Intro and EF-3 woes

[ChuckD]

Hi all,

First time poster here. Wow, what a goldmine of information! I knew there had to a place out there on the interwebs where knowledgeable pellet people hung out. I guess this is it.

We bought our 23 year old home 3-1/2 years ago and it came with an EnviroFire EF-III Bayi, purchased in 1995. The previous owner left me the manual and receipts.

It's my first experience with a pellet stove, but I grew up mastering the art of campfires so flames and me get along pretty well. I don't know what's been done to service it prior to my ownership, but last year the igniter died and after a month of using newspaper (and those famous campfire skills) to start it, we sprung to have a local dealer come up and give it the works. I also had noticed one of the blowers was making that slight whine and I had that replaced as well. Total $700 or so.

The stove has been great, I guess, not much to compare to though. We put about a ton and a half through it each year. Last year I got Pinnacle which seemed fine, so I just took delivery of another ton.

And of course now it won't start.

Push the starter button and it comes on once and that's it. Blowers work fine, auger doesn't seem to go and there's no pulsing. The light comes on once and goes out. I tried crossing the red and white wires as the manual recommends and still nothing. Today I got a new start-up timer ($150 ), 15 minute as opposed to older 10 minute, and am confident I plugged it in properly. And no change,
light comes on once and that's it.

So might I have a bad timer? Can I test for continuity? What else could it be? The troubleshooting stuff always stops at that point as if that's the final solution.

BTW, in my research I found this most excellent pictorial for these Enviro's that I hadn't seen here. It's called C-10800 Instruction PELLET Service Manual 2 of 2.pdf and can be found on Enviro's website.

Thanks for any advice.

ChuckD

 

[nailed_nailer]

Chuck,

I have the little brother to your EF-3.

If the auger isn't turning I think you might be having an exhaust vacuum problem.

On the left side of your stove (when you are facing it. There are two Torx screws one about 1" in and down from the top right of the panel and one under the magnetic trim plate in front.

Remove them and the side will hinge out. You have to remove the damper knob) You should see a tube (mine is red in color) about 1/4"-3/8" in diameter. One side goes to the firebox on the right. The other end goes to a vacuum switch. Sometimes fine dust gets in there and causes problems. Pull off the tube at the switch and really clean it out. Light compressed air cans work great.

Also, you might as well clean out all the dust inside the stove. And since you have the side open you might as well remove the exhaust blower and really clean it too (I take mine outside and blow it clean with compressed air) Just be careful with the mineral wool gasket. Your stove will love you for it.

If everything else in the stove is working I'll bet it is a vacuum problem. The stove won't turn the auger (to feed pellets) if it thinks there is a blockage in the exhaust path.

Your manual will tell how to re-attach the tube.

If you PM me an e-mail address I can send you the technicians guide to your stove. It has all the ins and outs of your stove.

Good Luck,
---Nailer---

 

[ChuckD]

Thanks for the reply, n_n.

Nope. No change. Took the hose off and blew it out, replaced it and same problem. Understand that it's not even pulsing, the green light comes on once when the button's pressed and then goes out and nothing else. The blower's running but I don't hear any auger activity.

Is this possible a switch problem? I can't say we've always just pressed momentarily and not held it down for a couple seconds, especially when this problem started. After the fact I learn you're not supposed to do this.

I will PM you for that manual, thanks again.

C.

[edit] Also I tried bypassing the vacuum switch with no success.

 

[hearthtools]

could be the auger timer and it could be the Dial O fire as they call it

that two part manual you downloaded it has step by step instruction on how to test both with a meter

Explanation on what the two parts do

the auger timer (blue cube)
this timer give power to the auger for 1 second or 3 seconds if it is a newer timer. the time will be on the label of the timer and most I have seen will have it written on the top of the timer with a sharpy when they tested it at Enviro. (they test everything)

the Dial O fire this controls the Time between feeds. as you turn the knob it changes the Ohms and thus changed the delay time between feeds
but the time the power to the auger always stays the same with the auger timer.

 

[ChuckD]

Hey, I think that's a Bingo.

I connected the two posts on the Dial o Fire switch per the docs, plugged it in and hit the start button and it started it's thing.

Good thing too, I ordered a new switch today thinking that even if it wasn't the solution, the newer three second feed time would help the fire. This being an older model it had the one second timer and sure enough we saw wildly fluctuating fires. Two birds with one stone, as they say in Spain.

Thanks for the help guys, I've passed on this site to our local Enviro dealer, Adirondack Woodstoves, who've also been great to work with.

C.

 

[hearthtools]

Hey, I think that's a Bingo.

I connected the two posts on the Dial o Fire switch per the docs, plugged it in and hit the start button and it started it's thing.

Good thing too, I ordered a new switch today thinking that even if it wasn't the solution, the newer three second feed time would help the fire. This being an older model it had the one second timer and sure enough we saw wildly fluctuating fires. Two birds with one stone, as they say in Spain.

Thanks for the help guys, I've passed on this site to our local Enviro dealer, Adirondack Woodstoves, who've also been great to work with.

C.

did you order the switch (dial O fire) or a timer?
the timer controls the 3 second feed time. the switch controls the delay of feed time.

 

[ChuckD]

Uh, great.
I did the bypass documented of the blue box right above the start-up timer. Jumpered the two posts in the upper left corner, plugged it in, pushed the button and it took off pulsing (and feeding pellets).

