Jotul and installation advice

[unit40]

I have a Jotul F 3CB, new, and I have a few questions.

Has anyone ever used the rear vent option? I'm worried about the knockout shattering the entire stove!!

I want to use 24 gauge stainless stovepipe with a barometric damper. The pipe will run at about a 45 degree angle to the left, up from the rear vent to my masonry thimble, using a 90 degree elbow at the stove exit, and a 90 degree elbow at the thimble. The distance is about 40 inches. Is that OK? I see stovepipes usually running either verticle or horizontal, but never any angled installations. My manual sais to limit horizontal runs to 36". Is this considered a horizontal installation?

My stove will be located down in the basement "man-cave" where I currenty had a Waterford Leprechaun. I have all the clearances I need. It is that my chimney runs up through the center of the house. It goes from the basement, through two floors and the attic. The draft is incredible, especially when it is windy. My Jotul 3cb that has been installed in my livingroom fireplace will run hot even when turned down all the way. So I am concerned that my basement installation will get too much draft, so I thought that a barometric damper would be fool-proof.

Does this sound OK?

 

[stoveguy13]

I have a Jotul F 3CB, new, and I have a few questions.

Has anyone ever used the rear vent option? I'm worried about the knockout shattering the entire stove!!

I want to use 24 gauge stainless stovepipe with a barometric damper. The pipe will run at about a 45 degree angle to the left, up from the rear vent to my masonry thimble, using a 90 degree elbow at the stove exit, and a 90 degree elbow at the thimble. The distance is about 40 inches. Is that OK? I see stovepipes usually running either verticle or horizontal, but never any angled installations. My manual sais to limit horizontal runs to 36". Is this considered a horizontal installation?

My stove will be located down in the basement "man-cave" where I currenty had a Waterford Leprechaun. I have all the clearances I need. It is that my chimney runs up through the center of the house. It goes from the basement, through two floors and the attic. The draft is incredible, especially when it is windy. My Jotul 3cb that has been installed in my livingroom fireplace will run hot even when turned down all the way. So I am concerned that my basement installation will get too much draft, so I thought that a barometric damper would be fool-proof.

Does this sound OK?

the run is fine but stay away from the barometric.

 

[unit40]

I also have a tee-cover in case I don't want to use the damper....but what issues do you think I will have with the barometric damper?

 

[stoveguy13]

they are not listed to use with the barometric. tee

 

[unit40]

They do mention in the manual to use a "butterfly damper" for excess draft, so i assumed a barometric damper was included. I should consider installing one in the pipe then?

 

[stoveguy13]

Cant hurt if you ever need to use it you have it.

 

[Corie]

You shouldn't use a 90 degree elbow coming out of the rear of the stove, it should be a tee.

Also, why are you rear venting and then going up and out? Why not use a 45 degree bend off the top vent?

 

[unit40]

I wanted to use the rear vent so that I could use the top of the stove for a steamer/cooking surface if need be. Now why shouldn't I use an elbow? Is it unsafe for some reason?

 

[BrotherBart]

I have opened up one rear flue exit and one side exit on F3CBs. I had the same concern the first time. Piece of cake. Smack the middle of the knock-out with a hammer and magic occurs.

You do still have the block-off that came with the top plate of the stove don't you?

Use the tee like Corie suggests. Lot easier to clean the chimney without having to dig the crap off of the top of the baffle afterward.

 

[unit40]

Yes I still have the plate, this stove is brand new. I have another 3CB in my livingroom fireplace. It is top vented into a stainless flex-pipe. I think I know what you mean regarding the accumulation on the baffle. I only get it during the summer/off season. So the tee suggestion is really to help with the clean-out? I'll be brave with the knockout. I'll make sure my thumb is right in the middle of it when I swing the hammer so I don't miss....Any other thoughts on a baro-damper?

 

[BrotherBart]

Never used a baro. I have the plain old run of the mill six buck flap type damper in my pipe. Works great except for getting in the way cleaning.

As to the accumulation on the baffle you should be getting it every time you punch a brush down that liner.

