Help with Install

[vikinginasia]

I am preparing to install a wood fireplace in a house I just build. However, the "chimney" that they made (via architect or contractor) is a rather narrow space (maybe 10x17 inches) currently lined with plywood and it extends through the second floor and out the roof.

Clearly the heat generated in the chimney is a serious concern that those who were supposed to know about didn't think about. So, is it possible? If I use a triple layered flue with spray insulation and vents in the second floor for heat to escape, is that enough? I could just go directly through the wall, but that defeats the purpose of having a chimney. Experts, please help.

Chris

 

[brad wilton]

the plywood is inside lining chimney? me thinks you might have a bit of a problem on your hands. I'll let the pros handle this one.i don't know if an insulated liner is good enough

 

[Jan Pijpelink]

Check the location. I have been in South Korea many times and they build houses differently than we used to.

 

[bholler]

do you have the fireplace and chimney picked out? If so look at the framing requirements if it is wrong make them redo it

 

[BrotherBart]

Could you upload a picture of this chimney viking?

 

[webby3650]

A fireplace in South Korea? Hmm?
That's is not enough space to get a fireplace flue through there.

 

[Plow Boy]

I was in south Korea for two years (suwon). I am not surprised a bit by your ordeal. Korean contractors build a new barracks while I was there and didn't run phone lines to none of the rooms. Had a communication room on each floor completely wired, with not one phone line going to any room. U must be in the mountains or in the country. There wasn't hardly any trees at all where I was at

 

[vikinginasia]

Yes, I am in the countryside. And although I am in Korea and the building requirements are different, the physics are the same. If that space gets too hot it could burn the whole house down. Due to the cold winters here wood, cast iron stoves and space heating is really common, but most people don't have a "western house" (bigish, 2 floors) so they just run the flue through the wall and call it a day. I'm not there now, but I have a picture somewhere I will try to find. There is nothing picked out and the plywood thing is just to create the chimney space: nothing of practical consideration. I doubt I have any leverage over them...

 

[bholler]

How could you expact them to build you a chase that would work for your fireplace if you did not give them the specs to do so? If it really is 10" you would not even have room to run a 6" class a chimney in there

 

[vikinginasia]

How could you expact them to build you a chase that would work for your fireplace if you did not give them the specs to do so? If it really is 10" you would not even have room to run a 6" class a chimney in there

This is the reason I hired an architect and a construction company: with the assumption that such people know about fireplaces and other building elements. They had no special requests so I assumed nothing was amiss. On paper it is hard for a non-expert to infer that this kind of thing would come up. In any case, most people here use flexible flue liners. The space is big enough for that, but not much clearance, which is what this is all about. What is possible, insulting options, etc...

 

[begreen]

The chimney space may work for a pellet stove if that is an option for you or for a gas stove, but not a wood fireplace. What wood fireplace brand and model are you trying to install?

 

[webby3650]

The flexible flue liner would be for a stone chimney, not a plywood chase. You will need double or possibly triple wall chimney pipe. The pipe itself will be 10" diameter for a fireplace at least, it will require 2" clearance all around it.

 

[vikinginasia]

The flexible flue liner would be for a stone chimney, not a plywood chase. You will need double or possibly triple wall chimney pipe. The pipe itself will be 10" diameter for a fireplace at least, it will require 2" clearance all around it.

OK, this is the kind of answer I am looking for... I dont want some sales person to talk smoothly, but not deliver on the safety side. It might be possible to rebuild the chimney since it is not made of stone to create more clearance around. As it is, I have looked into the double to triple ply pipe, but if memory serves it wont leave enough space around... hmmmm

 

[vikinginasia]

The chimney space may work for a pellet stove if that is an option for you or for a gas stove, but not a wood fireplace. What wood fireplace brand and model are you trying to install?

Nothing has been decided on model yet because it isnt even clear that anything will work because of the flue issue. I guess technically something with little exhaust requirements, such as gas, would be possible. However, I am really in the market for a heat source, not a decoration....

 

[begreen]

One option then might be a freestanding wood stove instead of a fireplace. A stove will most likely require a smaller chimney diameter. In the US, 6 inch chimney is common. This chimney pipe is 8 inches outside diameter. It requires 2 inch clearance or at least a 12" chimney chase (box surrounding the chimney pipe). A freestanding wood stove will provide better heat using less wood. There are many models that heat well and have a very good view of the fire through a glass door.

 

[bholler]

Nothing has been decided on model yet because it isnt even clear that anything will work because of the flue issue. I guess technically something with little exhaust requirements, such as gas, would be possible. However, I am really in the market for a heat source, not a decoration....

