HOW TO REALLY STREACH YOUR PELLET SUPPLY, f.y.i. YOU SHOULD READ THIS

[eernest4]

I noticed on overnight pellet stove burn, I was eating up 1/2 to 2/3 of a bag, depending on how long I sleeped & waking up to an 80 to 84 deg house.
Now, while I truely enjoy a warm house in the morning, not so much at the expense of 3/4 of a bag of pellets.

so, I looked into a wall thermostat for my pellet stove & the mfg told me that the thermo will cause the auto ignitor to prematurely fail on a yearly basis & at a cost of $90.oo +ship+handling+tax+installation fees.

This is because with the Tstat set for off/on opperation ,the ignitor goes through 10 to 16 off/on cycles a night vrs just once or twice per night on manuel opperation.

The normal life of the ignitor on manuel is 5 years or 1 year on Tstat opperation.




SO THE ANSWER IS TO ONLY KEEP 1/5 TH OF A BAG OF PELLETS IN THE HOPPER & run the pellet stove on manuel.




1/5 th of a bag will run my stove for 3 to 4 hours,depending on the feed rate I set & then the stove shuts itself off when it runs out of pellet fuel.

my house gets up to 84 degrees & then spends another 4 hours or longer cooling off to 70 deg

I wake up to a 70 deg house, slept warm all night & it only cost me 1/5 th bag of pellets
did not have to spend 180.oo for a wall Tstat or 90.oo+ for a new ignitor every year.

your pellet stove will differ from mine.
different feed rates and btu/hr
Your area to be heated
& your house's insulation
& the outside temp will all factor in.

You will either need fewer or more pellets in the hopper for a comfortable overnight.

With a little trial & error, you will get it down pat & save 25% or better off of your pellet useage.

Try this & save yourelf some $$$

 

[kast]

wouldn't HI/LOW mode stop the constant ignition need? granted you would still go threw more pellets using a tstat in HI/LOW then your idea

 

[imacman]

.....did not have to spend 180.oo for a wall Tstat .....

eernest4, that must be SOME wall Tstat to cost $180 :gulp:

I paid $24 for mine.

You might want to do some calculations on how many bags of pellets you'd save over the course of a heating season (say 100 days or more?), x 1/2 bag/night x the amount it cost to buy those bags....I bet it's more than the cost of the ignitor.

But what do I know...I'm just a Pellet Pig

 

[eernest4]

wouldn't HI/LOW mode stop the constant ignition need? granted you would still go threw more pellets using a tstat in HI/LOW then your idea

Hi/ low mode will stop the constant ignition & allow the 5 year life span of the ignitor but you are missing a couple of points:

1. You need to spend 190.oo +ship+handling+tax + install = $250.oo or more to have a Tstat to begin with . my way needs no expensive Tstat.

2. If I wake up to a 84 deg or 87 deg house with my pellet stove set to the lowest feed rate, what good could a Tstat do that cycles between the highest feed rate & the lowest feed rate , when the lowest feed rate is already too hot.

I realize that other stoves could have Tstats or ignitors that don't cost quite so much & that not all pellet stoves develop 50,ooo btu per hour like mine can and so could benifit from a hi/lo
cycling Tstat & that these 24,000 btu per hour stoves will use less pellets per hour but also give less heat.

So we have varing pellet feed rates, varing btu per hour output, varing areas to be heated, varing amounts of insulation in the homes, varing outside air leakage into the house & varing
outside temps.

each situation will be unique & require its own custom solution.

These are all factors that should be taken under consideration & any decisions will be yours.

I meerly wanted to show you a way to save some pellets & save some money.

 

[crausch]

I think that your idea is a good option. It also probably the safest way to have your stove shut off through the night.

 

[kyburnr]

I don't think I could do anything but sweat if my house was 84 Degrees ! And it would take me quite a few bags to get it that HOT to start with.

 

[sinnian]

You could also set your t-stat at such wide temperature differences it would not cycle on and off. Say you program it to go on at 8:00 for 80 degrees and off at 10:00 for 50 degrees, your t-state should never reach the 50 degrees and thus your stove/igniter would not cycle on/off/on/off, etc.

