Help Needed To Cement Future Plans

[ambull01]

So my first thread here convinced me my current setup is a recipe for disaster. I'm going to take my time and do everything right (i.e. ensure clearances are met, SS liner, liner insulation, etc). In the mean time, I want to start working on efficiencies/improvements.

When I used the insert, it heated the room and most of the upstairs. Bedrooms are all upstairs with a staircase that goes up near the insert room. I would like the heat to somehow travel through a doorway across from the insert room and go down to the kitchen. Is there a good way to stop some heat from doing what it's supposed to do (rise)?

I'm planning on using floor or upper doorway fans to push cold air into the insert room, possibly putting in a grate of some sort in transoms, etc. Wish I could get rid of/not use this stupid insert fan but I guess it's a necessary evil. Anything I missed?

 

[claydogg84]

I've read people use fans to blow the cold air from the room that needs the heat into the stove room. I've personally never tried it but honestly it couldn't hurt. In your case It may be difficult as it sounds like you're asking the heat to travel down which is obviously not what it wants to do. Also, I think you'll be surprised at the difference the fan makes on the insert.

 

[velvetfoot]

I had the doorway fans, but I don't think they're that great. A lot of people do indeed swear by blowing a fan towards the stove, but making it go through a door and down (half a flight?) might be a tall order.

 

[ambull01]

I had the doorway fans, but I don't think they're that great. A lot of people do indeed swear by blowing a fan towards the stove, but making it go through a door and down (half a flight?) might be a tall order.

Oh no, stove is on first level. Bedrooms are upstairs, second level. The stove room opens directly into hallway where stairwell is located. Most of the heat flowed directly out of the stove room and upstairs. I guess it will always naturally want to do that since heat rises. Just trying to figure out a way to get the heat from the stove room past the hallway and stairwell into the other first floor rooms.

 

[velvetfoot]

I'd try that fan-in-the-hall-blowing-towards-the-stove trick. It's a cheap experiment, because you probably have a fan and can experiment.

I'm lying here on the couch right now with the wood insert to my left, and the only reason that I don't feel more cool air falling down the stairs on my right is that the pellet boiler is now heating the upstair.

 

[Sprinter]

It's hard to know your particular situation, but in general it's a challenge to warm adjacent rooms. I've experimented a lot with warming my adjacent bedrooms and found that I get the best result by having a fan on the floor at the bedroom door blowing out. What happens is that it blows the cooler air out the bottom and allows the warmer air above to flow in from the top. It's not perfect, but it does help. If you dangle a bit of tissue at the top of the door, you can see the warmer air flowing in.

 

[ambull01]

I'd try that fan-in-the-hall-blowing-towards-the-stove trick. It's a cheap experiment, because you probably have a fan and can experiment.

I'm lying here on the couch right now with the wood insert to my left, and the only reason that I don't feel more cool air falling down the stairs on my right is that the pellet boiler is now heating the upstair.

So by force feeding the stove more cold air that will speed up the flow of heat which will hopefully slip past the stairway and hopefully go to adjacent rooms? Is that the idea?

 

[ambull01]

It's hard to know your particular situation, but in general it's a challenge to warm adjacent rooms. I've experimented a lot with warming my adjacent bedrooms and found that I get the best result by having a fan on the floor at the bedroom door blowing out. What happens is that it blows the cooler air out the bottom and allows the warmer air above to flow in from the top. It's not perfect, but it does help. If you dangle a bit of tissue at the top of the door, you can see the warmer air flowing in.

I'll try the tissue test. Man I wish builders would think of this kind of stuff when they design homes. Would be so nice to have the freaking chimney in my family room. It's more centrally located. The heat would be able to make its way to the kitchen, office area, and go upstairs to the bedrooms.

 

[Sconnie Burner]

So by force feeding the stove more cold air that will speed up the flow of heat which will hopefully slip past the stairway and hopefully go to adjacent rooms? Is that the idea?

Yes, I would place the fan on the other side of the stairs closest to the rooms you want to get the heat and try that on various fan speed settings. Remember its going to take some time to do its thing. Another thing you can do is hang a valance length or an adjustable length curtain across the top portion of the entry to the stairs on a tension rod. This may slow the movement up to the second level and let some warm air go past that particular spot. You still want some to travel up so covering 1/4 to 1/3 of the opening at or near the top should help. You'll have to play with the length to find the best option. And it can be removed at night when you want the heat to go up there.

 

[TheRambler]

I'll try the tissue test. Man I wish builders would think of this kind of stuff when they design homes. Would be so nice to have the freaking chimney in my family room. It's more centrally located. The heat would be able to make its way to the kitchen, office area, and go upstairs to the bedrooms.

The simplist way to understand this is to think of it this way. Cold air is denser than warm air, and is therefor easier to move (in this case with a fan). Only so much air can physically occupy the space in any given room. By using a fan to pull the cold air out of say your kitchen and blow in the general direction of your stove room you are in effect displacing the cold air in the kitchen. Warmer air will naturally convect/flow into that space to occupy the space, and at the same time since the warm air is flowing from the stove room the cold air will be drawn into the stove room to occupy the space in the stove room. Then the cold air gets warmed and the process repeats, its a never ending cycle of air convecting around your house. It takes several hours at least to notice a difference in most cases.

Sometimes when you get a strong convective current flowing in your house, not only can you see it with the tissue test, but if you hold your hand up towards the ceiling you will feel warm air flowing, and if you crouch down close to the floor you will feel cold air flowing in the opposite direction. This is really pronounced on a stairwell. You will have to experiment with your fan speeds as others said. If you create too much turbulence you can interfere with the natural convective currents. The idea is you just want to give the cold air a helpful nudge to get it moving. Slow fan speeds work best in my experience and opinion.

 

[brenndatomu]

So by force feeding the stove more cold air that will speed up the flow of heat which will hopefully slip past the stairway and hopefully go to adjacent rooms? Is that the idea?

Without getting into a long explanation, think of it like this, you are pressurizing (very slightly) the stove area with the denser cool air which pushes out the warm air...

It takes several hours at least to notice a difference in most cases.

I see the temp rising on the hallway thermostat in 5 -10 minutes of starting the fan.
Well said, your last post.

 

[ambull01]

Yes, I would place the fan on the other side of the stairs closest to the rooms you want to get the heat and try that on various fan speed settings. Remember its going to take some time to do its thing. Another thing you can do is hang a valance length or an adjustable length curtain across the top portion of the entry to the stairs on a tension rod. This may slow the movement up to the second level and let some warm air go past that particular spot. You still want some to travel up so covering 1/4 to 1/3 of the opening at or near the top should help. You'll have to play with the length to find the best option. And it can be removed at night when you want the heat to go up there.

Sounds like a good idea, the short curtain along the top of stairway opening. I need to open the transoms up too.

 

[ambull01]

Thanks everyone for pointers everyone. I know you guys see this question over and over again.