hearthstone heritage

[Overkill]

Well i thought my stove was running this last month perfectly, well until I got on the roof and saw my cap clogged full of creasote. Checked my my pipe 1/8th inch layer of shinny stuff and a 1/4inch layer of popcorn black crap over that. My flue temps rarely get over 400, even with small splits with door open for a hour or so. My spits are 2x2 on average when i'm trying to clean out the chimeny. Ok here is my setup, my chimeny is strait up and out, and 12 foot high, Which is 2ft higher than anything within 10'. A outside air kit installed. Wood is seasoned fir. I guess my question is how hot should I get the flue to burn the nastys out and what temp should the stove run at with primary open full. So far I am trying 36inches more pipe and it puts the chimney at 14' 9". hope tis does it can't think of anything else to do.

 

[Rob From Wisconsin]

I've found w/ Hearthstones, my "sweet zone" is between 350 - 450 degrees - STOVE TOP
TEMP (front center). I've also found out that they work better when burned for exented
periods of time, and not "one load & done for the evening". Look for the "firestorm" just
below the burn tubes, and set your air level to keep that going to some exent.
CAUTION: do not overfire (600+ degrees stovetop temp), or you run the risk of cracking
the soapstone (altough, I have yet to even get close to that temp on my unit).

Hope this helps some....

 

[edthedawg]

whoa whoa guys - something really wrong going on here. Overkill - it's your thread, so i'll focus on your (apparent) issues.

You're running with the door opened FOR AN HOUR??? holy crap man - talk about a stovekiller! :ahhh: Not only do you run the risk of SERIOUSLY overfiring the stove, and cracking many of its dainty bits, but you are introducing so much cold air - it's no WONDER there's all that creosote buildup!

EPA stoves gotta be run the way they're designed. You can't run it like a 20 yr old smoke dragon. Metering the air is of paramount concern. I'll run the door open for a minute or two - maybe 5 tops - but it gets shut pretty quickly. and that's only when cold. Most reloads, I never leave the door cracked. Coals are good enough for the doghouse torch to ignite whatever is set on top of them.

12 feet of chimney is too small - you are below the min of 13'. so if you can add a section or extension, you might get better natural draft - sounds like that is one of your problems.

I can't see your seasoning - maybe you've discussed it elsewhere on the site? it's just a fairly common thing to hear "I've got all this creosote, but i *know* the wood is seasoned!" - i thought the same thing too. it's dang near a ton more work and time to properly season wood, tho a softwood like fir oughta be a little easier. (I reckon Highbeam will be along at some point to discuss the finer points of softwood burning w/ an OAK and a short stack - more his cup of tea).

If you're having issues like "I can't keep a fire going once i shut the door", that points even more toward issues w/ the wood seasoning.

Where and how are you measuring those flue temps that "rarely get over 400"? Probe thermometer? surface-mounted rutland on the stack a couple feet up from the collar? Are you measuring stovetop temps at all?? How are you setting and adjusting the primary air control? How big are the routine fire splits? 2x2 sounds plenty small enough to overcome seasoning deficiencies, should there be any...

Please accept my heartfelt wishes to help you get this right. You have a great stove, which i truly believe in. and you're in the right place to get it running top notch You're gonna be blown away when you finally get 8 hour burns coupled with 500*F+ stovetop temps

 

[Highbeam]

Hi neighbor,

I also have a heritage, a 13-14' vertical stack, an outside air connection, and burn softwood (fir at the moment). I have a condar probe thermometer to measure the actual flue temps which run pretty hot on our softwood at 600-800 during normal burns. Flue temps at 400 mean the fire is a piece of smoldering crap. I also have a stovetop meter which is critical on these stone stoves since your stove will turn to dust if the temps exceed 600. That's a pretty low temp in the stove world and I run the stove top at 400-500 most times. I only run with the side door cracked open for a couple of minutes until the kindling catches on cold starts.