 

[imacman]

You could also set your t-stat at such wide temperature differences it would not cycle on and off. Say you program it to go on at 8:00 for 80 degrees and off at 10:00 for 50 degrees, your t-state should never reach the 50 degrees and thus your stove/igniter would not cycle on/off/on/off, etc.

Good idea.

 

[eernest4]

.....did not have to spend 180.oo for a wall Tstat .....

eernest4, that must be SOME wall Tstat to cost $180 :gulp:

I paid $24 for mine.

You might want to do some calculations on how many bags of pellets you'd save over the course of a heating season (say 100 days or more?), x 1/2 bag/night x the amount it cost to buy those bags....I bet it's more than the cost of the ignitor.

But what do I know...I'm just a Pellet Pig

You realize that I am the grand poobaa of the pellet pigs?? Please show at least a little respect for your "exhaulted leader"!

I realize that I can get a line voltage snap acting thermostat from ace hardware for $12.95

but on my stove, the Tstat is a custom wiring job into the stove's computer motherboard.

The 12.95 Tstat would void my warrantee which is still in effect & risk blowing the moterboard
if it is not compatable.
Maybe Dannon Group teck service is BS ing me about not putting in any Tstat but theirs.

It is certainly way overpriced but is the only way to get factory tstat installation instructions.

There are jumper cables that have to be set one way for off/on & another way for hi/lo opperation & i suspect that swithcing between oppertaional modes of the thermostat with a toggle switch that I could buy at radio shack & install myself is not allowable.

The transient pulses of the switch being thrown while the motherboard was energized might blow a computer chip in the motherboard.

At least,that is the conversation that i reciently had with teck service.

It could be BS , but I dont want to risk a motherboard to find out.

far cheaper & easier to meter out a known amount of pellets in the hopper for overnight burn & run out of fuel after four hours & shut down the stove.

When I was younger, we used to fly the rc airplanes with the babe o bee or cox .049 engines.
these had a metered fuel supply that took 3 minutes flight time to run empty for engine shut down. There was no way to shut off the engine until the fuel ran out in 3 minutes.

Later,they can out with the .40 &.60 engines that had rc controled carbs & we went from $50.oo
model rc planes to $500.oo rc planes with carburator engine shut down and 1 hour fuel tanks.
wing spans went from 2 ft to 6 ft radio control went from 2 channel to 6 channel, so that we had 2 extra channels to do odd & assorted tricks with.

So, now you know where the metered fuel supply idea came from.

 

[eernest4]

Ps. I suspect that the ignitor in my stove could be ordered direct from cromolox corp. if the would even sell to an end user, and probably for 30.oo to boot. But what part # to order, that is the question. I would probably have to make an unassisted choice & hope that I guessed right.

Maybe if I get disguested enough, I might say to bell with it & hook up the 12.95 ace hardware
tstat without any instructions & see what i end up with. but first i wait until the computer motherboard warantte expires.

After the warrantee, the factory might be more willing to talk to me since they will no longer be responsible for fixxing the motherboad should I meet with bad luck.

 

[imacman]

When I was younger, we used to fly the rc airplanes with the babe o bee or cox .049 engines.
these had a metered fuel supply that took 3 minutes flight time to run empty for engine shut down. There was no way to shut off the engine until the fuel ran out in 3 minutes.

Later,they can out with the .40 &.60 engines that had rc controled carbs & we went from $50.oo
model rc planes to $500.oo rc planes with carburator engine shut down and 1 hour fuel tanks.
wing spans went from 2 ft to 6 ft radio control went from 2 channel to 6 channel, so that we had 2 extra channels to do odd & assorted tricks with.

So, now you know where the metered fuel supply idea came from.

Well, you see eernest, we DO have some things in common....I flew RC for MANY years in my "youth"....still have some of the planes in the basement. .60 Ugly Stick & Futaba gear was my favorite. Had a .049 Graupner sailplane too. I long for those days and not having to think about the price of oil, gas, or pellets.

