Hello all. Greetings from Michigan. I just found this forum today, lots of great information. I am wondering if anybody has had problems getting homeowners insurance with a non U.L stove? I am looking into switching to Farm Bureau Insurance to save around $600 per year compared to several other quotes I have gotten, but the agent stated that I would have to get a U.L. listed stove within 60 days. I love my Fisher stove and don't want to replace it, and I have no other use for it other than in my home. It meets all NFPA Code 211 requirements. The stove has been in this home for at least 40 years and is still in great shape. Has anybody else ran into this issue with insurance companies? I have had 2 other insurance companies in the past, and it has never been an issue, and they both came out and inspected it.
Insurance Question for non U.L. Mama bear
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SpaceBus
Minister of Fire
I really don't heat my home too often with wood, I only burn 4 or 5 face cords per year, so I am not too concerned with efficiency, and I love look of the Fisher Stove. They are sending somebody out for a home inspection this week.
Todd67
Minister of Fire
Welcome to the forum! I have no experience with new stoves. My insurance company doesn't seem to have a problem with my Fisher Mama Bear, and I'm happy about that.
If you want to keep your Fisher stove, you might not be able to switch insurance companies. If it was my choice, I would find a company that would allow me to keep my Fisher. It has gotten us through countless power failures and some extreme northern NY winters.
I'm not here to give you any advice, and there are plenty of opinions from members on this forum, none are wrong or right. You're opinion is the only one that matters. Best of luck with whatever path you choose!
If you want to keep your Fisher stove, you might not be able to switch insurance companies. If it was my choice, I would find a company that would allow me to keep my Fisher. It has gotten us through countless power failures and some extreme northern NY winters.
I'm not here to give you any advice, and there are plenty of opinions from members on this forum, none are wrong or right. You're opinion is the only one that matters. Best of luck with whatever path you choose!
Todd67
Minister of Fire
My Fisher is my only heat source, and I live in a poorly insulated 2-story house. Needless to say, my family and I are real attached to our Fisher
SpaceBus
Minister of Fire
No doubt they work well. I can't say I'm too fond of the look, but there are still plenty of steel boxes on the market, now with windows for the fire. I'm a cast iron fan myself. Best of luck to you with the insurance. Some companies just won't cover something without a UL label, regardless of specs. We had an interesting time getting insurance for our house...
Yep, insurance companies are a joke.
In my case State Farm. Built my text book house to code myself. They didn't like an unlisted stove. Went to their office to show clearance, chimney, floor protection was to code. Wouldn't budge until they saw a UL tag.
We now buy homes when something nearby needs work. Renovate, doubling the value and rent them out. Mobile homes we have bought and replaced windows with new Andersen, that insurance co. wanted to know if all the materials we used were HUD approved. I explained I was in that business and factory inspections were IN factory only. Once in the field, set up and renovations have nothing to do with the factory HUD inspection. I dropped them for that reason. We now have 6 homes that are not insured by them.
Bought the property next door that was built by a couple using it only for vacation home. Nothing to code, rooms had to be crossed to turn on lights with no light switch at the doors, floor joist and ceiling rafters undersized, Typical homeowner built structure with no building code enforcement at the time. TWO unlisted stoves connected to the SAME chimney....... (masonry against structural framing with no clearance) Floor protection was an old ping pong table with tile on top !! (The green paint with white lines were on the bottom when I removed it) I asked my neighbor of 30 years if they ever came to look at it.......yes they did. Same local agent I had. I asked before cancelling if they needed to come look at it just to see what kind of answer I got. No, it's an existing policy, they don't need to inspect for the new owner.
If you really want that insurance co, search for a listed Mama Bear that will be a VII with UL tag. Many times you can find one cheap enough, and sell your old stove to off set the cost!
![[Hearth.com] Insurance Question for non U.L. Mama bear](https://www.hearth.com/talk/data/attachments/247/247777-a30fbb979f6853775fbd3e0e9b1eafbc.jpg?hash=LpjHvwQ5Ky "[Hearth.com] Insurance Question for non U.L. Mama bear")
The 5/8 plywood floor protector inured by All State when we bought it!
In my case State Farm. Built my text book house to code myself. They didn't like an unlisted stove. Went to their office to show clearance, chimney, floor protection was to code. Wouldn't budge until they saw a UL tag.
We now buy homes when something nearby needs work. Renovate, doubling the value and rent them out. Mobile homes we have bought and replaced windows with new Andersen, that insurance co. wanted to know if all the materials we used were HUD approved. I explained I was in that business and factory inspections were IN factory only. Once in the field, set up and renovations have nothing to do with the factory HUD inspection. I dropped them for that reason. We now have 6 homes that are not insured by them.
Bought the property next door that was built by a couple using it only for vacation home. Nothing to code, rooms had to be crossed to turn on lights with no light switch at the doors, floor joist and ceiling rafters undersized, Typical homeowner built structure with no building code enforcement at the time. TWO unlisted stoves connected to the SAME chimney....... (masonry against structural framing with no clearance) Floor protection was an old ping pong table with tile on top !! (The green paint with white lines were on the bottom when I removed it) I asked my neighbor of 30 years if they ever came to look at it.......yes they did. Same local agent I had. I asked before cancelling if they needed to come look at it just to see what kind of answer I got. No, it's an existing policy, they don't need to inspect for the new owner.
If you really want that insurance co, search for a listed Mama Bear that will be a VII with UL tag. Many times you can find one cheap enough, and sell your old stove to off set the cost!
