Kuuma vf100 vs maxcaddy

[Chad_lew]

hi, I have been reading a lot lately about these two furnaces and they both sound amazing. I am struggling to decide between the two of which route to go. I’d like to know the cons of both units if there are any.... I have read a lot about all the pros haven’t heard anything bad about either and it’s making the decision hard.

We just recently bought a 3000sqft home in central Ohio that was built in the mid 90s so insulation should be pretty well. Also the home has no chimney at this time so I’ll be installing one to the specs of whichever furnace I decide to get.

One more thing is I moved from a smaller home where my Daka wood furnace would cook you out of the house and I’m kind of weird and like that heat to get up to the mid to upper 70s. Will either of these two units do something like that with a home that size in this climate or will they struggle to maintain on the super cold days and nights? I want wood to be my main source of heat and don’t want to have to purchase any other fuel so I want the furnace to be able to keep up at all times.

Ps there is always someone home so burn times aren’t really concerning to me as much although that is a nice feature I’m mainly wanting very hot heat.

 

[brenndatomu]

Welcome Chad...I'm in Wayne county...you?
Both good furnaces...the Max probably has just a bit more raw horsepower if pushed on a super cold day...but not enough to knock the VF100 out of the running IMO. I'm sure you will still need to have backup heat for the bank and/or ins co to be satisfied...and it'd be foolish to not have it working in case something happened and nobody is home for a long time...both these furnaces will knock your heat bill down by 99% if not 100% on most years.

 

[Chad_lew]

Welcome Chad...I'm in Wayne county...you?
Both good furnaces...the Max probably has just a bit more raw horsepower if pushed on a super cold day...but not enough to knock the VF100 out of the running IMO. I'm sure you will still need to have backup heat for the bank and/or ins co to be satisfied...and it'd be foolish to not have it working in case something happened and nobody is home for a long time...both these furnaces will knock your heat bill down by 99% if not 100% on most years.

I’m right on the morrow/Richland county line so not very far at all. Is there any stove available that would just heat me right out of the house? I’m not really worried about wood consumption I have plenty of it. I’m not leaning away from those two I just want to check all my options before making a big purchase like this. I’m also not against a owb, however I am against their prices for a new one plus installation. I just don’t see the benefits with them with there prices being so high still?

 

[sloeffle]

I’m right on the morrow/Richland county line so not very far at all.

I'm actually on the Morrow / Delaware line. I have an Amish buddy that isn't too far from you.

If you don't care that much about wood consumption and are looking for "raw heat" then the Max Caddy would probably be the winner. I think the Caddy is a little bit cheaper too. If you care about wood consumption and money is not an object then I think the Kuuma wins.

Our house is 2200 sq ft and our Caddy keeps up fine other than on really ( negative temps ) cold days. Even when the temp is really cold the house will still be in the high 60's.

 

[Chad_lew]

So is the max caddy still good on wood consumption just not as good as the kuuma? Or does it go through a lot of wood? Again I don’t really care just want to know what I’m getting before hand. I love the sounds of everything about the kuuma I’m just affraid it’s not gonna be enough heat?

 

[JRHAWK9]

IMO, neither (or any EPA furnace for that matter) will be able to heat/maintain upper 70's during very cold days/nights. 3,000 SF...what about volume? 8' or 9' ceilings? vaulted? Basement? Air volume means more than floor area when it comes to heating.

Those old school furnaces are capable of putting out a ton of heat, at the expense of wood consumption, smoke and creosote.

 

[laynes69]

I'll say the max caddy should keep you in the upper 70's with a newer home....even at 3000 sqft. We have 2500 with 10' ceilings both up and down and we keep mid to upper 70's most of the winter with the Caddy. We are in ashland county, so not too far from you. The Max Caddy operates from demand, you want 75 turn up the stat and it will do it. It has a large firebox for alot of reserve.

 

[Chad_lew]

It’s got 10 ft ceilings in the basement and 8 or 10 on the next two floors not exactly sure on those. Do these two units radiat a bunch of heat to keep the basement warm? My old house was a ranch and the burner alone would keep the basement super warm which heated my hardwood floors which kept the house nice and warm I’m hoping to have that same effect on this house warm the floors to warm the house? That’s my main reason for sticking with a indoor burner is I love the radiant heat it puts off it’s a much warmer feeling than a forced air furnace. Do the gasification units give you that effect?