 

[gw2kpro]

You could also set your t-stat at such wide temperature differences it would not cycle on and off. Say you program it to go on at 8:00 for 80 degrees and off at 10:00 for 50 degrees, your t-state should never reach the 50 degrees and thus your stove/igniter would not cycle on/off/on/off, etc.

That is what I do. I leave my stove on hi/lo setting (not on/off)

My programmable t-stat switches to 50 degrees at 9:30 PM. This causes the stove to go into low mode (setting of 1), burning the least amount of pellets possible while maintaining the fire so it does not have to reignite. At 5:30 the programmable thermostat kicks up to 71 degrees, which causes the stove to kick into a higher setting. By 6:30 the house is almost to that temp.

 

[slls]

My stove is designed to run on thermostat, the electrical is warrantied for 2 years parts and labor. I would figure about 6000 starts in 2 years, wonder if it will last 2 years, will find out.

 

[kast]

My programmable t-stat switches to 50 degrees at 9:30 PM. This causes the stove to go into low mode (setting of 1), burning the least amount of pellets possible while maintaining the fire so it does not have to reignite. At 5:30 the programmable thermostat kicks up to 71 degrees, which causes the stove to kick into a higher setting. By 6:30 the house is almost to that temp.

What settings do have between 6:30AM and 9:30PM? you don't leave it cranking all day do you?

 

[gw2kpro]

My programmable t-stat switches to 50 degrees at 9:30 PM. This causes the stove to go into low mode (setting of 1), burning the least amount of pellets possible while maintaining the fire so it does not have to reignite. At 5:30 the programmable thermostat kicks up to 71 degrees, which causes the stove to kick into a higher setting. By 6:30 the house is almost to that temp.

What settings do have between 6:30AM and 9:30PM? you don't leave it cranking all day do you?

The wife and kids are at home, so, yes, it stays at 71. Once the room temp reaches 71 the t-stat stops calling for heat and the stove kicks back down to 1. As long as I keep pellets in it and keep it clean, they don't have to do a thing to it. Which is a huge reason I prefer pellets to a woodburner.

 

[hossthehermit]

My wall 'stat cost $10.74 at Lowe's, once the weather gets cold enough to switch from Smartstat mode to t-stat ( hi/pilot) mode, igniter won't be used.

 

[hossthehermit]

.....did not have to spend 180.oo for a wall Tstat .....

eernest4, that must be SOME wall Tstat to cost $180 :gulp:

I paid $24 for mine.

You might want to do some calculations on how many bags of pellets you'd save over the course of a heating season (say 100 days or more?), x 1/2 bag/night x the amount it cost to buy those bags....I bet it's more than the cost of the ignitor.

But what do I know...I'm just a Pellet Pig

You realize that I am the grand poobaa of the pellet pigs?? Please show at least a little respect for your "exhaulted leader"!

I realize that I can get a line voltage snap acting thermostat from ace hardware for $12.95

but on my stove, the Tstat is a custom wiring job into the stove's computer motherboard.

The 12.95 Tstat would void my warrantee which is still in effect & risk blowing the moterboard
if it is not compatable.
Maybe Dannon Group teck service is BS ing me about not putting in any Tstat but theirs.

It is certainly way overpriced but is the only way to get factory tstat installation instructions.

There are jumper cables that have to be set one way for off/on & another way for hi/lo opperation & i suspect that swithcing between oppertaional modes of the thermostat with a toggle switch that I could buy at radio shack & install myself is not allowable.

The transient pulses of the switch being thrown while the motherboard was energized might blow a computer chip in the motherboard.

At least,that is the conversation that i reciently had with teck service.

It could be BS , but I dont want to risk a motherboard to find out.

far cheaper & easier to meter out a known amount of pellets in the hopper for overnight burn & run out of fuel after four hours & shut down the stove.

