install pipe in chimney with gas appliances venting?

[benbirby]

Hi,

This is my first post but I have read MANY and appreciate everyone's knowledge and enthusiasm to share.

Here's my situation:
I recently bought a house and got a stove to install. The only time I have ever installed a stove, we went straight into the brick chimney and lined it all the way up. There was nothing in the chimney.
In my new house, if you look in the basement, you can see that the gas appliances (water heater and boiler for radiators) are vented into the chimney. The fireplace on the main floor is drywalled over and I haven't punched a hole to look into it yet...
At first my plan was to just avoid the chimney and run through the wall and up the side of the house, since there is a wall-mounted air conditioner in a strategic location (and hence already a hole through the house), but running the chimney outside seems like a pain and all-around less than ideal way to go for a number of reasons...

So now I'm back to what I was hoping would be a "don't ask, don't tell" chimney situation.
My question is, do I need to redirect the vents for the gas appliances somehow if I'm going to vent the stove through the chimney? If I put pipe going all the way up from the stove, would that obstruct the proper venting of the other appliances, or can they live harmoniously together?
I was imagining that these 3" appliance vents just tap into the chimney and the vent pipe doesn't run all the way up. Is that generally the case?

It will be a 6" flue, if that makes a difference...

Trying to figure out my best option here to keep the chimney internal.

 

[Tom Wallace]

I would think that your gas appliances are vented through an independent flue that does not connect to a fireplace. I have a similar setup in my house. My chimney has 3 separate flues. One for a fireplace on the main floor, one for the fireplace in the basement and one for the oil furnace exhaust. I've installed wood stove inserts in each of the fireplaces with a liner going from the stoves to the top of the chimney.

 

[blades]

Code is each solid fuel appliance needs its own flue. Running through an existing flue can sometimes cost more to properly renovate than installing a complete new assembly.

 

[benbirby]

I doubt there is more than one flue. The house was built long before gas appliances were even a consideration. I think that's why, when they installed the boiler, they just sealed off the fireplace (and the interior part of the brick chimney on the second floor) with drywall.

Does anyone know if gas appliances require the flue for venting? Could I somehow just vent those out the side of the house? It is masonry and brick in the basement, so it might not be so hard to just take those two 3" pipes out the side...

 

[begreen]

It depends. Modern direct vent or condensing furnaces can vent sideways, but not conventional gas appliances. You might be able to power vent the units, but that would require two power vents. How large is the interior of the clay tile in the chimney? Is there room for 2 - 6" liners?

 

[DAKSY]

You will need to read the owner's manual for your gas appliances to determine what the acceptable venting scenarios are.
Can you get up on the roof & look down the chimney? There just might be more than one flue in there...

 

[benbirby]

Here's the thing,
I haven't been able to look inside the chimney yet because the two gas vents are sealed with mortar in the basement, all access to chimney inside the house is sealed, and the chimney on the roof is EXTREMELY high up there... I can get a ladder on it at some point but need at least a 30' to get anywhere close...

I guess I just gotta bust into the drywall where the (presumed) fireplace is...

I'll let you know when I do.

 

[Grisu]

Here's the thing,
I haven't been able to look inside the chimney yet because the two gas vents are sealed with mortar in the basement, all access to chimney inside the house is sealed, and the chimney on the roof is EXTREMELY high up there... I can get a ladder on it at some point but need at least a 30' to get anywhere close...

I guess I just gotta bust into the drywall where the (presumed) fireplace is...

I'll let you know when I do.

If the pipes are not going all the way up you will get all the exhaust from the gas appliances into the house when you do that. Maybe time to call a professional chimney sweep to figure out the venting options and what you have in your chimney? http://www.csia.org/search

 

[begreen]

If you are going to have a pro install, why not call a few and ask for quotes.

 

[bholler]

Even if you are doing the install yourself it sounds like having a pro evaluate things and let you know what can be done is a good idea

 

[benbirby]

That's a good idea. I'm planning to do the install myself but if someone comes out to give me a quote then they'll probably have to get on a ladder and check out my chimney.

Better them than me...

 

[Hogwildz]

When you're ready to install... Look up member bluedogz, ask him where he rented the bucket lift that I was elected to go up in the drop the liner down the chimney.
Sure made it easier than without. Of course would have been easier had it actually reached, and I didn't have to lean out of the bucket, and finish with a step ladder on the roof leaning diagonally against the chimney. LOL

 

[DAKSY]

When you're ready to install... Look up member bluedogz, ask him where he rented the bucket lift that I was elected to go up in the drop the liner down the chimney.
Sure made it easier than without. Of course would have been easier had it actually reached, and I didn't have to lean out of the bucket, and finish with a step ladder on the roof leaning diagonally against the chimney. LOL

First time I installed one that way, the chimney moved a couple of inches when I got to the top of the ladder. A most "puckering" moment, let me tell ya...

 

[bholler]

First time I installed one that way, the chimney moved a couple of inches when I got to the top of the ladder. A most "puckering" moment, let me tell ya..

Yeah i hate that feeling i try relly hard ot to lean a ladder against the chimney but sometimes there is no option and it does not feel very good when that much masonry starts swaying.

I have a question tusk how are you planning on doing the install if you dont want to go up there to inspect it?

 

[Hogwildz]

First time I installed one that way, the chimney moved a couple of inches when I got to the top of the ladder. A most "puckering" moment, let me tell ya...

LMAO, yeap, pucker is a good word to describe that "am I going for a tumble" feeling.
Putting a step ladder on a pitched roof against a chimney on an outside wall, is like trying to put a round peg, through a square hole.

 

[benbirby]

Oh, I would climb the ladder if need be for install, I just wanted to check if I should rule it out as an option before I go up there.
I talked to a professional stove installer today on the phone and he said I pretty much have to go out through the wall. Not my first choice but I think he's probably right.

Also, my roof is a SUPER steep pitch so you're not gonna be climbing around on it at all.
My friend and old roommate works on roofs for a solar company and he laughed when he saw it.
Chimney is right at the tippy top.

 

[benbirby]

I don't mind a 30' ladder but I'm not jumping up to get on it for no reason...
I'd rather do my research!

 

[begreen]

Good time to let your fingers do the walking.

 

[Hogwildz]

Oh, I would climb the ladder if need be for install, I just wanted to check if I should rule it out as an option before I go up there.
I talked to a professional stove installer today on the phone and he said I pretty much have to go out through the wall. Not my first choice but I think he's probably right.

Also, my roof is a SUPER steep pitch so you're not gonna be climbing around on it at all.
My friend and old roommate works on roofs for a solar company and he laughed when he saw it.
Chimney is right at the tippy top.

Look up "Chicken Ladder". Been on then many times.

 

[benbirby]

Yes yes, I no doubt would have used a rig like that.
I think the chimney is pretty much out of the running now though.

I'm sure it'll need repointing at some point though............