What ever you do you need to have the unit picked out before changing anything. LIke i said be fore you need to know the specs before you can build to meet them. once you have an idea of what you might want we can help you figure out some details from there

 

[vikinginasia]

One option then might be a freestanding wood stove instead of a fireplace. A stove will most likely require a smaller chimney diameter. In the US, 6 inch chimney is common. This chimney pipe is 8 inches outside diameter. It requires 2 inch clearance or at least a 12" chimney chase (box surrounding the chimney pipe). A freestanding wood stove will provide better heat using less wood. There are many models that heat well and have a very good view of the fire through a glass door.

Yes, I partially misspoke earlier... the freestanding wood stove is really the goal although the fireplace was the wish. Where I am because of tradition and history, fireboxes and usual fireplace setups are unusual and hard to find. To reply to the other person as well, this is why the dimensions were less important because if it were to fit exactly, then obviously every detail would count. Instead though, here most people buy imported cast iron stoves because they feel confident the product wont crack, they are reasonably safe, the heating output is good, and it is somewhat easy to install. This then comes down to managing the fumes and heat.

So, what you are saying is the flue is 6 inches in diameter and the chase is 12 X (10+?) to allow for 2 inches all around the piping? This might be feasible. I have the exact measurements now (attached). Unfortunately, the space wherein the flue is supposed to run is not well articulated. As you can see on the right image, the space length is established by the second floor and the width by the 23 or so cm from outside to inside wall. In reality the green square is what the space really looks like.

 

[Oldman47]

That 23 cm is only about 9 inches. It is short at least 3 inches of being big enough for a 6 inch nominal chimney pipe. Even a 12 inch square would require very careful spacing/supports to ensure proper clearance all the way from end to end. You need at least 31 cm in both directions to be able to work it and that assumes no combustibles anywhere inside that space. Beware, I have never seen a straight board that long but some are not too terrible so I would allow at least an additional cm in both directions for slight bowing of real world wood. If wood dries only on one side it bows toward that dry side so even an extra cm may not be enough for a chimney chase.

 

[vikinginasia]

That 23 cm is only about 9 inches. It is short at least 3 inches of being big enough for a 6 inch nominal chimney pipe. Even a 12 inch square would require very careful spacing/supports to ensure proper clearance all the way from end to end. You need at least 31 cm in both directions to be able to work it and that assumes no combustibles anywhere inside that space. Beware, I have never seen a straight board that long but some are not too terrible so I would allow at least an additional cm in both directions for slight bowing of real world wood. If wood dries only on one side it bows toward that dry side so even an extra cm may not be enough for a chimney chase.

that measurement is 23 inches... but the green box still shows the space isnt so big...

 

[vikinginasia]

that measurement is 23 inches... but the green box still shows the space isnt so big...

in other words, that is the outside wall measurement.. after drywall and insulation the space is further reduced...

 

[Oldman47]

If that is not the measurement I should use from your drawing I assume that you know what you really have.
The comment/concern stands. You need at least 12 inches between any combustibles in both directions and don't skimp on the space. Wood warps over time and can reduce a perfectly fine starting condition to a dangerous condition. In my case I have no chase for my chimney. The only place it comes close to any combustible is at the bottom where I built the chimney support box with a generous 2 inch clearance and at the top where it penetrates my roof. All other wood in the area is at least 4 inches away and the chimney passes through an open attic space so heat cannot build up near those other combustibles, my roof trusses.

 

[Plow Boy]

If that is not the measurement I should use from your drawing I assume that you know what you really have.
The comment/concern stands. You need at least 12 inches between any combustibles in both directions and don't skimp on the space. Wood warps over time and can reduce a perfectly fine starting condition to a dangerous condition. In my case I have no chase for my chimney. The only place it comes close to any combustible is at the bottom where I built the chimney support box with a generous 2 inch clearance and at the top where it penetrates my roof. All other wood in the area is at least 4 inches away and the chimney passes through an open attic space so heat cannot build up near those other combustibles, my roof trusses.

If you use double or triple wall it is 2" ,correct?

 

[Oldman47]

You don't use walls. That is a way to specify stove pipe, not chimney. Insulated chimney usually requires a 2 inch space to combustibles. Double wall stove pipe requires 6 inches to combustibles and is not appropriate to use anywhere it penetrates any barrier, like a ceiling or a wall. When you penetrate that first barrier you go from stove pipe to chimney pipe and you never go back.

 

[Plow Boy]

that is what i am talking about, I use ventis pipe and it says 2 inchs to combustibles. So couldn't he just put the chimney pipe in the chase?

 

[webby3650]

that is what i am talking about, I use ventis pipe and it says 2 inchs to combustibles. So couldn't he just put the chimney pipe in the chase?

I'm pretty sure that is what the plan is.The chase will need to be no smaller than 12" though.