When I was younger, we used to fly the rc airplanes with the babe o bee or cox .049 engines.
these had a metered fuel supply that took 3 minutes flight time to run empty for engine shut down. There was no way to shut off the engine until the fuel ran out in 3 minutes.

Later,they can out with the .40 &.60 engines that had rc controled carbs & we went from $50.oo
model rc planes to $500.oo rc planes with carburator engine shut down and 1 hour fuel tanks.
wing spans went from 2 ft to 6 ft radio control went from 2 channel to 6 channel, so that we had 2 extra channels to do odd & assorted tricks with.

So, now you know where the metered fuel supply idea came from.

uummmmmmm, eernest, your motherboard just called, asked me to remind you that it might be time to consider going back on your meds. Remember what happened last time. Just passing along the message.

 

[eernest4]

.....did not have to spend 180.oo for a wall Tstat .....

eernest4, that must be SOME wall Tstat to cost $180 :gulp:

I paid $24 for mine.

You might want to do some calculations on how many bags of pellets you'd save over the course of a heating season (say 100 days or more?), x 1/2 bag/night x the amount it cost to buy those bags....I bet it's more than the cost of the ignitor.

But what do I know...I'm just a Pellet Pig

You realize that I am the grand poobaa of the pellet pigs?? Please show at least a little respect for your "exhaulted leader"!

I realize that I can get a line voltage snap acting thermostat from ace hardware for $12.95

but on my stove, the Tstat is a custom wiring job into the stove's computer motherboard.

The 12.95 Tstat would void my warrantee which is still in effect & risk blowing the moterboard
if it is not compatable.
Maybe Dannon Group teck service is BS ing me about not putting in any Tstat but theirs.

It is certainly way overpriced but is the only way to get factory tstat installation instructions.

There are jumper cables that have to be set one way for off/on & another way for hi/lo opperation & i suspect that swithcing between oppertaional modes of the thermostat with a toggle switch that I could buy at radio shack & install myself is not allowable.

The transient pulses of the switch being thrown while the motherboard was energized might blow a computer chip in the motherboard.

At least,that is the conversation that i reciently had with teck service.

It could be BS , but I dont want to risk a motherboard to find out.

far cheaper & easier to meter out a known amount of pellets in the hopper for overnight burn & run out of fuel after four hours & shut down the stove.

When I was younger, we used to fly the rc airplanes with the babe o bee or cox .049 engines.
these had a metered fuel supply that took 3 minutes flight time to run empty for engine shut down. There was no way to shut off the engine until the fuel ran out in 3 minutes.

Later,they can out with the .40 &.60 engines that had rc controled carbs & we went from $50.oo
model rc planes to $500.oo rc planes with carburator engine shut down and 1 hour fuel tanks.
wing spans went from 2 ft to 6 ft radio control went from 2 channel to 6 channel, so that we had 2 extra channels to do odd & assorted tricks with.

So, now you know where the metered fuel supply idea came from.

uummmmmmm, eernest, your motherboard just called, asked me to remind you that it might be time to consider going back on your meds. Remember what happened last time. Just passing along the message.

Hey hoss,

Your village just called me.

They want their idiot back but i
didn't want to rat you out so I told them i didn't know where you were!
;-P , ,just kidding but,got chia!

 

[eernest4]

I am sure that a Tstat is just the thing for many people,but for others that dont want one for whatever reason, the metered fuel systrm does work well.

The only down side is restarting the stove with an empty auger screw.

That is a groan best dealt
with by throwing a handfull of pellets in the cup before starting the stove.

Of course,i forgot that the auger was empty & had a bit of fun trying to relight the stove the other day!

I had not had to deal with an empty auger since sometime in 2006, and we all seem to have short memories ,at least on some days.

 

[Xena]

You realize that I am the grand poobaa of the pellet pigs??
Please show at least a little respect for your "exhaulted leader"!

All hail our fearless leader! :coolsmile:

 

[Pelletluvr]

If your house is 80 to 84 degrees, your just wasting heat. Also, if a stove cycles 12 to 16 times a night, then it's short cycling big time.

