Just pulled the trigger...

brenndatomu

Minister of Fire
Aug 21, 2013
4,816
NE Ohio
You really dodged a bullet by coming here and asking about that Fire Chief/Shelter furnace first let me tell you!
Congrats!
 

dchance

New Member
Jan 14, 2020
44
MO
I appreciate all the help here. I am thinking I did OK. the Fire Chief had such a great price locally. $2k for the large one so it was tempting. Glad I researched and educated myself. My only worry now is ease of installation and working with that plenum....
 
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3fordasho

Minister of Fire
Jul 20, 2007
878
South Central Minnesota
I appreciate all the help here. I am thinking I did OK. the Fire Chief had such a great price locally. $2k for the large one so it was tempting. Glad I researched and educated myself. My only worry now is ease of installation and working with that plenum....
Ditto on the dodging a bullet - wasn't there just a recent post about one of the larger shelters/fire chiefs having all kinds of warped firebox parts and the fan not working correctly? I still marvel how well my shop Tundra was working the other day in the shop. Too bad the heat load there is really too much for it and a 153k btu boiler will go in it's place. It can maintain pretty well but it's tough when the shop starts out a 35F and I want to bring the temps up quickly.
 
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dchance

New Member
Jan 14, 2020
44
MO
delivered and currently sitting in my garage......going to be very interesting trying to get 832lb of furnace down basement steps and into my basement.....not looking forward to it.
 
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Gearhead660

Member
Dec 20, 2018
236
WI
delivered and currently sitting in my garage......going to be very interesting trying to get 832lb of furnace down basement steps and into my basement.....not looking forward to it.
When I took my Tundra down the basement, I took as much off as I could to lighten it. Doors, bricks, blower, side panels, etc. anything that was screwed/bolted on.
 
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laynes69

Minister of Fire
Oct 2, 2006
2,483
Ashland OH
Take off the doors, and take the bricks out.
 

brenndatomu

Minister of Fire
Aug 21, 2013
4,816
NE Ohio
Don't be afraid to build a custom skid or some other type of apparatus to facilitate the move...I have a walkout basement, but I have installed 5 different wood burners (four furnaces) over the years and did them all by myself...and the one was bigger/heavier than the HP is! As was already mentioned, take everything off that you can, and work smart, not hard...mechanical advantage is your friend! (and pizza/beer will buy you a few more friends usually too! ;lol)(but then you may have to deal with people that just want to hurry up and get done so to go home! I would rather do it by myself then deal with "bull in a china shop" types)
You can do a lot with blocks and levers...and winches...I love winches (or even just a "come-a-long") and pieces of pipe to act as rollers, or even "slides" if needed.
Oh, and that weight must be shipping weight, with the pallet/crate...the HP is not that much bigger than the Tundra, and I found the Tundra easy to move around by myself...500 and some lbs off the crate (Tundra)...it felt much lighter than the Kuuma 100, let me tell ya!
 

dchance

New Member
Jan 14, 2020
44
MO
Don't be afraid to build a custom skid or some other type of apparatus to facilitate the move...I have a walkout basement, but I have installed 5 different wood burners (four furnaces) over the years and did them all by myself...and the one was bigger/heavier than the HP is! As was already mentioned, take everything off that you can, and work smart, not hard...mechanical advantage is your friend! (and pizza/beer will buy you a few more friends usually too! ;lol)(but then you may have to deal with people that just want to hurry up and get done so to go home! I would rather do it by myself then deal with "bull in a china shop" types)
You can do a lot with blocks and levers...and winches...I love winches (or even just a "come-a-long") and pieces of pipe to act as rollers, or even "slides" if needed.
Oh, and that weight must be shipping weight, with the pallet/crate...the HP is not that much bigger than the Tundra, and I found the Tundra easy to move around by myself...500 and some lbs off the crate (Tundra)...it felt much lighter than the Kuuma 100, let me tell ya!
Yeah, I have a plan mapped out in my mind...==c but we know how that usually goes....
My neighbor will be coming over with his large tractor. I plan to slide it down the steps on a ramp made of lumber and lower it with the tractor. When it gets to the bottom I will put piano dollys under it to wheel it in the door. Sounds easy......hope it works out that way
 

Gearhead660

Member
Dec 20, 2018
236
WI
Yeah, I have a plan mapped out in my mind...==c but we know how that usually goes....
My neighbor will be coming over with his large tractor. I plan to slide it down the steps on a ramp made of lumber and lower it with the tractor. When it gets to the bottom I will put piano dollys under it to wheel it in the door. Sounds easy......hope it works out that way
That's roughly what I did. Had the Tundra on a pallet and slid it down some 2x4s on the stairs. Used a winch to slowly lower it down.
 

dchance

New Member
Jan 14, 2020
44
MO
I am at a stall.....furnace is still sitting idle in the basement. Still trying to figure out install.....
 

brenndatomu

Minister of Fire
Aug 21, 2013
4,816
NE Ohio
I am at a stall.....furnace is still sitting idle in the basement. Still trying to figure out install.....
Any particular issues that you wanna bounce off the crew here?
 

dchance

New Member
Jan 14, 2020
44
MO
Well sure......

backstory---
I purchased the drolet heatpro after research and reading....much of it here. Well, with my install I am wanting to forego the plenum they say is necessary and plug the stove into where my old existing wood furnace is. It is nearly a perfect fit for an even swap.