Your cap being clogged with creosote is normal if you have that silly spark screen still installed. Having that screen plugged will cause all sorts of burning problems and it will clog even if your wood is truly seasoned. First step is to clean that cap out and then try the burn again. The clear cap, the new 3 feet of stack, and current temps should provide plenty of draft for your stove to work.

Now we have to look at your wood. 2x2 pieces are plenty small if the wood is reasonably dry. Your normal wood will be 3-5 inches across and overnighters should be blocks up to about 5x5 so that you can fit four big blocks in the stove.

You asked a specific question about how hot to run the stove to burn the crap out. Well as I recall, your manual tells you to run the stove at full throttle for 30 minutes each day to burn the nasties out. I run the flue temp up to about 900 which is the overfire line on my probe meter within about 20 minutes of ignition of the new fire because 1000 is the max continuous limit for SS stove pipe. Then I damper down and settle in for the burn.

Maybe you should sweep the chimney out instead of trying to "burn" it out? For sure brush that cap out and add the 3 foot length. Then report back.

 

[Overkill]

All right, I run two temp gauges, one at 15 to 18 inches and one on center stone. My 2x2 splits are for mornigs after all night burn just to restart the fire on coals. As far as right now added pipe for a chimney highth of 14'9" and sweep the sucker out. My temps on the stove hover at around 400 415 with primary open and burnig all day. Pipe temp never go above 450 unless door is open or i dump kindleing in. My stove top temp has never hit above 500f and i really had to work at that. What i mean by that is I feed the thing 3x3 splits for about 3 hours. So say I woke up in morning raked coals and put some small peices of wood to get going at what point should I shut the door. I have been waiting for flue temps to hit 300 to 350 and then shut the door, and it still looks to smolder. The condor probe, does anyone carry that thermometer locally? Well one thing is left to try buy a cord of super dry wood, sound like i'm sitting on 12 cord of wet lumber. Well at least next year I will be good.

 

[Highbeam]

You never said but sort of suggested that your flue thermometer is a stick on magnetic meter instead of an actual probe meter. I bought the probe meter online. A surface temp of 450 on the outside of a single wall pipe is plenty hot and is on the edge of overfire. Do you have single wall pipe? If all of the above assumptions are true (magnetic flue meter, single wall pipe) then you are dumping your heat up the flue and that's why your stove isn't heating up. You need to cut the feed air back.

You've posted a thread or two before with this same problem and your advice was good. Get dry wood, or be for dang sure that yours is dry, and get it ripping along and close down the air control in stages. On my heritage I go to 50% after the wood load is fully engulfed or about 15 minutes. So long as you don't snuff the fire the fire will regain its rage and you can turn it down again.

When I want to run this stove up to the 550 line I turn down the air in stages until it is about a half inch from closed which provides plenty of air for combustion but doesn't blow all the heat out of the firebox.

Are you burning lumber?

 

[Overkill]

No lumber, sorry just a figure of speach, just split wood. I never thought of turning the air down in stages!? Yes my pipe is single wall and sound like a probe is good advice and will be followed. This is my first year burning wood and definitly a learning curve from pellet. My trees were dropped from my property this june and same week bucked and split. Most of the information that I have read says 20% moisture content is good for burning and that is were I am at. But I will order a cord of dry wood just to make 100% sure its dry. I just don't know were im going to put it! My yards starting to look like a firewood processing plant. Thanks for the info I will heed the dry wood suggestion.

 

[edthedawg]

I never thought of turning the air down in stages!?

ahhh - there it is, my friend you been running the primary at or near "wide open" trying to get it hot?

you shut the air down and you get remarkably higher stovetop temps and much more glass radiation. Prepare to be amazed.

fwiw - i forgot about the reload the other day, and was on the computer for 45-60 minutes before i remembered i'd left my flue damper and primary both sitting wide open. it was a full charge, and man was it cookin' down there. but only around 425 on the stovetop. pipe was plenty hot - about 560 wall temp, iirc.

i'm a firm maintainer that i almost just can't overfire this stove even if i try.