 

[JRHAWK9]

yes, they both will radiant heat. My basement is heated solely with the radiant heat off of my Kuuma.

The Max Caddy will be capable of putting out more MAX BTU's. Like Laynes said, it's damper is tied to your house thermostat. So when it calls for heat the damper opens. The downside of this is as soon as that damper opens you lose efficiency and burn times. During real cold nights when the house is constantly calling for heat with the thermostat set to 78°, your damper will remain open. This will chew through wood, sending more heat to the house but at the same time also more heat up the chimney. Don't expect to make it 10 hours on a single load. You will have to re-load during the night sometime. The upside is it will be capable of higher BTU's, as long as you don't mind reloading more often and not having as clean of a burn.

The Kuuma also makes use of a thermostat, however it's solely to kick the blower from low to high and visa versa. When the stat calls for heat the blower goes to high. The burn is controlled by the computer and it stays in it's "maximum efficiency" state at all times dependant on what level of burn you have the computer set at.

 

[Chad_lew]

yes, they both will radiant heat. My basement is heated solely with the radiant heat off of my Kuuma.

The Max Caddy will be capable of putting out more MAX BTU's. Like Laynes said, it's damper is tied to your house thermostat. So when it calls for heat the damper opens. The downside of this is as soon as that damper opens you lose efficiency and burn times. During real cold nights when the house is constantly calling for heat with the thermostat set to 78°, your damper will remain open. This will chew through wood, sending more heat to the house but at the same time also more heat up the chimney. Don't expect to make it 10 hours on a single load. You will have to re-load during the night sometime. The upside is it will be capable of higher BTU's, as long as you don't mind reloading more often and not having as clean of a burn.

The Kuuma also makes use of a thermostat, however it's solely to kick the blower from low to high and visa versa. When the stat calls for heat the blower goes to high. The burn is controlled by the computer and it stays in it's "maximum efficiency" state at all times dependant on what level of burn you have the computer set at.

Do both these furnace have a low temp shutoff say the fire does die out in the middle of the night will the blowers keep pushing air or will they shut themselves off?

 

[JRHAWK9]

Do both these furnace have a low temp shutoff say the fire does die out in the middle of the night will the blowers keep pushing air or will they shut themselves off?

They will both cut power to the blower as soon as plenum temps drop below whatever temp you have the low limit switch set at.

 

[brenndatomu]

Honestly it almost sounds like there isn't a "wrong" decision here, between these two...

 

[Chad_lew]

Honestly it almost sounds like there isn't a "wrong" decision here, between these two...

You are correct! That’s what’s making this such a hard choice

 

[Highbeam]

The efficiency of the kuuma is only somewhat better but the real advantage is the low emissions. With all of the testing being required these days we now have the actual efficiency ratings to compare.

The real disadvantage to the kuuma is high cost and no viewing window!

The caddy line (heatpro and heatmax)is leaps and bounds ahead of the old Daka type furnaces in both efficiency and emissions.

 

[laynes69]

I'm not proud of it....but I've gone to bed with the door cracked open with coals in the morning still, and also had a very heavy heat load and still saw 6 hours plus of good heat output on a few cu.ft of wood. For those who haven't operated or owned a pre EPA furnace (tractor supply special), they could easily burn thru 6 cu.ft of wood in just a few hours. Even burning 3 cu ft of wood in 6 hours with an EPA furnace is just a fraction of the wood. So to say EPA furnaces can chew thru the wood.....well its relative to what you've operated. On mild days or when the heat load isn't too bad, its 8 hour burns or more. The Caddy line puts out a fair amount of heat from the glass (bonus....fire view!), but also puts out a good amount of heat in the ducting due to the heat exchanger. The efficiency numbers on the Caddy line are very good. Either way, both are light years ahead from the good ol' days.

