Jotul F45 Greenville (or something bigger/smaller) for new construction?

[FletchJordan]

Hi all-

First-time stove buyer here, looking for advice.

We'll be building a new house in a rural part of southern upstate NY this fall/winter. Plan is for 22x40, approx. 1500 sqft. of floor space -- 2/3 of the house will have a second story, 1/3+ will be an open plan kitchen/dining/living with ~20' cathedral ceilings. The house should be pretty well sealed and insulated, and we anticipate doing full electric with a mini-spilt heat pump for HVAC, though my understanding is that the house may still be under-heated once outside temp drops below ~20deg. We'd like to add a wood stove for supplemental heat, ambience, and backup (incl. cooking) in case of power outages. The plan is to locate it in a corner of the big room (so, yes, at the far end of the house, under the 20' ceiling), but we'll have a ceiling fan above it to keep the heat circulating. I realize that the rooms on the far side of the house may not benefit enormously from the stove.

So, my question: I really like the reviews and design of the Jotul f45, and at 58k btu/1800 sqft, it seems like it could be the right size for us. But I also wonder if it might actually be overpowered, given that it will primarily be used as supplemental heat rather than our sole heat source? Of course we can turn the heat pump thermostat down if nec, but the electric isn't a huge cost to begin with given than we plan to have solar panels on site.

If the Jotul f45 isn't the right size (too big?), can anyone suggest something a bit smaller but still solid? I'm leaning towards non-cat for simplicity and ease of maintenance.

Thanks!

 

[begreen]

To start I would invest in the best mini-split or heatpump system for cold climate operation like a Mitsubishi HyperHeat. The Green Room forum on this site has many discussions on this topic. The F45 should work out ok. You don't need to burn large, full fires. If the house is well insulated, then when the weather is in the 20s a morning or evening fire with a partial load may suffice, particularly if there is decent solar gain during the daytime. With a cathedral ceiling, ceiling fans will be needed to circulate hot air that will want to stratify near the peak. Regardless of stove choice, be sure to have a good amount of fully seasoned firewood on hand. Poorly seasoned wood greatly degrades stove output and performance.

This area can get very cold. How frequent are power outages in this area?

 

[FletchJordan]

To start I would invest in the best mini-split or heatpump system for cold climate operation like a Mitsubishi HyperHeat. The Green Room forum on this site has many discussions on this topic. The F45 should work out ok. You don't need to burn large, full fires. If the house is well insulated, then when the weather is in the 20s a morning or evening fire with a partial load may suffice, particularly if there is decent solar gain during the daytime. With a cathedral ceiling, ceiling fans will be needed to circulate hot air that will want to stratify near the peak. Regardless of stove choice, be sure to have a good amount of fully seasoned firewood on hand. Poorly seasoned wood greatly degrades stove output and performance.

This area can get very cold. How frequent are power outages in this area?

Thanks for your thoughts. Winter temps can easily drop below 0 deg for days on end, though winters have also been getting milder, so projecting out 20-30 years into the future, who knows. Power outages happen from time to time in the winter, though usually only with lots of snow, and again, snowfall is declining somewhat, too. Most folks have backup diesel generators to get them through the outages, and we'll probably need one, as well, at least until solar battery storage becomes truly affordable and the utility companies permit grid-tied systems to island.

Main thing with the stove and the cathedral ceiling is that, in the outlier event that we don't have any power at all, then we won't be able to run the fan to prevent the heat from pooling near the peak. But, if I have a slightly oversized stove that I can crank if nec, I'm hoping the heat will move through the house even with that issue. We do have very good south-west exposure, so should benefit from solar gain during the daytime.

I will check out the heat pump forum -- need to have that conversation with our builder soon.

Thanks, again.

 

[begreen]

Your best investment will be in reducing the building envelope heat loss. Do some serious research on reducing glazing losses as well. In the event of an outage, you may only need to power the essentials of refrigeration and some lighting and the ceiling fans. That can be done with a much smaller and efficient generator. Consider propane as an alternative to diesel. Without power, the stove will keep the 2nd story plenty warm if it has a loft balcony.

 

[FletchJordan]

Your best investment will be in reducing the building envelope heat loss. Do some serious research on reducing glazing losses as well. In the event of an outage, you may only need to power the essentials of refrigeration and some lighting and the ceiling fans. That can be done with a much smaller and efficient generator. Consider propane as an alternative to diesel. Without power, the stove will keep the 2nd story plenty warm if it has a loft balcony.

Thanks. Do I need to be concerned about creosote buildup if I'm regularly under-firing the Jotul? (and yes, there will be a loft balcony).

 

[begreen]

Thanks. Do I need to be concerned about creosote buildup if I'm regularly under-firing the Jotul? (and yes, there will be a loft balcony).

That would be running the stove improperly. The firebox should get hot enough to support secondary combustion. This can be done with a partial load of fuel. The mass of the cast iron jacket will absorb a lot of the radiant heat. This helps greatly reduce room temperature swing. As the fire dies down the cast iron will slowly release the heat gained from the short fire. This is sometimes called the pulse and glide method. It's the way we run our big stove when temps are above 40. With a high-efficiency heat pump in a well-insulated house, this threshold will be at a lower temperature. Until you have the heat loss calculations done on the house at -5º the actual stove output requirements will be speculative at best. This should come before picking out a stove.