 

[Rob From Wisconsin]

I never thought of turning the air down in stages!?

ahhh - there it is, my friend you been running the primary at or near "wide open" trying to get it hot?

you shut the air down and you get remarkably higher stovetop temps and much more glass radiation. Prepare to be amazed.

fwiw - i forgot about the reload the other day, and was on the computer for 45-60 minutes before i remembered i'd left my flue damper and primary both sitting wide open. it was a full charge, and man was it cookin' down there. but only around 425 on the stovetop. pipe was plenty hot - about 560 wall temp, iirc.

i'm a firm maintainer that i almost just can't overfire this stove even if i try.

Same here with my Tribute......and others have made the same comment.
I remember once getting slightly over 500 degrees for stove top temp, and thought I
was going to take the chimney out in a "blaze of glory". It never stops to amaze me
when I hear that users are routinely getting theirs in the 600 deg. range.....and without
using gasoline. With good wood, my range seems to be about 350 deg. surface, with a
decent "firestorm" inside the stove.

 

[Highbeam]

I have to worry about overfire. I purposely run up past 500 and start to worry (shut the air off) when I get to 550 but things seem to always stop climbing at 550 which is just fine with me. The secret to getting my stove hot has been to run with 1/2" of primary air and to keep stuffing it with more wood as soon as the previous load has stopped the serious firestorm, really just skip the coaling stage.

It is very easy to overheat the flue and not even be up to 300 on these stone stoves.

 

[Overkill]

Wow Who would of thunk! It was like hitting a magic button, even flue temps went past 450; with magnet waiting for probe. The stove definetly likes smaller splits, anything that barley fits through the door is nightburn material. Highbeam what kind of luck have you had with maple, oak, madrona, or have you even bothered.

 

[Highbeam]

I burn the local woods. Red alder, doug fir, cottonwood, and red cedar. I've had the pleasure of burning some madrona but not enough to get a good feel for it. It was definitely harder to start and then it just burned and burned.

I have a 15 acre woodlot that is all natural regen so I'll be burning the normal softwoods for a long time. I have those 4 foot diameter maples that I'm not cutting down but if they fall I'll be burning it forever.

 

[AlexNY]

... saw my cap clogged full of creasote ...

The cause of the buildup is smoke. The Heritage just makes a lot of smoke. Sometimes, it gets hot enough that the smoke stops, but most of the time it belches smoke. I have the same problem.

The positive news is that regular cleaning of your flue is not really a hard task, it only takes a few minutes. For me, the real problem is the inconvenience to my neighbors. After many many years of heating my house with wood with zero or near zero smoke, I am mortified by all the smoke I am putting out now.

 

[Highbeam]

... saw my cap clogged full of creasote ...

The cause of the buildup is smoke. The Heritage just makes a lot of smoke. Sometimes, it gets hot enough that the smoke stops, but most of the time it belches smoke. I have the same problem.

The positive news is that regular cleaning of your flue is not really a hard task, it only takes a few minutes. For me, the real problem is the inconvenience to my neighbors. After many many years of heating my house with wood with zero or near zero smoke, I am mortified by all the smoke I am putting out now.

Boo. That's bogus. My flue is emitting nothing but clear waves of heat right now. Completely transparent. If your heritage is smoking then you have a problem, we can all try and fix that but odds are that your wood is too wet and cut too large for a modern epa stove.

Plugging up cap screens is a documented normal problem that even good burning stoves have. It just happens so most folks remove the screen.

 

[gyrfalcon]

Same here with my Tribute......and others have made the same comment.
I remember once getting slightly over 500 degrees for stove top temp, and thought I
was going to take the chimney out in a "blaze of glory". It never stops to amaze me
when I hear that users are routinely getting theirs in the 600 deg. range.....and without
using gasoline. With good wood, my range seems to be about 350 deg. surface, with a
decent "firestorm" inside the stove.