I have a cheapo snap acting thermostat with the heat anticipator adjusted properly, and it cycles no more than 4 or 5 times a night.

Now, I realize some stoves are just not so easy to connect a thermoastat, and some have cheesy ignitors, so I can only speak from my experience. My Qudrafire 1200i is very thermostat friendly, and has a pretty stout ignitor. All I have to do is keep it full of pellets, set it and forget it.

BTW, I have tried various electronic and programmable thermostats, and I just can't seem to get one to not short cycle or cause major temperature swings. Nothing seems to work as good as the old stone age snap acting t stat with adjustable heat anticipator.

Just sayin

 

[mkmh]

You could also set your t-stat at such wide temperature differences it would not cycle on and off. Say you program it to go on at 8:00 for 80 degrees and off at 10:00 for 50 degrees, your t-state should never reach the 50 degrees and thus your stove/igniter would not cycle on/off/on/off, etc.

BINGO. This is exactly what i've been doing for 3 years. I have a programmable therm but really just use it for the on/off feature.
At 10 PM each night the program calls for 50 degrees. That causes it to cycle down then off in about an hour. Temp stays well above 50 through the night (so stove stays off) until 5 AM when it calls for 80 degrees. This keeps it running until the next time in the program, but generally I don't let the stove cycle on/off more than twice per day.
Once the temps are consistently below 32 degrees outside I typically just override the program and go to manual mode, leaving the stove on low overnight.

 

[eernest4]

If your house is 80 to 84 degrees, your just wasting heat. Also, if a stove cycles 12 to 16 times a night, then it's short cycling big time.

I have a cheapo snap acting thermostat with the heat anticipator adjusted properly, and it cycles no more than 4 or 5 times a night.

Now, I realize some stoves are just not so easy to connect a thermoastat, and some have cheesy ignitors, so I can only speak from my experience. My Qudrafire 1200i is very thermostat friendly, and has a pretty stout ignitor. All I have to do is keep it full of pellets, set it and forget it.

BTW, I have tried various electronic and programmable thermostats, and I just can't seem to get one to not short cycle or cause major temperature swings. Nothing seems to work as good as the old stone age snap acting t stat with adjustable heat anticipator.

Just sayin

Dear pelletluver

Thanks for your reply. That was not an actual situation that I was refering to but rather a senario put forth by pel-pro factory service as a reason not to install a Tstat on my pel-pro pellet stove.
For some reason, factory service was frowning & descouraging me from the Tstat installion.

I suspect because they had to install seveal or more ignitors for other customers under warantee and were trying to distance themselves from that obligation.

I may yet install a Tstat on my pel pro & if I do,it will be a $12.95 job from ace hardware & not the factory stat that they want $190.oo for & are very reluctant to sell , to boot.

If my motherboard ever kaputs on me, I will more than likely retro wire analog controls instead.

Then I could custom tune the burn to just what i want ,instead of factory presets.

But for now, you don't fix what ain't broke.

But, you did get me thinking,big time.

 

[eernest4]

:coolsmile:

You realize that I am the grand poobaa of the pellet pigs??
Please show at least a little respect for your "exhaulted leader"!

All hail our fearless leader! :coolsmile:

Hi zeta, How you doing today! Keeping warm, I hope! :coolsmile:
I'm just starting my 7th bag of pellets for the 2008/09 heating season.
running the wood stove right now as the pel/pro is past due for its every 3 bag clean out &
i never look forward to that messy job. 59 bags left to burn for the winter & 4 + cords, dry & seasoned & ready.

 

[ssupercoolss]

i run my stove off thermostat - pretty much for 3 out of the 4 yrs i have had it. my experience shows running my quadrafire sante fe 24/7 varying between high, med, low, burned more pellets than just running it on high with the thermostat controlling it. my stove most likely starts 10 times a day. same igniter it came with. i would say i burned 1/4 less running it on therm. ask any heating guy, he will tell you with any heating device, burn hot and fast. running your furnace on low(if there was such a thing) 24/7 you would consume lots more fuel, than letting it cycle.