 

[Chad_lew]

Hey so I wanna throw a wrench in my idea, I have been reading a lot and talking to some installers a couple guys brought up the ds stoves king kozy 400. Now looking and trying to find info it seems it has the same efficiency rating as the max caddy around 85% now I know the kuuma is way up there on efficiency but I’m just afraid it won’t keep up on the real cold nights and Weeks we have sometimes. What’s your guys thoughts on the ds stoves?

 

[brenndatomu]

So is the max caddy still good on wood consumption just not as good as the kuuma? Or does it go through a lot of wood? Again I don’t really care just want to know what I’m getting before hand. I love the sounds of everything about the kuuma I’m just affraid it’s not gonna be enough heat?

If you just want heat and don't care about consumption...I have another option for ya...Yukon Husky (mine, the one in my avatar) I am going to remove it this fall and it still works fine...it WILL keep you warm! It is setup for wood/coal/fuel oil right now, but I have the gas/propane burner for it too if you had access to either one of those for your backup fuel. Make ya deal...

 

[Chad_lew]

If you just want heat and don't care about consumption...I have another option for ya...Yukon Husky (mine, the one in my avatar) I am going to remove it this fall and it still works fine...it WILL keep you warm! It is setup for wood/coal/fuel oil right now, but I have the gas/propane burner for it too if you had access to either one of those for your backup fuel. Make ya deal...

What are you switching to? And pm me a price on what you were thinking for it?

 

[brenndatomu]

What are you switching to?

I'll shoot ya a PM...can't divulge the latest activity here at the skunkworks to the general public just yet...

 

[laynes69]

Let me tell you, when I was younger I didn't care how much wood I burned...hey it was free! Year after year burning 8-12+ cords, struggling to keep up, I was burning what I cut trying to keep a stockpile. I realized our home was inefficient (mid 19th century Victorian) and tightened things up. When I purchased an EPA furnace I was no longer a slave to the burner. I'm now over 2 years ahead and I cut at my leisure. I can cut enough wood in a day to last a month, before maybe a week. You may enjoy it now, but eventually it gets old.

 

[Chad_lew]

I'll shoot ya a PM...can't divulge the latest activity here at the skunkworks to the general public just yet...

This sounds very interesting

Let me tell you, when I was younger I didn't care how much wood I burned...hey it was free! Year after year burning 8-12+ cords, struggling to keep up, I was burning what I cut trying to keep a stockpile. I realized our home was inefficient (mid 19th century Victorian) and tightened things up. When I purchased an EPA furnace I was no longer a slave to the burner. I'm now over 2 years ahead and I cut at my leisure. I can cut enough wood in a day to last a month, before maybe a week. You may enjoy it now, but eventually it gets old.[/QUOTE

This is very good advice and something I will strongly consider

 

[Highbeam]

Look at the actual efficiency ratings of each furnace, be sure they are the same type of efficiency (there are a few marketing tricks being used) and then calculate what that 5% (or whatever) actually gets you. I suspect that moving among the epa approved furnaces doesn’t bring a large efficiency penalty. What, half a cord? Big deal. Moving from old school 50% efficiency to 80% was a big deal.

I run a highly efficient woodstove in my home and it did save me a cord of wood per year over my previous stove. I appreciate high efficiency but moving between modern epa appliances does not save half of your wood!

 

[STIHLY DAN]

Let me tell you, when I was younger I didn't care how much wood I burned...hey it was free! Year after year burning 8-12+ cords, struggling to keep up, I was burning what I cut trying to keep a stockpile. I realized our home was inefficient (mid 19th century Victorian) and tightened things up. When I purchased an EPA furnace I was no longer a slave to the burner. I'm now over 2 years ahead and I cut at my leisure. I can cut enough wood in a day to last a month, before maybe a week. You may enjoy it now, but eventually it gets old.

I agree, i am 10 plus years ahead.. my problem now is wood rot..

 

[JRHAWK9]

I agree, i am 10 plus years ahead.. my problem now is wood rot..

as am I, but I haven't encountered any wood rot yet though. Are you top covered off the ground?

 

[brenndatomu]

I agree, i am 10 plus years ahead.. my problem now is wood rot..

Stihly's back!
Better get that soft wood under control...they say that's the first thing to go...or is it the memory, can't recall which now...