Ok, moving to new post. Old post here: https://www.hearth.com/talk/threads/question-circ-in-closed-vs-open-system.138869
So I'm having some issues with my tekmar 356 injection. The pump is a UPS 15-58 (although right now I have it swapped with a 008 for comparison). It's a "minitube" type injection setup, the injection bridge is the underground piping between close tees off the GARN primary loop into close tees in the system loop in the building, 1.25" PEX, changing to 1" copper inside. I've got a ball valve that I've been using for balancing the injection flow although I think my next step is to put in a proper balancing valve (caleffi quicksetter). The system pump is an Alpha set on constant pressure mode.
I realize that doing injection from storage with variable tank temps (say, 190 down to 120) and variable system flows (9gpm with all zones wide open down to 2 gpm with most zones closed) and variable mix temps (~130 at design down to 80 in mild weather) is asking a lot of range out of the injection system, and I would expect some loss of temperature stability at the low end of these flows. But what seems to be happening is that the injection circ stalls--stops moving any water--when the controller ranges down to about 30%. Then the controller ranges up again, but the pump doesn't un-stall until about 50% output at which point it sends a slug of hot water and overshoots badly, then the controller ramps down, the pump stalls, it undershoots badly, and cycles on like this. I've watched it try to hit 110* and it'll swing down to 100* and up to 120* with the pump stalling and starting.
I can play with the balancing valve and get the pump working in the upper range on the tekmar (60-80%) for a given flow situation, say with all zones open and storage at 140*, but then in a different situation, say storage at 180*, and now the circ is back into this stalling and starting range. Or I can balance it for good operation with storage hot and some zones closed, and it will stabilize, but then it can't provide enough injection flow when storage is cooler/more zones are open. I'm just not getting enough range out of the 356.
I swapped a 008 in and it does the same thing, except I can actually hear a brief rubbing sound when the pump stalls/unstalls. With the 15-58 I can hear the tone of the pump change from a purer tone to a more PWM modulated sound with a wider frequency spread when it stalls.
Someone on another forum suggested that the tekmar injection control is designed to operate a short, small diameter tubing injection bridge, and it just won't work as I have it configured. He may be right in the end, but I've read about "minitube" injection systems and those are working with a long pipe run to the terminal manifold, so the length alone shouldn't be a factor right? When I calculated out the pipe resistances, I found that 200 feet of 1.25" PEX has an equivalent resistance to 10 feet of 1/2" copper or 53 feet of 3/4" copper. The 15-58 circ on speed 3 is more than capable of my worst-case injection flow. So with the proper balancing valve setting this should be well within range, methinks.
Am I just expecting more than this setup can deliver, or is there something wrong here? Hopefully you guys have some insight. Thanks in advance.
So I'm having some issues with my tekmar 356 injection. The pump is a UPS 15-58 (although right now I have it swapped with a 008 for comparison). It's a "minitube" type injection setup, the injection bridge is the underground piping between close tees off the GARN primary loop into close tees in the system loop in the building, 1.25" PEX, changing to 1" copper inside. I've got a ball valve that I've been using for balancing the injection flow although I think my next step is to put in a proper balancing valve (caleffi quicksetter). The system pump is an Alpha set on constant pressure mode.
I realize that doing injection from storage with variable tank temps (say, 190 down to 120) and variable system flows (9gpm with all zones wide open down to 2 gpm with most zones closed) and variable mix temps (~130 at design down to 80 in mild weather) is asking a lot of range out of the injection system, and I would expect some loss of temperature stability at the low end of these flows. But what seems to be happening is that the injection circ stalls--stops moving any water--when the controller ranges down to about 30%. Then the controller ranges up again, but the pump doesn't un-stall until about 50% output at which point it sends a slug of hot water and overshoots badly, then the controller ramps down, the pump stalls, it undershoots badly, and cycles on like this. I've watched it try to hit 110* and it'll swing down to 100* and up to 120* with the pump stalling and starting.
I can play with the balancing valve and get the pump working in the upper range on the tekmar (60-80%) for a given flow situation, say with all zones open and storage at 140*, but then in a different situation, say storage at 180*, and now the circ is back into this stalling and starting range. Or I can balance it for good operation with storage hot and some zones closed, and it will stabilize, but then it can't provide enough injection flow when storage is cooler/more zones are open. I'm just not getting enough range out of the 356.
I swapped a 008 in and it does the same thing, except I can actually hear a brief rubbing sound when the pump stalls/unstalls. With the 15-58 I can hear the tone of the pump change from a purer tone to a more PWM modulated sound with a wider frequency spread when it stalls.
Someone on another forum suggested that the tekmar injection control is designed to operate a short, small diameter tubing injection bridge, and it just won't work as I have it configured. He may be right in the end, but I've read about "minitube" injection systems and those are working with a long pipe run to the terminal manifold, so the length alone shouldn't be a factor right? When I calculated out the pipe resistances, I found that 200 feet of 1.25" PEX has an equivalent resistance to 10 feet of 1/2" copper or 53 feet of 3/4" copper. The 15-58 circ on speed 3 is more than capable of my worst-case injection flow. So with the proper balancing valve setting this should be well within range, methinks.
Am I just expecting more than this setup can deliver, or is there something wrong here? Hopefully you guys have some insight. Thanks in advance.