I had a local HVAC pro come out and take a look. He ended up declining to do the work. his 2 reasons
1. even though he was 100% sure in his opinion it would operate just fine and as intended installed like i mentioned, he said the manuf. was very specific on the install to manf. specs which led to #2
2. since they do so little wood burning work he doesn't carry insurance for wood burning therefore thought it best to decline to avoid a "worst case scenario" situation.

So now to decide......
1. I have another HVAC guy (does side work) that would come out and do it and it would be reasonable priced. OR
2. call an insured professional and pay a probably $1500 for install......


maybe I am overthinking.....but his thoughts on "worst case scenario" got me thinking. What if the house did burn down....would that give my home ins. a reason to not cover? That would be catastrophic
 

brenndatomu

Minister of Fire
Aug 21, 2013
4,816
NE Ohio
maybe I am overthinking.....but his thoughts on "worst case scenario" got me thinking. What if the house did burn down....would that give my home ins. a reason to not cover? That would be catastrophic
Well, yes, possibly. But if there is a fire caused by the wood furnace it is going to be caused by the chimney most likely, unless there is something really stupid done with the plenum/ducts!
Put an emergency heat dump door on the plenum...worst case scenario the door drops open and heats the basement instead of the house.
I have one that is still in my plenum that was on my Yukon Husky wood/oil before...same size as the Kuuma, so I reused the plenum since it is a highly custom piece. Yukon still sells the EHD https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiezu338vTnAhWBv54KHay-DM0QFjABegQIBBAB&url=http://store.yukon-eagle.com/safety-heat-dump/&usg=AOvVaw09z-JMSucTf-LYAsCsOsw7
Can you advertise for a tin knocker, get somebody to do this as a side job?
As I recall, it looked to me like using the Drolet plenum would not be hard to do...and could mostly/completly be done with off the shelf parts...could be a DIY job then...this stuff really isn't that hard. Between what can be bought off the shelf, and what can be made easily with a few basic tin knocker hand tools, a guy could/can do this all DIY no problem...as far as the "know how"...youtube university!
I have no doubt that my Kuuma install would have cost a couple grand if I had hired it out...and would have probably had to argue about if it was gonna fit/work or not...and then get iffy workmanship to boot! I DIY'd if for a couple hundred in materials, ended up with a professional looking end product that even the insurance guy was impressed by.
 

dchance

New Member
Jan 14, 2020
44
MO
I have no doubt how to do it. and it really won't be that hard. but that would be without the factory plenum and using my existing plenum. If I cant do that it becomes a much more involved job. Just seemed weird why an HVAC professional would opt out of what I think is an easy install. Is it even possible for him to be liable if something happened? If so, then how do DIYers retain coverage?
 
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Bad LP

Minister of Fire
Nov 28, 2014
1,118
Northern Maine
I have no doubt how to do it. and it really won't be that hard. but that would be without the factory plenum and using my existing plenum. If I cant do that it becomes a much more involved job. Just seemed weird why an HVAC professional would opt out of what I think is an easy install. Is it even possible for him to be liable if something happened? If so, then how do DIYers retain coverage?
It's not weird at all.

I have two HVAC/Plumber companies in two locations. One is Wentworth Institute (Boston MA) educated and very bright to the point there is nothing he can't do. The other is a solid guy but skidish at times. #1 redesigned a very large hot water loop feeding the fan coil units because #2 wasn't sure on what to do. OK, fair enough. Come job time #2 says he doesn't want to do the job because he didn't design it and if it doesn't work right I'm going to blame im not the designer. I tried to explain if the drawing was followed then what's the issue? It can't fall on him.
In short... No dice. I hire #3 to do the piping per plan and it works perfectly.

A guy I worked with on the local FD continues working for the department after I left. He becomes the fire prevention officer. He still had a nice little skid steer business and did nice work with hydro seeding. I'm building a subdivision also in the the town that we both live and worked in and I'm also building a spec house. I knew him long before I joined the FD and he had also worked for me. Obviously the house plans get approved by the FD for smoke and CO detectors and we follow the plan to the letter.
I'm prepping other lots for buyers by stripping and stock piling loam and I need to stabilize the piles. Ask the guy if he wants some no bid T&M work and his reply was I can't it's a conflict of interest. I'm still good friends with all the guys and I ask the Deputy Chief about this and he says he's nuts. There is in no way any conflict.
I hire another guy who is absolutely thrilled working for me as he knows he gets paid within 10 days with no questions asked. He did a fair amount of work for me.
 

dchance

New Member
Jan 14, 2020
44
MO
It's not weird at all.