 

[unit40]

I have a chimneysweep do the cleaning. Everytime he has come out, commented that the chimney is very clean and did not need a cleaning, though he would brush it anyway. The 3CB must burn hot and clean, and the center chimney must aid it in some way too. I have only been burning 3-4 cords a season so far. My conscern on the baro is if it draws too much cooler air. Thats why I have the tee cover. I'll try running the stove without the baro-damper and see how it goes this fall.

 

[begreen]

I have a Jotul F 3CB, new, and I have a few questions.

Has anyone ever used the rear vent option? I'm worried about the knockout shattering the entire stove!!

I want to use 24 gauge stainless stovepipe with a barometric damper. The pipe will run at about a 45 degree angle to the left, up from the rear vent to my masonry thimble, using a 90 degree elbow at the stove exit, and a 90 degree elbow at the thimble. The distance is about 40 inches. Is that OK? I see stovepipes usually running either verticle or horizontal, but never any angled installations. My manual sais to limit horizontal runs to 36". Is this considered a horizontal installation?

My stove will be located down in the basement "man-cave" where I currenty had a Waterford Leprechaun. I have all the clearances I need. It is that my chimney runs up through the center of the house. It goes from the basement, through two floors and the attic. The draft is incredible, especially when it is windy. My Jotul 3cb that has been installed in my livingroom fireplace will run hot even when turned down all the way. So I am concerned that my basement installation will get too much draft, so I thought that a barometric damper would be fool-proof.

Does this sound OK?

I had the 3CB and set it up for rear-venting. You are right, it's a bit disconcerting to knock out that back plug. But it went ok. Follow instructions and be prepared to give some mighty slams with the hammer. It worked as advertised, no collateral damage. You'll need a grinder or a rough metal file, semi-round to smooth out the opening before attaching the start collar. You'll also have to be very certain that the top is put back on correctly and squarely or the stove won't work correctly.

I had a manual draft damper on my stove's stack and used it regularly. No big deal and was quite effective. Without it, the stove was a times difficult to slow down.

 

[unit40]

I had examined the air-inlets on my older 3CB. When closed all the way down, they are still open somewhat. Although very little, you can still see light through them. I thought maybe I had a loose gasket, or the ash pan door wasn't sealing, or something. I think I'll try my 3 pound sledge hammer. I'll take the door off first, without losing that washer. I just want to make sure the way I want to pipe everything in is OK. Also, the stainless pipe may not fit inside that adapter collar provided with the stove. I think I may have to bolt it directly to the stove. I think that collar is for standard black crimped stovepipe, and the stainless I had in mind has flared/expanded female ends and straight male ends.

 

[unit40]

Ok guys, I'm still a little feeling left in the cold here.

Manual says I can use a butterfly damper, but I'm not sure if a barometric damper qualifies as a butterfly damper or not. Manual doesn't specifically state not to use a barometric one. Is it a safety issue, i.e. chimney fire would suck the draft right up the stack, or is it something else?

Not quite sure why I shouldn't use a 90 degree elbow off of my stove, other than the cleaning issues. Still wondering whether it is a safety issue or not.

And does a 45 degree angle run of stovepipe qualify as a horizontal, vertical, both , neither ? Kind of confusing to me.

Plus, I have to run 6 inch pipe into....on to..... a 7 inch increaser to fit my 7 inch thimble opening.

Please keep the comments coming You guys have got me thinking about this....I can't wait to start burning and it's still August! Sort of like painting the snowplow and replacing the hoses in the middle of summer.

 

[begreen]

They're not the same thing. A barometric damper is better for a furnace or perhaps a coal stove. On a woodstove it will introduce a percentage of cool air to reduce draft. You want to keep the smoke going up the stack hot to keep creosote down. Stick with a simple butterfly damper if needed. Though with the two 90's it may not be necessary.

How tall is the masonry stack you are connecting the stove to? Is it interior or exterior? Is it the only stove or appliance on the stack? What is the interior dimension of the flue tile?

