Having an issue

[sweedish]

Have a Kuma sequoia, and for some reason, I’m only getting secondaries when the bypass is open just a touch. The wood is dry. And the load/reload procedure is not rushed, everything is getting to proper temp, and the secondaries fire during loading, but once the bypass is pushed in, they die.
Chimney is about 25’ tall, and I did put in a dampener, and the cat is only just a year old.
Thoughts?

 

[Hogwildz]

That stove is a cat stove, no?There is no secondaries, there should be a glowing cat.

 

[MMH]

Okay just confirming wood is tested with moisture meter? And what do you mean exactly by secondaries? @Hogwildz, I have a cat stove and there may or may not be secondary flame and may or may not be a glowing cat (depending on mode and setup obviously). I’ve had neither before and the stove is cruising etc.

 

[Hogwildz]

Okay just confirming wood is tested with moisture meter? And what do you mean exactly by secondaries? @Hogwildz, I have a cat stove and there may or may not be secondary flame and may or may not be a glowing cat (depending on mode and setup obviously). I’ve had neither before and the stove is cruising etc.

I believe cats will have flame(s), but secondaries come from either a baffle or secondary burn tubes, which provides the secondaries. The cat replaces those in a cat stove, hence, the glowing cat. I think what you are referring to is actual flame from the wood supply, which would be from introducing more intake air.

He stated he gets secondaries from leaving the bypass open some, which I am pretty sure it not a good habit for the cat, and sounds more like the load itself is showing more flame.

 

[sweedish]

I meant

Have a Kuma sequoia, and for some reason, I’m only getting secondaries when the bypass is open just a touch. The wood is dry. And the load/reload procedure is not rushed, everything is getting to proper temp, and the secondaries fire during loading, but once the bypass is pushed in, they die.
Chimney is about 25’ tall, and I did put in a dampener, and the cat is only just a year old.
Thoughts?

Ghost flames I meant to say.

 

[MMH]

I believe cats will have flame(s), but secondaries come from either a baffle or secondary burn tubes, which provides the secondaries. The cat replaces those in a cat stove, hence, the glowing cat. I think what you are referring to is actual flame from the wood supply, which would be from introducing more intake air.

He stated he gets secondaries from leaving the bypass open some, which I am pretty sure it not a good habit for the cat, and sounds more like the load itself is showing more flame.

Secondary combustion is secondary combustion, which occurs regardless of set up (tube, cat etc). I’m running a BK, which is what my previous comment is about. Agreed OP description doesn’t make sense of when secondary combustion is occurring etc.

 

[sweedish]

I’m getting no glowing cat, or ghost flames that one get from a cat stove, I do when the bypass is open just a touch, even at high temp, like 750, you close the bypass all the way and they go away

 

[sweedish]

I ordered some catalytic gasket, my plan is to delve into this on Friday, it seems something may be amiss, my burn times seem overall normal.

 

[stoveliker]

Is your flue temp normal? If lower, then it's possible your cat is clogged.

 

[sweedish]

Insert, so no way to really measure that

 

[stoveliker]

Then i agree with "something is amiss". Check the cat, but also whether there may be stuff blocking the flow behind the cat.

If you do have a sooteater, I'd run that thru too. And see if you can check your cap (binoculars?).

To me this only makes sense if the flow thru the cat is hindered. Which may mean build-up someplace, so I'd check all places...

 

[Ashful]

You'll want to check that cat to confirm everyone's suspicion, but 25 feet of pipe is an awful lot for most cat stoves. It is likely you will find the air wash system, designed to keep your door glass clean, is kicking up ash with that much draw on the pipe. This would happen mostly when the stove is run on high during the initial warm up and bake-out phase of each burn cycle, before turning down. A few weeks / months of repeating this cycle can put enough ash into the combustor to cause the clogging that stoveliker describes.

If the cat is clogged, and if this happens frequently enough that a seasonal vacuuming of the combustor isn't the easiest solution, then it would be a good idea to get a draft measurement and compare it to the spec for your stove. I believe this is usually done with the stove heated and running on its highest setting, or at least that is how the manufacturer wrote the spec for my stove. It is usually accomplished by drilling a small (eg. 1/4") hole in the pipe above the stove and connecting a magnehelic or some other manometer.