I'm one of those Tribute owners who's made that comment in the past, but no more. I now run it easily up to 500 and a little bit above. My problem was that I was turning the primary air down too soon and didn't have enough wood engaged in the box. First fire of the day, I've learned, I need to get a ripping good flame fire going, then keep throwing additional small splits on it as soon as there's room. Takes maybe 45 mins to an hour to get up around 450 or so, at which point I can put on some larger splits, and when they get good and charred, then turn the primary down to almost closed, and it stays at 500 until it's down to red coals. Rinse, repeat. The burn cycle is short on this small stove, so it takes much more frequent tending than larger ones. But it does happily cruise at the 450-500 range with good dry hardwoods, even in less than real cold outside air. I'm now at the point where I'm going to have to start being cautious about possible overfire when we get into real winter weather and the draft really starts ripping.

 

[creeker]

Great thread. My first season burning, and I have an older Phoenix. Same problems all around with getting a good burn going. Been keeping the damper wide open to get things blazing, and now, after throwing in another split and letting it go for a bit, am dampering down about half way. Hoping I'll get some heat instead of sending it all up the chimney.

 

[begreen]

... saw my cap clogged full of creasote ...

The cause of the buildup is smoke. The Heritage just makes a lot of smoke. Sometimes, it gets hot enough that the smoke stops, but most of the time it belches smoke. I have the same problem.

The positive news is that regular cleaning of your flue is not really a hard task, it only takes a few minutes. For me, the real problem is the inconvenience to my neighbors. After many many years of heating my house with wood with zero or near zero smoke, I am mortified by all the smoke I am putting out now.

Boo. That's bogus. My flue is emitting nothing but clear waves of heat right now. Completely transparent. If your heritage is smoking then you have a problem, we can all try and fix that but odds are that your wood is too wet and cut too large for a modern epa stove.

Plugging up cap screens is a documented normal problem that even good burning stoves have. It just happens so most folks remove the screen.

I agree with the first part, but not the second. Our screen has not plugged, ever. (Now that I've said that, I'm sure it'll plug this year just to make me eat crow. )

 

[gyrfalcon]

Great thread. My first season burning, and I have an older Phoenix. Same problems all around with getting a good burn going. Been keeping the damper wide open to get things blazing, and now, after throwing in another split and letting it go for a bit, am dampering down about half way. Hoping I'll get some heat instead of sending it all up the chimney.

Try sticking with lots of smaller splits for your first burn and more or less tossing them in rather than placing neatly. The air needs to be able to circulate around and feed the burning. The more surfaces you've got burning energetically, the more and faster the heat will go up. I don't use anything larger than about 3 inches for my first run.

There may be a better way of doing this I haven't figured out yet, but this is what has worked for me after having being stuck at about 400 max for about a year.

 

[Overkill]

Stove burning perfectly now, I was just to impacient with the primary, along with feeding too big of wood at first. Extra pipe helped too, Now at 14'9". My stove top on half primary runs at 415 to 500F Also with that setting I'm seeing nothing but heat signature at cap. Oh flue temp is about 400 to 450F. Hey, I know now how to get rid of unwanted house guest overnight, load stove and set at half primary and watch the fireworks. House was 79F at 2am. He. :lol: HE.

 

[04RevX]

Stove burning perfectly now, I was just to impacient with the primary, along with feeding too big of wood at first. Extra pipe helped too, Now at 14'9". My stove top on half primary runs at 415 to 500F Also with that setting I'm seeing nothing but heat signature at cap. Oh flue temp is about 400 to 450F. Hey, I know now how to get rid of unwanted house guest overnight, load stove and set at half primary and watch the fireworks. House was 79F at 2am. He. :lol: HE.

Sounds like you got it under control, nice work! Isn't walking into a warm house in the middle of the night a great feeling? I like my bedroom cool so the door is always shut, and stepping into a warm hallway is really enjoyable. Kind of pathetic huh???? Just another wood burning quirck.

 

[firefighterjake]

Hey Ed . . . you still around . . . you didn't burn down your house after I left did you?

By the way, thanks for the invite . . . and the visitation time with your Heritage and the wood piles . . . I'm still worried about you and that sheep though!