As to the pipe, are you using single or double wall? There is not a safety issue with rear venting the stove. Believe me, Jotul wouldn't sell it as an option if there was.

As to the 45 degree run, try it. Should work.

 

[unit40]

Thanks for all the comments.

My chimney runs right up the center of the house. It has two flues in it, but I'm not sure of the size, I need to hunt down the woodstove permits I have from the fire dept. to find out. But my fireplace woodstove uses one, and the man-cave uses the other. As far as the height, the stack must run about 4 stories if I add the basement, 1st and 2nd floors, and attic.

I will be using single wall, stainless pipe.

And as far as the cooling effect of the damper, I agree about that. Just worried about the non-cat tendency to like to burn hot.

 

[Corie]

If you have a wood stove which is only emitting say, 1.5 grams of matter per hour which includes creosote, ash particles, etc. Even if you were able to make all 1.5 grams condense on the walls of the chimney because of the cold air entering at the barometric damper, it still wouldn't amount to a hill of beans. And to make all 1.5 grams condense you have to induce a lot more than just a squirt of 70 degree air.

I'm just saying that barometric dampers, for some unknown reason, have a really really bad reputation around here and they really do a nice job. Please don't take it like I'm aiming at you BeGreen or anyone else, I'm just saying in general, they have worked pretty good on all of the stoves I've used them on.

I'd be putting one of my new stove installation, but I've only got about 13 feet of stack, so I highly doubt I'm even going to have enough draft.

But a butterfly damper will also do a fine job for you and is a little less unsightly and is certainly safer in the unlikely event that you have a chimney fire.

 

[unit40]

My thoughts are this,

I'll hook up the tee with the barometric damper. I'll run the stove with the damper removed and capped off to see how it performs. If it then seems as though I will need it, I'll use it. If the stove runs fine, I'll eliminate it altogether, or try a butterfly, in-the-pipe style. But I think it might take a good part of the season to see what will work best. I have never used a baro before so maybe I can adjust it so it opens only under the most extreme conditions, i.e. blasting winds, freezing cold, blizzard like nights.... Only time will tell.

 

[begreen]

Corie, maybe you are correct, but aren't you often burning coal ? And wouldn't a 30+ft stack naturally be a bit cool at the top? What if the wood is not so well seasoned, and maybe the stove is putting out like 12+ gms per hour?

With the long length of stack on that stove, I would be surprised if it doesn't need some sort of throttle once it gets hot. Personally, I prefer the manual control of the butterfly damper. But if you have multiple people running the stove, perhaps the barometric will work better for you. If you install one on the 45 degree run, be sure to set the damper section level.

 

[unit40]

Although I'm somewhat new to woodburning....this will be my 8th year coming up...... I only will burn seasoned wood. I'm trying to read as much as i can about it. But the gms per hour on the stove is a mystery to me. All I can say is other than first start up, there has never really been any smoke coming out of the stack....unless the wife realizes I'm coming home from work and she frantically stuffs a few logs in the stove, I can see some smoke coming out..

what do you guys think of my chimney? Does it seem like it would create some good draft? I know that the flues are two different sizes. The fireplace woodstove flue is larger than the one I'm planning on using for this installation. I'll try to hunt down the specs...

 

[elkimmeg]

code issues witha baro that can be back drafted with a gust of wind at anytime and yes the rock an roll during wind.
Unless that stove is tested and listed for that Baro damper then it can not be used Before I would allow one I would require documentation, that is is a tested approved design.

In a cellar with other fuel burning appliances probably close to the stove in the negative pressure zone I would think twice as that baro could act are the pressure nuetralizing valve and back draft. I think you will find a wood stove has to have a sealed venting system. I may be wrong here but unless documentation is provided I will stick to they are not a tested listed use.

 

[begreen]

We'll need the flue size to comment. If it's worked well with the Waterford, odds are it will continue to work well. Can you post a shot of the current installation?

In general, the installation should be made as safe as possible to cover the variety of situations it will see over its lifetime. When a stove is installed, an inspector can't predict who is going to run the stove or what quality fuel will be burnt. For example, what if the house is sold in a few years?