I have two HVAC/Plumber companies in two locations. One is Wentworth Institute (Boston MA) educated and very bright to the point there is nothing he can't do. The other is a solid guy but skidish at times. #1 redesigned a very large hot water loop feeding the fan coil units because #2 wasn't sure on what to do. OK, fair enough. Come job time #2 says he doesn't want to do the job because he didn't design it and if it doesn't work right I'm going to blame im not the designer. I tried to explain if the drawing was followed then what's the issue? It can't fall on him.
In short... No dice. I hire #3 to do the piping per plan and it works perfectly.

A guy I worked with on the local FD continues working for the department after I left. He becomes the fire prevention officer. He still had a nice little skid steer business and did nice work with hydro seeding. I'm building a subdivision also in the the town that we both live and worked in and I'm also building a spec house. I knew him long before I joined the FD and he had also worked for me. Obviously the house plans get approved by the FD for smoke and CO detectors and we follow the plan to the letter.
I'm prepping other lots for buyers by stripping and stock piling loam and I need to stabilize the piles. Ask the guy if he wants some no bid T&M work and his reply was I can't it's a conflict of interest. I'm still good friends with all the guys and I ask the Deputy Chief about this and he says he's nuts. There is in no way any conflict.
I hire another guy who is absolutely thrilled working for me as he knows he gets paid within 10 days with no questions asked. He did a fair amount of work for me.
Ok so my biggest worry is lets say my house burns down due to wood furnace....If I installed the furnace or a buddy who does HVAC, would my ins company give me fits due to who installed the furnace??? of course this is the "worst case scenario"........so can it be avoided?
 

Bad LP

Minister of Fire
Nov 28, 2014
1,118
Northern Maine
Ok so my biggest worry is lets say my house burns down due to wood furnace....If I installed the furnace or a buddy who does HVAC, would my ins company give me fits due to who installed the furnace??? of course this is the "worst case scenario"........so can it be avoided?
I fully understand where you are coming from.
I don't have a furnace but I did at my last home in Maine. I don't recall a single safety on it.
How do you think fire can escape the furnace and get into the flue? Serious question.
Now a boiler on the other hand can blow up.
Edit:
What kind of building codes and inspections does your location have? The only thing we "can't do" is our own plumbing. Run wires, bang nails to your hearts content.
Have you asked your insurance company? Mine only cared that wood was not the primary heat source. I even changed agents and that was the only thing that came up.
 
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brenndatomu

Minister of Fire
Aug 21, 2013
4,816
NE Ohio
Have you asked your insurance company? Mine only cared that wood was not the primary heat source. I even changed agents and that was the only thing that came up.
Yup, I'd call your insurance guy and ask some "in theory" type of questions...like "if I installed a new wood furnace" and "what do you need to see then afterward"? I'd think they would just be glad to be getting rid of that old smoke dragon for a brand new modern clean burning model! (clean burn means less chances of creosote in the chimney...the main reason that wood heaters "cause" fires...plus the HP has all new safety controls on it too)
I just switched insurance company's recently and they just want to know who did my install, and after I said I did, they just needed to know the manufacturers CTC specs, and then some pics of my install (I suspect they just wanted to see if it looked like I had actually followed the CTC guidelines...and if it looked like a "quality install" overall)
 

Socratic Monologue

Burning Hunk
Dec 2, 2009
194
WI
Well, yes, possibly. But if there is a fire caused by the wood furnace it is going to be caused by the chimney most likely, unless there is something really stupid done with the plenum/ducts!
Put an emergency heat dump door on the plenum...worst case scenario the door drops open and heats the basement instead of the house.
I have one that is still in my plenum that was on my Yukon Husky wood/oil before...same size as the Kuuma, so I reused the plenum since it is a highly custom piece. Yukon still sells the EHD https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=2&cad=rja&uact=8&ved=2ahUKEwiezu338vTnAhWBv54KHay-DM0QFjABegQIBBAB&url=http://store.yukon-eagle.com/safety-heat-dump/&usg=AOvVaw09z-JMSucTf-LYAsCsOsw7
Can you advertise for a tin knocker, get somebody to do this as a side job?
As I recall, it looked to me like using the Drolet plenum would not be hard to do...and could mostly/completly be done with off the shelf parts...could be a DIY job then...this stuff really isn't that hard. Between what can be bought off the shelf, and what can be made easily with a few basic tin knocker hand tools, a guy could/can do this all DIY no problem...as far as the "know how"...youtube university!
I have no doubt that my Kuuma install would have cost a couple grand if I had hired it out...and would have probably had to argue about if it was gonna fit/work or not...and then get iffy workmanship to boot! I DIY'd if for a couple hundred in materials, ended up with a professional looking end product that even the insurance guy was impressed by.
Yukon does not sell the heat dump anymore. I tried to buy one from them.
 

brenndatomu

Minister of Fire
Aug 21, 2013
4,816
NE Ohio
Yukon does not sell the heat dump anymore. I tried to buy one from them.
Really? Wonder why they still have them on their site then?
I seen what looked to be the same one somewhere else recently...I need to see if I can find that again.
 

brenndatomu

Minister of Fire
Aug 21, 2013
4,816
NE Ohio
Here it is...