So I guess the timer's something different? I didn't see any mention of it in the docs so I assumed they were one in the same.

Guess not, eh?

 

[hearthtools]

Uh, great.
I did the bypass documented of the blue box right above the start-up timer. Jumpered the two posts in the upper left corner, plugged it in, pushed the button and it took off pulsing (and feeding pellets).

So I guess the timer's something different? I didn't see any mention of it in the docs so I assumed they were one in the same.

Guess not, eh?

PRODUCT: Enviro EF 2/3 Dial a Fire 115 V
EF-044 --

PRODUCT: Enviro EF 2/3/4/Solas 3 sec auger timer blue cube
EF-036

 

[ChuckD]

Nope, problem is I didn't read carefully enough. I definitely bypassed, and ordered, the EF-036, I just misread the doc as to what it was.
Thanks again!

 

[HakunaMatata]

I think its your Dial A Fire. My timer went out and it would not turn auger at all even with the pins connected on the timer. If you jumped the pins and it went full speed you need a DialaFire for sure. Im no expert, first post here. I just restored and rebuilt one. I hope you can return your possible unneeded part.

I needed a timer and got one for $50 although you probably don't need this part im listing it for future readers. My dealer wanted $145 forget that. Its a 1Sec? Why do they have 3 and 1 Sec? wouldn't the 1 sec on be better because it allows a finer adjustment?

(broken link removed to http://controlsourceintl.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=367)

Shipped fast. No problems.

 

[hearthtools]

I think its your Dial A Fire. My timer went out and it would not turn auger at all even with the pins connected on the timer. If you jumped the pins and it went full speed you need a DialaFire for sure. Im no expert, first post here. I just restored and rebuilt one. I hope you can return your possible unneeded part.

I needed a timer and got one for $50 although you probably don't need this part im listing it for future readers. My dealer wanted $145 forget that. Its a 1Sec? Why do they have 3 and 1 Sec? wouldn't the 1 sec on be better because it allows a finer adjustment?

(broken link removed to http://controlsourceintl.com/scripts/prodView.asp?idproduct=367)

Shipped fast. No problems.

here is the problem with the 1 second timer
1 second is not enough on time for LONGER pellets to feed. uniformly ON LOW FEED
what happens is on lower feed settings. DELAY BETWEEN FEEDS is the auger will only be on for 1 second and if your pellets are over and inch long one or two might drop with each feed or none at all. and with the LONGER NO FEED TIME THE PELLETS WILL BURN UP then a whole group of pellets will fall at once and smother out the small fire in the burn pot.
they changed to the 3 second timers on all production stoves about 7 years ago because of this. so the 3 second timer allows your stove to be burned on low for long times with out any problems.
this also gives the stove a higher BTU rating because it will feed more pellets on high also

 

[ChuckD]

Indeed, to both posts.
As a technical person by nature, I'm embarrassed that I didn't realize I WAS bypassing the Dial a Fire and that was the problem...

BUT,

We ran it last night for a couple hours with the new timer (1 sec. feed upgraded to new 3 sec. feed) with the jumper in place, so basically full bore, and the quality of the fire was 100% better. In fact we wondered if it may have not been too big as we watched flames lick the top of the firebox. That absolutely never would've happened previously. The stove was always run full on and even then we sometimes watched the flame nearly burn out as another clump of pellets fell on it. Now I'll be turning it down a bit when the dial a fire comes. I can see how the BTU rating would increase, not sure how safe that would be though.

So, I don't consider the unneeded auger timer as waste, and I recommend it for anyone with the older style timer.

 

[HakunaMatata]

Thanks now I understand why the difference. I will try and keep an eye out for short pellets. Im about to buy the Ligenics hardwood for 269 Ton. Do you know if they are long? Dum question because I will rip a small hole and take a peek anyway. Thanks for letting me know. My camera broke I wish I could post my setup and get some tips. My dial A fire I run at 2/3rds for whitest flame on some 4 year old cheapo home depot pellets. If I run under glass gets brown and barely a flame mabie a nice flame for 2 min in every 10 min. Now past 2/3rd 3/4 the way up the flames are totally in the heat exchangers and stove gets too hot I consider overkill. I just run it then shut it off then run and shut it off. I hope new pellets fixes this. Im totalaly impressed with my stove last year I spent over $3000 in LP on a steam boiler in a 3500SQ home.. Im about to save 50%. I haven't ran furnace once. I have a great floor layout for the stove and a wood stove in basement. Im about to save 50%. Im excited. Although I guess it goes like this If I take care of my stove it will take care of me.

 

[gutterboy2ca]

ChuckD, if you do a search here you'll find i too had basically same prob.My Enviro EF-3 is 1999 Model, had the 1 sec timer but was still functionable.Prob i had was stove would not stay running below 10 o'clock position,and would constantly go out on us in middle of the nite.After buying a new 3 sec timer and installing it, the stove runs like a champ,just remember to close the Air draft almost clear in to get it to stay running on lowest setting, and turn your convection Fan speed down to about 50%, should do her just Fine.As for Pellet Brands, i haven,t found anything yet the EF-3 will not burn,no Bridging or clogging of any type,even with the Comfy cozy crap pellets that are up to 2 inches in lenth.. Good Luck,
To Give to a Good Home(Used 1 sec Timer,) Lol..