If measuring draft is a bridge too far, and again if this is a frequent problem, then you can just find a way to reduce the draft and watch the results to determine if that was the problem. This is a tough row to hoe, in my opinion, because without some way to at least get some initial baseline reference for the draft and how it compares to your stove's spec, you're driving blind. I could drive my stove and key damper blind today, but that's only after building sufficient familiarity with the settings and response by having a gauge mounted on the pipe the last three years.

Draft on a stove is typically controlled by the addition of a key damper to the stove pipe. A pro like bholler, or perhaps one of several insert owners here, could give you some advice on how to achieve the same on an insert.

There are other advantages to correcting a too-high draft, in terms of burn time and overall predictability of the stove. So don't dismiss the solution, if your draft is confirmed to be too high, even if you think you can find another method to prevent the clogging.

 

[sweedish]

I swept the chimney last month, and I have installed a dampener. I think I need to check/pull the cat.

 

[weatherguy]

I swept the chimney last month, and I have installed a dampener. I think I need to check/pull the cat.

Might be a clogged cat, I have a hybrid and it clogs occasionally but it also goes from secondary flames to just black, as long as my temp is up it's ok. Not sure if your stove functions like mine, I have the Progress Hybrid.

 

[stoveliker]

That stove is a cat stove, no?There is no secondaries, there should be a glowing cat.

(Not to belabor something,) just as a visual example of what we (or at least I think we) are talking about regarding secondaries in a cat stove.

Apologies if this is superfluous.

 

[sweedish]

That pic is indeed what I mean, granted, sometimes how the wood is arranged or how the coals were when loaded I do not always see secondaries, by that I mean ghost flames.

I think I have the problem solved, my cat was plugged with ash, more so on the one side, which makes sense because I keep 2 bowls of water on the top of the stove, and every day the bowl on one side would evaporate faster.

So upon getting some cat gasket today I removed and vacuumed the cat, but even then that ash was still plugged, so further cleaning was needed, and it was plugged on the backside too, which I thought was odd, but when cleaning, some ash falls on the lip of the bypass, and maybe somehow found it’s way forward to the backside of the cat maybe.

I did think of bathing the cat in vinegar and water, but it’s already 8, and it’s not like it wasn’t working, it was just plugged. So I passed.

Before my high temps were 950, currently I’m at 1100, so I’d say it’s doing alright, was a slight downgrade in performance.

Moral of the story i suppose is check the cat after sweeping the chimney, and keep some gasket on hand so your more tempted to pull the cat.

 

[sweedish]

That pic is indeed what I mean, granted, sometimes how the wood is arranged or how the coals were when loaded I do not always see secondaries, by that I mean ghost flames.

I think I have the problem solved, my cat was plugged with ash, more so on the one side, which makes sense because I keep 2 bowls of water on the top of the stove, and every day the bowl on one side would evaporate faster.

So upon getting some cat gasket today I removed and vacuumed the cat, but even then that ash was still plugged, so further cleaning was needed, and it was plugged on the backside too, which I thought was odd, but when cleaning, some ash falls on the lip of the bypass, and maybe somehow found it’s way forward to the backside of the cat maybe.

I did think of bathing the cat in vinegar and water, but it’s already 8, and it’s not like it wasn’t working, it was just plugged. So I passed.

Before my high temps were 950, currently I’m at 1100, so I’d say it’s doing alright, was a slight downgrade in performance.

Moral of the story i suppose is check the cat after sweeping the chimney, and keep some gasket on hand so your more tempted to pull the cat.

Also Murphy’s law is your stove will get the hiccups in late January time frame.

 

[sweedish]

Also Murphy’s law is your stove will get the hiccups in late January time frame.

See? All better

 

[stoveliker]

That pic is indeed what I mean, granted,

Just to be sure, it was a video (to be more informative).

More importantly, glad you got the issue resolved!

Happy burning (again).