Greenwood 100 VS Empyre 200

[SSweet9c1]

OK I'm looking to put in a wood boiler in my wood shed, to heat an approx. 3200'ft house that is old but has new windows and a fair amount of insulation (4"rigid foam in walls and R42 in cielings)

I grew up heating with wood in an old victorian farm house with a smokey OWB.
I'd like to go with a gassifier, but want to make sure I get the right one the first time... I have friends that say with theirs you have to split the wood really small, has to be perfectly dry etc... to get it to work correctly.
I tend to burn drier wood but want something that is less finicky...

So being me, I checked Craigslist first and near my there is a greenwood 100, that is 8 or 9 years old and hasn't been used in a couple years. The said there is 1 crack in the ceramic but otherwise it looks good. He bought it used and never got around to building the shop it was going to heat...

Then there is an Empyre pro 200 that is 2 years old still installed at the original owners place.. This is a little more pricey than the GW 100

In reading old threads on this site they both seem like pretty good boilers that can take decent size logs.. The Empyre guy said he easily gets 12 hour loads...

What do you folks recommend? I am leaning toward the empyre as it is newer and I can see it run... The GW has been sitting for about 2 years and isn't hooked up.. Though I like the idea of large mass ceramic... Also the owner said he is fine with me bringing a pressure gauge etc to check for cracks/leaks etc...

I intend to hook this in with my Buderus oil boiler as backup to cut out heating oil as much as possible.

What am I missing?
Thanks
Jonathan

 

[maple1]

Just based on what I have read on the net, I don't think I would get a Greenwood. Especially one that old with cracked ceramic. I don't think they are made anymore? Likely not supported either? Not sure on that part.

Also not sure I would get an Empyre. There have been reports on here about bad experiences with Empyres, but those were some of their gasifiers (Elites). Of the two, definitely Empyre, IMO.

Also not sure about checking for leaks with air pressure in either - I think both are unpressurized boilers? A little too much air pressure (and it might not take much) could do some damage. Could maybe be done but the little pressure that would be safe to try might not show up a problem spot.

 

[BoiledOver]

Hello Jonathan:

It is true that wood gasification boilers need more attention to the size and moisture content of the firewood used. It is true that wood gasification boilers perform to their optimum while burning flat out and dumping the btus to storage (a large volume of water is best). It is true that gasification units are far more efficient than the conventional OWBs. You will not hear of gasification units rated on how long a burn will last as is the case in the old style OWB. Another truth is, using drier wood in a conventional OWB will be more efficient than burning just downed trees.

Frankly, I would not suggest either of the units you are considering, neither would be considered the right one.

It would be wise to become educated to the wood gasification concept and the entire system that it requires to be efficient in heating your home. Transition from an old style OWB to a gasification system is costly up front. Until you are aware of what it takes to go gasification you cannot make an adequate decision for such a move.

Best of luck in your home heating needs.

 

[SSweet9c1]

OK, so what would you guys recommend?
I actually wanted to ask about pressurized Vs non? My current fuel oil boiler is around 20PSI I am not sure how you plumb a OWB into the system (I know a guy that would set it up for me, as the FOB needs new pumps and controls to be up to snuff, still has braided insulation etc from who knows when, and some of the controls etc are goofy and inop)
Thanks
Jonathan

 

[SSweet9c1]

What do you guys think of the idea of putting in one of these less expensive boilers for now, and in a year or two if we hate it, buy a new one? It isn't like the pex, wiring, and chimney are going to be that different... The main cost is getting it out to the shed...

 

[wolfe64]

I had a Greenwood 100 for 9 years. Once I figured out its quirks, it was ok. Pluses: Prefers large unsplit rounds, not too fussy regarding moisture content of wood. Minuses - Manufacturer in and out of bankruptcy, no support, better have a heat dump and uses quite a bit of wood. Currently in the process of replacing it with a Tarm Bonus gasser with storage.

The Greenwood is a pressurized system. 1 crack in the ceramic is likely not the end of the world. However, you will be buying an old unit with obsolete technology. I would recommend looking hard at gassers. Betteer to geet it right the first time.

 

[maple1]

A lot of these decisions are site and situation/preference specific.

For me, if I wanted to use a wood boiler & get it out of my house, I would put an indoor boiler (gasifier) in an outbuilding that was also big enough for my entire winters wood and maybe some extra space I could use as a shop or even man-cave. I would also incorporate storage - that could also be in the outbuilding with everything else, or it could be inside in the basement.

Don't know what you have for a wood shed now, but if I had one but it wasn't up to all that, I would either build a new bigger one or add on to the existing one. With concrete floor. And some insulation. Your fire wood & boiler will be very happy all winter if both are in cozy space out of the elements - extra bonus if you can use some heated shop/cave space in the winter time. (Stand by loss & heat off the unit while burning would likely keep it warm enough in there).

Haven't been in the classifieds here in a while but there have been good used boilers pass through there from time to time. If you can't find a gasifier, a solid non-gasser that has tubes for heat exchanging would be second choice & might get you through 'for now'.

On the pressurized thing - a non-pressurized boiler will need to use a heat exchanger between your oil/existing system & it. Usually a flat plate exchanger. Non-pressurized also has corrosion concerns - water should be tested annually & a treatment program followed.

The main thing with a boiler that is outside the house, no matter which way you go, is make sure the underground piping is good stuff done right. Which means closed cell foam insulation (either foamed in place or a Thermopex type product) - not any kind of wrapped stuff. Which likely means $10+ per foot.

 

[velvetfoot]

Plus, NYS has all sorts of rules now with regard to outdoor boilers. I'm not sure you could put an old outdoor boiler that wasn't on "the list" in a new installation, if officialdom became involved.

 

[SSweet9c1]

Shed is 24X22wX10h with gravel floor, was planning on pouring a slab once I knew what was going on it... Yeah we've factored in $12/foot for the good pex... Wood was cut last year or the year before for this winter (also have a large dutchwest stove in our living room and love it)

What is the recommended brand for heating a 3200 ish sq' house these days?

 

[hobbyheater]

http://www.garn.com/

 

[velvetfoot]

I was just looking at Craiglist and I saw this. Seems like a sad, but cautionary tale, as far as good old NY state goes.
(broken link removed to http://albany.craigslist.org/for/5690321521.html)

"For sale is brand new 3250 E-Classic Central Boiler, never been used. My loss your gain, I installed this on my property following local law, filed a permit and all. Unfortunately the DEC has more restriction than my local codes enforcement and requires a 100' setback from property line (not structures, property lines). This is the latest and greatest Central boiler has to offer and even has the ability to link to your phone. These boiler currently sell for 16,500 plus delivery without any extra. This boiler includes the thermostatic valve, 3 - 4' x 8" diameter triple wall chimney stacks, spark arrester, chimney stack ring support, rust inhibitor and two container of the ash reducer. Plus all the tools needed to help rack ash and clean out the fire box. It kills me that I can't keep this boiler, this is the best outdoor boiler on the market and one of the safest to operate. "