The 5/8 plywood floor protector inured by All State when we bought it!Well, my new insurance company will not insure it since it does not have a U.L tag. So if anybody is looking for a nice Mama Bear stove with claw feet for cheap, please let me know, I have no use for it now. Also, I looked at a few Fisher stoves on ebay, I I cant believe what people are asking for just those claw feet! Does anybody actually pay that much for those??
Todd67
Minister of Fire
I don't think people are paying those prices for the bear feet. If a seller is asking a high price for a stove with the feet, I'd tell him to keep the feet and rip someone else off.
Yes, those prices are from past sales history.
Before 2014 they averaged $100 a set.
2015 averaged 120 - 139.
2016 averaged 219 - 249 with a spike Dec. 2016 269 - 300.
They have been 300 - 350 ever since.
The most common white metal angle sets should be cheaper than the straight older cast iron plated sets, but not always. Pay to play scenario.
No way should a corroded set that was sand blasted and painted go for the price of a pristine set !
Your feet would not fit correctly on a UL Listed Mama Bear, so the price you get for your stove and feet should more than pay for a good condition UL Listed Mama. The challenge is finding one near by without a trip to nearby states.
Todd67
Minister of Fire
I'm still trying to figure out HOW a UL tag makes a stove any safer than a pre-UL stove. I hope my 1970's Mama Bear never finds out that it doesn't have a UL tag 
. You never know how it might react.
. You never know how it might react.It's all about legality. Nothing moreI'm still trying to figure out HOW a UL tag makes a stove any safer than a pre-UL stove. I hope my 1970's Mama Bear never finds out that it doesn't have a UL tag
Or they could just get a modern stove and get more heat out of their wood.
Todd67
Minister of Fire
Are you a chimney sweep or a new stove salesman?
Just giving you a hard time. But have you ever heated your house with a Fisher type of stove with a proper baffle plate in it? That angled baffle plate makes a world of difference in several ways; less smoke out the chimney (sometimes NO smoke), more heat per load of wood in the firebox, less wood burned per month.
When my Fisher stove breaks down, or I start burning more wood than my neighbors, I might consider a new stove. But I don't like to fix what isn't broke. Many of my neighbors got so fed up with their new stoves, and coming home to a cold house after work, and waking up to a cold house, they stopped burning wood altogether.
Yes I have heated with a Fisher as designed and modified to work better. And there is no chance in hell I would ever consider going back. My Cawley Lemay quad regency and now blaze king all out performed that Fisher in absolutely every way but absolute peak btu output. Which is why the fisher is now in the unheated garage so I can heat it up fast.Are you a chimney sweep or a new stove salesman?
Just giving you a hard time. But have you ever heated your house with a Fisher type of stove with a proper baffle plate in it? That angled baffle plate makes a world of difference in several ways; less smoke out the chimney (sometimes NO smoke), more heat per load of wood in the firebox, less wood burned per month.
When my Fisher stove breaks down, or I start burning more wood than my neighbors, I might consider a new stove. But I don't like to fix what isn't broke. Many of my neighbors got so fed up with their new stoves, and coming home to a cold house after work, and waking up to a cold house, they stopped burning wood altogether.
Have you ever heated with a properly sized good modern stove?
One of the better financial decisions in my life was to tell F.B. Insurance to kiss my arse. I am very surprised to hear there quote is even remotely low
Todd67
Minister of Fire
I've lived a sheltered life as far as wood stoves are concerned... I've only heated with a Fisher. I have nothing against new stoves, because I have zero experience with them. I can't explain my passion for Fisher stoves, and I don't expect anyone else to understand my passion either. It is what it is, and I'll probably be heating with my Fisher for the next 30 years. That'll get me into my 80's
SpaceBus
Minister of Fire
Are you a chimney sweep or a new stove salesman?
Just giving you a hard time. But have you ever heated your house with a Fisher type of stove with a proper baffle plate in it? That angled baffle plate makes a world of difference in several ways; less smoke out the chimney (sometimes NO smoke), more heat per load of wood in the firebox, less wood burned per month.
When my Fisher stove breaks down, or I start burning more wood than my neighbors, I might consider a new stove. But I don't like to fix what isn't broke. Many of my neighbors got so fed up with their new stoves, and coming home to a cold house after work, and waking up to a cold house, they stopped burning wood altogether.
My stove only smokes just a bit when I have a cold start. In fact if there's any smoke after a few minutes I have an issue.
Todd67
Minister of Fire
SpaceBus
Minister of Fire
It's a Morso 2B Classic, it looks like a stove from the 1930's, but it's fully modern.
It doesn't make it safer, it proves the appliance was tested to standard testing specifications. Your older stove was tested to other testing criteria other than the universally accepted UL criteria used today.I'm still trying to figure out HOW a UL tag makes a stove any safer than a pre-UL stove. I hope my 1970's Mama Bear never finds out that it doesn't have a UL tag
At one time there were 4 testing standards across the US and areas of the country didn't accept the testing done in other states or areas. UL was the accepted standard testing that didn't include heating appliances until almost 1980.
The purpose is to prevent people from using their own fabricated stoves that possibly would not pass or ever be tested to UL testing specifications.
The ICC Mechanical Code added the UL Listing requirement for NEW installations.
Unfortunately it prevents use of many well known factory built stoves that would pass, as well as antiques.
That is what should be acceptable to insurance companies as well. They don't have people in the field capable of knowing what is safely built and what isn't, so it's easier to simply look for the UL tag. That doesn't prove the stove was modified or possibly not installed AS TESTED.
Todd67
Minister of Fire
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