site and see if I can see a direct correlation between the proof of fire and the blower control but if there is a circuit board in the middle of it....... Then it may be bad news......
I'll be back later.......

 

[GVA]

Again if they are similar to the St. Croix

In the service manual page 32 wiring diagram
there is another snap switch 120* lower limit.... This should be proof of fire...
then it goes to the hi fan disc (170*) via a blue wire
from this point there are 2 red wires..
1st goes to the reostat
2nd goes to the room fan
That's it it the picture here in post #4 on the far right..

Check the troubleshooting flow charts on page 27

It may be the 120* switch that is bad..

 

[megw]

I have a manual for a Horizon Pellet stove, ours is an Eclipse HR-2 model. I can scan it and send it to you in the next few days if that is what you want.
We have a this stove in a home we just bought. Finally started it today, seems to run fine.

 

[mortimer]

pm sent

 

[NE Hunter]

Hi new here ... found it looking for the manual too. I just aquired an Horrizon Research Eclipse Destiny stove I would love a copy of the manual if you still have it.